Hi,

It feels to me like the natural counter to Fat Han should be a TIE bomber list, but the way that the bomber works in the game right now doesn’t lend itself to that, especially with single fire weapons against a target that can regen shields every turn or boost out of the firing arcs of the slow turning bombers.

For that reason, I'm going to try out some house rules with a buddy next week. I wanted to share them with you to see what your feedback was.

Heavy Ordnance – TIE Bomber Title

Torpedoes, missiles and bombs receive +1 attack die against large base or epic ships.

Small base ships roll 1 extra agility die when attacked with your secondary weapons.

Payload – 2 points

Torpedo, missile or bomb upgrade

When instructed to discard a card to perform a secondary weapon attack of this payload type (i.e. torpedo, missile or bomb), you may instead discard this card in its place.

The first title change would increase damage against large base ships, while also coming with a significant penalty against small base ships. The increased agility is supposed to be thematic – your heavy ordnance is easier to dodge by the more agile and smaller fighters, while the larger ships are an easier target for your heavy loadout.

The payload card encourages bombers to be equipped with a decent loadout. It isn’t free, so on cheaper munitions like the Flechette torpedoes, you don’t save any points at all. However, on the more expensive upgrades like advanced proton torpedoes, taking a second torpedo of the same type is significantly cheaper. It doesn’t allow each ordnance to attack twice (so no 4 point, 4 Flechette torpedoes attacks) but does give some optionality to those second slots that may not otherwise be used.

Thoughts?

How many points for Hvy Ord? The whole concept sounds like a lot of fun. Great Idea man!

I've often thought about a cool title for Tie bombers and Advanced.( I guess we wait for the Imperial corvette). Looking forward to see how your idea pans out. Good Luck!

This is very intriguing! I like the mechanics of payload. Seems too cheap though.

If there's a cost for the Hvy Ord Title,(say, 0 or 1), Payload..perhaps, 3?..4? Total--->5. intriguing indeed.

Thanks for the input and feedback!

0 Points for the Heavy Ord Title

My thoughts were that the increased die against a large ship is offset by the decreased chance of hitting smaller ships. When you look at the point cost of large ships with turret weapons, they are generally right on the money (or slightly below!). So, if you field a large ship, you are getting a large number of very efficient points. Contrast this with the bomber which is overpriced by at least 2, up to 5 points for Major Rhymer.

Payload I think should be 2 points. If this ends up too cheap it could maybe go to 3 points.

The reasoning I think it should be 2 is that you fill a secondary slot. The current house fixes for the TIE bomber are to lower the points cost by about 2 points and then reduce the cost of missiles and torpedoes by 1 point for the more expensive upgrades.

The payload card forces you to pay the initial points cost, e.g. 4 for concussion missiles. This is still a big outlay (perhaps overpriced by 1 point). It then lets you shave 2 points off if you purchase the payload card. The net effect is the same as lowering the concussion missile card cost by 1 point each time (total cost in both scenarios is 6 points), but the payload card is worth less than the lower concussion missile cost. There is always the chance that you won't be able to fire twice, so the second slot should be cheaper than a primary slot. Most people won't field two torpedoes or missiles because TIE bombers get taken out quickly when they are seen as a threat.

From the above, I think that for 4 point ordnance, the card is slightly overpriced against house rules of -1 point cost for ordnance. For 5 point ordnance, the cost is likely right on the money (instead of paying -1 and -1, you would pay 0, -3). For 6 point ordnance, its good value (-1, -1 against 0, -4).

For me, that is a good solution for the TIE bomber. It encourages you to take a decent loadout and stretch for the more expensive upgrades. You are still a high points cost target that may only get 1 shot off, but if you survive you will do some damage with the payload card. It also doesn’t change the meta by making single slot torpedo or missile slot ships more powerful (including large base turreted ships).

Alternative 3 point cost:

Payload – 3 points

Torpedo or missile upgrade slot

When instructed to discard a card to perform a torpedo or missile attack, you may instead discard this card in its place.

Changes:

+1 point cost

+ lets you discard this card for a torpedo or missile attack. For the TIE Bomber, you could purchase assault missiles for 5 points, then 3 payload cards for 9 points = total cost 14 points (instead of 20 if you could ever do this, or 16 if the house rule was -1 point for ordnance)

- no bomb upgrade slot

I don't like this as much as the 2 point cost card, but it is an alternative viewpoint and gives you some additional optionality.

Alternative 3 point cost:

Payload – 3 points

Torpedo or missile upgrade slot

When instructed to discard a card to perform a torpedo or missile attack, you may instead discard this card in its place.

Changes:

+1 point cost

+ lets you discard this card for a torpedo or missile attack. For the TIE Bomber, you could purchase assault missiles for 5 points, then 3 payload cards for 9 points = total cost 14 points (instead of 20 if you could ever do this, or 16 if the house rule was -1 point for ordnance)

- no bomb upgrade slot

I don't like this as much as the 2 point cost card, but it is an alternative viewpoint and gives you some additional optionality.

How are you labeling the Payload card? I don't know how 3 of the payload cards could fit on a single bomber, as I'm seeing it as a modification.

As a missle or torpedo upgrade card, similar to the Bomb Loadout (0) card for the Y-wing's torpedo slot. I wouldn't want to use the modification slot, as you want to save that for customizing the ship.

For example, the TIE Bomber with the 2 point cost card (the one I will be using in my house rules), you could do this:

Torpedo upgrade: Proton torpedoes (4)

Torpedo upgrade: Payload - torpedoes (2)

Missle upgrade: Cluster missiles (4)

Missle upgrade: Payload - missles (2)

With a gamma squadron pilot, it would be 30 points without any modification upgrade. Still very pricey, but less than the 34 it would cost without the card.