not sure i am following, are folks saying that they have maneuver templates that also have range notches cut into them? cause the acrylic ones i have don't. i mean WHY would they have this feature?

No reason other than it looks a lot cooler design-wise. My latest from cog o' two have scum markings - they rock.

Asmodi: nothing really supports your claims that certain owners act that way... In fact it's been stated many times here that if asked people will just agree on using the same template set.

Again, it's an internet-thing... Loads of people use marked templates. It's never been a problem before and the rules have always been clear: if any concerns just use the same set.

@ Scurvy Lobster - You are 100% correct that this is an internet thing. However it was an unknown internet thing up until a few days ago.

No one is making these claims. People are simply stating the facts that they could be used for that and they are 100% correct in saying that.

But what you can also be 100% certain of is that now its "out there" then it will be used for "That" purpose.

These are not "my claims". These claims were made weeks ago.

All I am saying is if you are going to tournaments leave your Cogs at home.

@ Negative09 - What range ruler are you talking about? The straight 5?

I have 3 cores sets and none of my Straights have markings anywhere other than the top and bottom.

I would be interested to see a picture of yours.

@ Scurvy Lobster - You are 100% correct that this is an internet thing. However it was an unknown internet thing up until a few days ago.

No one is making these claims. People are simply stating the facts that they could be used for that and they are 100% correct in saying that.

But what you can also be 100% certain of is that now its "out there" then it will be used for "That" purpose.

These are not "my claims". These claims were made weeks ago.

All I am saying is if you are going to tournaments leave your Cogs at home.

This is not new... I have seen this subject discussed here before - a long ago though. Markings are a part of templates - even the stock cardboard, so let's get over it.

I have been at loads of tournaments with my templates. Will continue to do so. If you can't handle certain templates then ask to use the same set and get over it. Done.

Or you use the original ones.

I don't carry the original ones any more - they warp too much sadly.

@ Negative09 - What range ruler are you talking about? The straight 5?

I have 3 cores sets and none of my Straights have markings anywhere other than the top and bottom.

I would be interested to see a picture of yours.

he's talking about the range ruler. the one with divisions for range 1/2/3

Oh right...No one cares about the Range Ruler unless the COG ones have mm and cm meaning they can also be used as a normal Ruler. (That was a joke)

@ Scurvy Lobster - I have 3 sets. 1 has your name on it but yeh they do warp really bad but still no reason for buying COG ones. Normal acrylic just as good.

not sure i am following, are folks saying that they have maneuver templates that also have range notches cut into them? cause the acrylic ones i have don't. i mean WHY would they have this feature?

Well, up until today, I thought it was purely esthetic, but it looks like some people doesn't know their distance enough yet so could use them to cheat!

Here is a link to their site if you want to look for yourself:

http://www.cogotwo.com/gaming/gaming-ruler-set-orange-detail

All I am saying is if you are going to tournaments leave your Cogs at home.

Or, bring them anyway, because you certainly not paid 25$ per set to leave them at home, and IF you meet a player that has a problem with them, use theirs for the match as per the tournament rule under Range Ruler, Tokens, and Maneuver Templates.

If the Cog user refuse to oblige, then you are in your right to point him with your finger while yelling: CHEATER!!

Huh? Where has range come in to it? I thought you were all talking about movement templates having notches to indicate the shorter movements, eg a five straight having a mark for the four, three, two and one points.

Oh right...No one cares about the Range Ruler unless the COG ones have mm and cm meaning they can also be used as a normal Ruler. (That was a joke)

@ Scurvy Lobster - I have 3 sets. 1 has your name on it but yeh they do warp really bad but still no reason for buying COG ones. Normal acrylic just as good.

its as applicable as the rest of the argument. you could 'pre measure' a 2 movement based off the range 1 increment fairly easily.

as for myself, the Applied perspective ones cost more to have the increments taken off, otherwise I would have bought a set without them.

if any concerns just use the same set.

I would add here that if one of you wants to use the official set that takes precedence, if there's any arguing such as "fine, we'll both use my unofficial ones".

Although personally I think everyone should have to bring an official set. Imagine I have a problem with somebody else's set (I can't imagine I would, but hypothetically) - why should I have to let somebody then mess up my official set just to stop them using their "cheaty" set?

Seriously, stop the cheat-naming here... That is REALLY ugly. I doubt anyone are using them for anything illicit AND you can measure with the stock one as well.

They are littered with star markings. It wouldn't take long for anyone dedicated to cheating to memorizing which stars point to certain lengths.

If markings are cheating then start by banning the ones from the core set.

Are we done?

Seriously, stop the cheat-naming here... That is REALLY ugly.

Thank you.

Being considered a cheater just because I'm using the only templates I found that had the Faction symbols on them at a reasonable price is not fun.

This game can be taken so seriously sometimes.

Also... It's not like both sides don't have access to the same information.

Frankly, anybody bad enough at the game that they think people can only judge a 2 straight using a template has bigger worries in a tournament setting....and thats ignoring the fact that as pointed out, you can do it with the official ones anyway. And its not even more difficult....just learn which star sits at speed 1, which is at speed 2, etc.

Cog templates look awesome, and i will use mine. IF people dont like it, i'll use the official ones.

And i bet i can guess a speed 2 with both.....or without them.

My question is this: What would you even be capable of "pre-measuring" since you can't lay the template down until you're moving your ship anyway? The only thing I can conceive of you pre-measuring is target lock or range 1/2 but you'd be able to do that with a regular 5-straight template anyway.

there's probably a number of nefarious ways but with being a simpleton and not having a thought process that works in such ways the one that springs to mind for me is k-turning...

Even still, you'd have to remember for next round anyway. Without any landmarks on the board, this would be nulled, no?

I'm right with you here on this one. I really don't see how having marks on your maneuvers helps. Can't pre measure anyways so the only benefit would be for the next round maybe for asteroids or flying off board movement. I mean really like plenty of others have said you could look at the marks on the out of box templates and do the same. I see no problem. I could see someone losing and throwing a fit complaining about the marks on them how they helped their opponent tho. So personally I wouldn't use them just so I don't have to hear someone whine about it when the lose. I wouldn't have a problem with someone using them tho.

Frankly, anybody bad enough at the game that they think people can only judge a 2 straight using a template has bigger worries in a tournament setting....and thats ignoring the fact that as pointed out, you can do it with the official ones anyway. And its not even more difficult....just learn which star sits at speed 1, which is at speed 2, etc.

I'm with you on the "these people are almost certainly not cheating" thing, but to suggest that memorizing one particular star from a field of identical stars is just as easy as seeing a notch seems absurd to me.

I get that most people using these templates have no intention of ever cheating, but this whole "you can do it with a standard template" argument is complete nerf poop.

mazz0: it's doable - why even doubt that. Just use the same template side and orientation every time and it's simple. May not be as easy with stock templates but still - you could easily do it.

Have you seen the lengths people go to in a lot of games to cheat?

I wish it wasn't true, but i assure you that memorising a stars position really wouldnt be a stretch.

Either way, UK nationals approached Cog for prize support from what I hear, so it's clearly not a major concern among better players.

but this whole "you can do it with a standard template" argument is complete nerf poop.

You could do it quite easily, all you'd need to do is put a mark on one side of the templates then mark a star at range 1, 2, 3, ect... Wouldn't even have to memorize anything.

Star marking isn't necessary. Visual memory would do as well.

but this whole "you can do it with a standard template" argument is complete nerf poop.

You could do it quite easily, all you'd need to do is put a mark on one side of the templates then mark a star at range 1, 2, 3, ect... Wouldn't even have to memorize anything.

Did a naughty light-bulb just appear over your heard?

There is also ways to verify the distance with the range ruler, should we do something about it too?

-Range 2 is a straight 5, so if you're in range 3 of your opponent, you'll be able to make your 4 k-turn.

-Range 1 is a straight 2.5, so if you're in range 2, you'll be clear for your 1 straight, for the straight 2 remember that:

-A straight 1 is exactly 1 small ship base, so if there was more than half a base over the range 2 mark, you'll clear the straight 2, if there was more than a base length before the range 3 mark, you'll clear the 4.

if someone really needs help with his distance, there is a lot of way already in the game to help. I really don't see what marks on a straight maneuver can do to help even more, it's not like it's hard to already mentally fraction it in segments anyway. Where most people have problem is with the bank and hard maneuvers, the straights move are pretty easy to guess, and the mark on the straight do nothing to help them with that.