Optimizing Tarn/R7

By PhantomFO, in X-Wing

The Tarn/R7 combo is one of those I want to try, but just haven't been able to get him on the table yet. However, for those who've tried it, I'm curious how you handled the defensive target lock, especially against enemies that have a focus token. Do you force them to reroll all hit and focus results, hoping to see another blank or two in there? Do you leave the focus as is, and hope you're forcing them to spend the token and making them easier to counter-attack?

Or is it more situational (reroll focus if you don't have a shot, keep the focus if you plan to attack them)?

Just curious exactly what the best tactics are going to be for when I finally get around to flying him.

if they have a focus token, and you know them to be a more offensive player, then a focus result is as good as a hit. Might as well force that one to reroll too. At the same time, odds of rolling blanks aren't very good anyway...it's what, 3 hits, 1 crit, 2 focus, 2 blanks? So only a 25% chance on each die, whereas 75% of it is gonna be bad for ya.

Well once you use R7 to reroll, they can't reroll those dice again.

For me the real trick is what to do with the blanks. You stand the chance of having them come up as something other than a <blank>, but if you don't roll them then they roll them with the TL.

if they have a focus token, and you know them to be a more offensive player, then a focus result is as good as a hit. Might as well force that one to reroll too. At the same time, odds of rolling blanks aren't very good anyway...it's what, 3 hits, 1 crit, 2 focus, 2 blanks? So only a 25% chance on each die, whereas 75% of it is gonna be bad for ya.

Weird way of looking at it. The way I see it, if they have a focus, there is a 12.5% chance it will be worse and a 25% chance it will be better. For all the rest, no difference.

Well once you use R7 to reroll, they can't reroll those dice again.

For me the real trick is what to do with the blanks. You stand the chance of having them come up as something other than a <blank>, but if you don't roll them then they roll them with the TL.

I feel like of course you don't roll them. If you roll them, they save their TL and you did the exact same thing they were going to do. Leave them as blanks, make them spend their lock, and they will get a randomized result just as you would have, but at the cost of their Target Lock.

Edited by GiraffeandZebra

if they have a focus token, and you know them to be a more offensive player, then a focus result is as good as a hit. Might as well force that one to reroll too. At the same time, odds of rolling blanks aren't very good anyway...it's what, 3 hits, 1 crit, 2 focus, 2 blanks? So only a 25% chance on each die, whereas 75% of it is gonna be bad for ya.

Yeah, and that's where I'm debating the situation. There's a 50/50 chance that the focus could turn into a straight hit/crit. I could easily put myself in a situation where I've gone from forcing my opponent to spend a focus token to giving them all hit/miss results.

If my opponent rolls blanks, I still think the best option is to leave them as a blank. If they want to spend the TL to reroll them, then that's fine because it generally means they won't have that TL next turn.

If they've got a Focus then you probably need to view any [eye] results just like you would hits.

The most probable exception is if they just have the one [eye] result but no actual hitting shots backing it up. Here I'd just ignore R7 to force him to spend the Focus to get the [hit] because if you reroll the die for him there is a 50% chance you save his Focus but only a 25% chance that you turn it into a [blank] to save you completely.

When you get more that two non-blank results the issue becomes more complicated. With two non-blank results I'd say you can leave the Focus alone unless both are Focus. With three or more you probably should reroll all the [eye] results as you're likely to turn something back into an [eye] or a [blank].

If your opponent is attacking you with a Focus and Target Lock token on you then don't do their job for them.

Edited by StevenO

If you have someone who is planning on shooting at the same target later in the turn, it is worth it to make him use his Focus token to turn those into hits. I say leave the Focus.

It's almost a moot point, though. I've found few people wanting to take shots at him when there are other targets on the board.

I've found few people wanting to take shots at him when there are other targets on the board.

Which is quite frankly a mistake. The fewer ships you have to shoot at him, the better he becomes.

5+ ships shooting at him means odds are he'll die, 1 or 2 however will have trouble killing him.

I'll give you my first hand experience. I used Tarn/R7 in last year's Regionals, and my opponent rolled 3 hits and 1 crit. I used R7 to have him re-roll all his dice, and it came up 4 blanks. Suffice to say, my opponent cursed under his breath...

Tarn/R7 is a pretty good end game ship, but it's always a gamble re-rolling dice.

But if you are able to make your shots more effective on the front end, then you can clear out the rest of his squad first and then swarm Tarn. It might take longer, but it can be done. I guess it really depends on what's in the rest of his squad.

If you fly Tarn with some offensive guys, you know that those guys will get shot down first. Let's take Wedge. If someone has the option to shoot at Tarn or Wedge, you know Wedge is going down. Same might go for Hobbie and stressbot. I'd be interested in seeing him in a list with Luke, though. Might be pretty cool.

It was posted in the 2015 Tournament results that someone took 1st place at a local event with:

Tarn w/ R7

6 x Bandit Pilots

I'll give you my first hand experience. I used Tarn/R7 in last year's Regionals, and my opponent rolled 3 hits and 1 crit. I used R7 to have him re-roll all his dice, and it came up 4 blanks. Suffice to say, my opponent cursed under his breath...

Tarn/R7 is a pretty good end game ship, but it's always a gamble re-rolling dice.

An amazing example of what can happen but always remember "results may vary." Consider a guy whose opponent rolls two [hits] and two [eye] results while holding on to a Focus token and the rerolls all of those dice with the end result being two [crit] and two [hit] results; R7 didn't do much there and actually made things even worse.

If you have someone who is planning on shooting at the same target later in the turn, it is worth it to make him use his Focus token to turn those into hits. I say leave the Focus.

It's almost a moot point, though. I've found few people wanting to take shots at him when there are other targets on the board.

Focusing down TaRn7 can be the smart play. Sure he can get a TL even time someone shoots at him but the R7 is limited to one use per turn.

But if you are able to make your shots more effective on the front end, then you can clear out the rest of his squad first and then swarm Tarn. It might take longer, but it can be done. I guess it really depends on what's in the rest of his squad.

If you fly Tarn with some offensive guys, you know that those guys will get shot down first. Let's take Wedge. If someone has the option to shoot at Tarn or Wedge, you know Wedge is going down. Same might go for Hobbie and stressbot. I'd be interested in seeing him in a list with Luke, though. Might be pretty cool.

It was posted in the 2015 Tournament results that someone took 1st place at a local event with:

Tarn w/ R7

6 x Bandit Pilots

The cool thing about Tarn, though, relative to other tanky, cheap ships (like Gemmer) is that he puts out the standard X-wing 3 dice that can be very painful if left unattended. Targeting him at all also carries the risk of his free target-lock remaining after a attack poor roll against him, which is not something some players want to chance if they're in his arc.

Giving the opponent a pair of unattractive targets (such as Tarn on one end, Biggs on the other) could do wonders for splitting damage across your squad.

One day, I'll put down Stress Wes variant # 3 (Wes, Biggs, Tarn, Bandit) and see if I can make it work. Biggs is a pain in the ass for swarms (a laser black hole at range 3) and turrets (will never not have a shot) which can either cover Tarn in the former case, or exacerbate how annoying he is in the later.

Edited by ficklegreendice

then you can clear out the rest of his squad first and then swarm Tarn.

That all depends on being able to kill off his other ships without losing many of yours. If you can make that assumption then odds are you'll win no matter what.

But if you lose 2-5 ships in the process you may find yourself facing Tarn with 2 shields vs 1 or 2 of your own ships. At that point you're going to have difficulty killing Tarn off.

An amazing example of what can happen but always remember "results may vary."

Yeah I've had Tarn give the guy better results more then once.

Edited by VanorDM

Or is it more situational (reroll focus if you don't have a shot, keep the focus if you plan to attack them)?

I've played a won a tourney with Tarn/6 Bandit's recently. Yes, it's highly situational to who you plan on attacking with Tarn. At least reroll the hits. I haven't had it come up to where I've considered rerolling focuses. If I did, I'd probably leave one or two depending on his # of attack dice.

Edited by MegaSilver

Here's how I think I would play it...

Blanks? Never re-roll them. There's a 75% chance you'll give him something better.

Hits and Crits? Always re-roll them. There's a 50% chance you'll give him something worse.

Focus results are more complicated. Couple cases to consider:

  • Opponent doesn't have a focus token? Don't re-roll them.
  • Opponent has a focus token?
    • Is Tarn going to die if opponent spends focus token? (a hull left, opponent rolled 3 hits/focus) Re-roll them, hope for the best.
    • Will the opponent be getting shot at later this round?
      • Yes: Don't re-roll them, tempt him to spend the focus token
      • No: Re-roll them, he'll spend the focus anyways, and you're twice as likely to get a blank than a crit

Another option is to re-roll all focus results except one. This is probably only a good idea in rare cases, but I could see it being a good idea sometimes.

For example, if the opponent is likely to get shot at later this round, and rolls a single focus result, no hits, he is unlikely to spend the focus token. However, if he rolls 3 focus results, he is likely to spend the focus and get 3 hits instead of keeping the token for defense. In this case, since I assume that he'll spend the focus token to get the 3 hits, I might re-roll 2 of the 3 results.

  • Worse case scenario? I roll 2 hits. The attacker might be tempted to spend the focus token for 3 hits and put one guaranteed damage on Tarn.
  • Average scenario? I roll a hit and a blank. The attacker might be tempted to spend the focus token, but I'll have a chance of blocking any damage with Tarn's 2 green dice.
  • Best case scenario? I roll 2 blanks. The attacker probably won't spend the token (so he'll have it for defense), but Tarn won't be taking damage either.

Running the numbers on this would be interesting...

Originally I flew 4 Blue squadron B wings each with advanced sensors. Then I swapped one of them for tarn with r7. I would typically save my focus for defense.

Against 2 ship builds it's pretty brutal, either they made the mistake of shooting at tarn and wasting a shot, or he happened to be the only one in range or something and they still wasted a shot.

Against gunner is when it starts to get rather difficult to judge.

Against gunner is when it starts to get rather difficult to judge.

Yep. In that case I usually try/hope to get them to 2 hits so I can try to block one. Best to take the 1 hit rather than them rerolling more hits on me and I can't do anything about it! lol

I won a store champ with tarn/r7, keyan/ptl, tala squad, and two prototype pilots/char. Nobody shot at tarn, the only time he died was when I accidentally flew him off the board. He's a solid 25 pointer in a rebel fleet!

If he's such an unattractive target, it might pay off to increase his offensive potential. Jan Ors or torpedoes, maybe with munitions failsafe.

If he's such an unattractive target, it might pay off to increase his offensive potential. Jan Ors or torpedoes, maybe with munitions failsafe.

part of that unattractiveness is his relative cheapness for his durability

Jan might be a way to go, but I wouldn't try loading Tarn with more upgrades. 3 initial dice already makes for a very solid offense

Edited by ficklegreendice

part of that unattractiveness is his relative cheapness for his durability

Agreed, the X-Wing is a very good ship offensively, it just lacks a bit in terms of defense and repositioning. Add a ton of upgrades to it and you make it a more attractive target.

The beauty of Tarn is he seems like a low priority target, but if you don't kill him fairly early he can win a game.

In the story tournament I played in, one game was my 4 X's vs 5 Z's and Jake Farrell. It ended up with 1 Z vs Tarn with 2 shields left. At that point the game was over, because there was no way possible for that Z to kill Tarn off first.

Jan might be a way to go

The nice thing about Jan is she can make anyone better, not just one ship. The bad part is she's a pretty big target. But when you can use her to give Wedge a 5 dice attack with a TL and Focus, it's just so much fun...

worth the points and others HATE to fly vs him normally. As you can keep moving the target lock if attacked by others. So they have to change target priority and try and plan on other shots as to not take the TL that is in arc of Tarn. I ran Biggs all the time prior, but for 25 points Tarn is the way to go. Forcing rolls has saved him so many times, from 3 hits to none, so nice, especially when you didn't take the lock, you took the focus, they gave you the lock!