I cannot wait to run:

N'dru w/Lonewolf, Cluster Missles, Hot Shot Blaster, Shield Upgrade

Pirates x5 w/Feedback Array.

I just don't want Fel to be the next Phantom with all those soon to be threads about how Soontir is overpowered/breaking the game/easy mode... Please... not him too...

I don't think that's going to happen, because I don't think it's the 4 green dice that is the problem with Phantoms*. The problem is the fact that they get to do so much of their movement selection in the activation phase, when the predicting of moves in the planning phase is such a big part of what makes this game fun. Autothrusters don't give ships any more movement selections in the activation phase.

*If four green dice were invulnerable then we wouldn't need Autothrusters to make Interceptors viable

I might have been misinterpreted here. I don't personally think that Fel is too good. Like it has been discussed earlier, there is many ways to counter him.

But, he's been here since wave 2 and a lot of very experienced player know how to play with him and work around his weaknesses. The only one that we couldn't really do something about was the turrets, a bad match-up or cold dice could ruin your tournament results. But now, thanks to autothruster, we can now enter a tournament with him without ''fearing'' the dreaded turrets with gunner (Note: I already do it and get good results, Autothruster can only make it better). That doesn't mean he's unstoppable, far from it, but I expect to see a lot more player feeling confident again to bring him along, because well, he's fun as hell to play.

So, my fear is more the reaction of the less experienced players going against him and get tabled by him. From my experience, I did it a couple of time, against less experienced player of course, get down to only Fel against all my opponent team and still take the win because I was able to dodge his arcs or stack defense when he could get a shot. And I'm far from the best player.

So: Fel played by an experienced player against one of lower skills might end up with the inexperienced player coming on this forum to whine about Fel because he was not able to take a shot. Some other inexperienced players that got the same experience come along and join the movement. Mass hysteria follow while we keep repeating to them that he's not invincible, that you need to prepare for him. But the inexperienced player want to play with what they want, not take some particular upgrades just because he might go against the Baron. The game is screwed and unbalanced, we need to find a fix to the interceptor, like taking 2 green to clear one stress or automatic crits against the Interceptors!... just an average day on the forum.

So, my fear is more the reaction of the less experienced players going against him and get tabled by him. From my experience, I did it a couple of time, against less experienced player of course, get down to only Fel against all my opponent team and still take the win because I was able to dodge his arcs or stack defense when he could get a shot. And I'm far from the best player.

o: Fel played by an experienced player against one of lower skills might end up with the inexperienced player coming on this forum to whine about Fel because he was not able to take a shot. Some other inexperienced players that got the same experience come along and join the movement.

Ah, I wouldn't worry about that

Both less experienced player posts and some worlds-tier player articles have been crying foul about phantoms since Wave 4 (and, far more legitimately, about ******* fat turrets) and what has that accomplished?

Well, autothrusters

Yeah, I can see that happening, I just don't think it'll happen (anywhere near) as often as with Phantoms, cos I think people have a good point with Phantoms (even if they're not OP) and they won't with Autoceptors.

How short is the shortest s-loop? If he can do a three (I imagine 2 is out of the question) then he'll still be able to do crazy manoeuvres, in a knife fighting way, and be within range one of an ally. As somebody said, more a cross between an Interceptor and a B-Wing than another lower-case i interceptor.

Edit: Forgot to say "Re: Xizor"

It is a three, according to the Google I just did

It is 3...so far

(can't wait for Tetran in a Star Viper)

How short is the shortest s-loop? If he can do a three (I imagine 2 is out of the question) then he'll still be able to do crazy manoeuvres, in a knife fighting way, and be within range one of an ally. As somebody said, more a cross between an Interceptor and a B-Wing than another lower-case i interceptor.

Edit: Forgot to say "Re: Xizor"

What I like about this thread is that I never really took the time to think about Xizor. There is so much good thing coming in wave 6 that some, like the IG-88, stole the show for me.

Now, having discuss it, I really can't wait to try the team I showed earlier and fly it in a chaotic way. Scums should not be organised anyway so screw formation flying! There will be white ships flying everywhere to take the hits for their Prince!

The lists I'm most looking forward to flying for Scum are:

1.

Boba Fett

[some upgrades]

A couple of Y-Wings with ICTs, to make sure he can always shoot, and get in close to, someone.

This could also work with Kath instead of Babo, with the ICTs keeping people in her read death arc. Mostly this is because I love Firesprays. There are also some very interesting HWKs I might consider over the Y-Wings, but I do hate flying HWKs...

2.

Three Starthrusters.

Might as well be Phantoms, you'll never have any idea where they're going to end up (although they will move first, which spoils it a bit ). Could be tempted just to take Xizor and surround him with Y-Wings or HKS. Y-Wings with ICT could be good again, both because their turret means the chaos style flying won't be a problem for them (helping them stay at range one of Xizor) and of course Ions because Ions. This is mostly because I think the Starviper is super sexy.

Given my ship tastes obviously my ideal squad would be Starthruster + Firespray, but how well would that work? Might not be bad actually...

some worlds-tier player articles have been crying foul about phantoms since Wave 4... and what has that accomplished?

Can you provide links?

There will be white ships flying everywhere to take the hits for their Prince!

don't you mean red ?

dont shoot me for a star trek reference!

I cannot wait to run:

N'dru w/Lonewolf, Cluster Missles, Hot Shot Blaster, Shield Upgrade

Pirates x5 w/Feedback Array.

The only thing I dislike with this build is that you have so many Pirates on the board that maintaining R2 with N'Dru is going to be tricky.

Which is why the version of that build that I'm looking at replaces N'Dru with Laetin A'shera in an HLC-equipped Heavy Scyk with either a Hull Upgrade or Stealth Device. Or just a naked Guri.

There will be white ships flying everywhere to take the hits for their Prince!

don't you mean red ?

dont shoot me for a star trek reference!

Given my ship tastes obviously my ideal squad would be Starthruster + Firespray, but how well would that work? Might not be bad actually...

For my part, I would pair the with a IG-88 because I'm a sucker for high maneuvrability ship but I could see it work with a Firespray

Boba + Stay on target + K4 droid + seismic charge or flechette torpedoes

Black Sun Enforcer + Autothrusters x2

Not at home, so I'm not 100% sure, but I think that's a perfect 100 pts team.

The trouble I have with the Agressor is that I think it's utterly hideous Mind you, I thought that before the HWK came out and I love that model (not so much the ship though).

I think starvipers will show up at first because people want to see what they can do, but will then disappear entirely from the competitive scene. With Virago, they're more similar to E-wings than anything else but the only competitive E-wing has higher PS and a better pilot ability than the vipers. FFG really dropped the ball here.

Guri ability is really nice, but she's hurt by her low PS. As for Xizor, I have a harder time with his ability: his ability ask you to pair him with some low cost ship like Z-95 or Y-Wing but his dial ask you to fly on your own and exploit your dial to the fullest to pull some tricks. So, I fell like Xizor will be like Brath, a pilot that you take mostly because of his PS because his ability won't be useful every game. Unless you decide to fly in formation, but I'm not sure the StarViper is really meant for formation flying. I'll definetely have to fly it a couple of games because I really want to love that ship, but I'm not impress by Xizor ability. Is it confirmed that the PS3 pilot doesn't have access to an EPT?

I disagree about the Starviper not being a formation flyer. Its 1 banks and 1-3 forwards are green. This is a formation flier if ever I saw one. Xizor is built to be the ship you can safely load up because he'll shed the damage. Pair him with some Y-wings and he will be a force!

Any ship can be a formation flyer, of course.

But with all the maneuver options the Star Viper has (hard 1, S-Loop, Barrel Roll, Boost, possibility to equip Advanced Sensor), I think it was meant as a sneaky flanker/knife fighter more than a ship that you'll limit to follow ships with a more generic dial. Just with the S-Loop, you'll break formation as soon as you do a k-turn.

So yeah, you could pair Xizor with a couple Zs and Y-Wings, but you will pay for a dial and action bar that you won't use to his full potential. I would have prefered to see him with an ability that would help him be a better flanker/close fighter than one that limit his potential.

While all ships CAN fly in a formation, those with 1 maneuvers do so better. This ship COULD be a flanker, but it's lack of diversity in green moves makes PTL an unattractive upgrade for this ship; as it would cause its movement to become predictable and easily blocked.

This is a leader's ship. It can deliver a big offensive punch and rely on the ships around it to keep it in the fight. What is the S-loop for? End game. When it comes down to a Viper verses one other ship, that maneuver will help give it an advantage.

Interceptors still won't be viable, even after Autothrusters. Soontir will remain the only representative of a dying religion. At the end of the day, it is still a ship with only 3 hull.

So is the TIE fighter, and Phantoms only have 4 hull. Proxy Interceptors + Autothrusters a few times before you dismiss the upgrade entirely.

I don't dismiss it at all, but it doesn't change the fact that the ship has three hull. They will now be class cannons with a little bit better Green Dice luck.

I think starvipers will show up at first because people want to see what they can do, but will then disappear entirely from the competitive scene. With Virago, they're more similar to E-wings than anything else but the only competitive E-wing has higher PS and a better pilot ability than the vipers. FFG really dropped the ball here.

Guri ability is really nice, but she's hurt by her low PS. As for Xizor, I have a harder time with his ability: his ability ask you to pair him with some low cost ship like Z-95 or Y-Wing but his dial ask you to fly on your own and exploit your dial to the fullest to pull some tricks. So, I fell like Xizor will be like Brath, a pilot that you take mostly because of his PS because his ability won't be useful every game. Unless you decide to fly in formation, but I'm not sure the StarViper is really meant for formation flying. I'll definetely have to fly it a couple of games because I really want to love that ship, but I'm not impress by Xizor ability. Is it confirmed that the PS3 pilot doesn't have access to an EPT?

I disagree about the Starviper not being a formation flyer. Its 1 banks and 1-3 forwards are green. This is a formation flier if ever I saw one. Xizor is built to be the ship you can safely load up because he'll shed the damage. Pair him with some Y-wings and he will be a force!

Any ship can be a formation flyer, of course.

But with all the maneuver options the Star Viper has (hard 1, S-Loop, Barrel Roll, Boost, possibility to equip Advanced Sensor), I think it was meant as a sneaky flanker/knife fighter more than a ship that you'll limit to follow ships with a more generic dial. Just with the S-Loop, you'll break formation as soon as you do a k-turn.

So yeah, you could pair Xizor with a couple Zs and Y-Wings, but you will pay for a dial and action bar that you won't use to his full potential. I would have prefered to see him with an ability that would help him be a better flanker/close fighter than one that limit his potential.

While all ships CAN fly in a formation, those with 1 maneuvers do so better. This ship COULD be a flanker, but it's lack of diversity in green moves makes PTL an unattractive upgrade for this ship; as it would cause its movement to become predictable and easily blocked.

This is a leader's ship. It can deliver a big offensive punch and rely on the ships around it to keep it in the fight. What is the S-loop for? End game. When it comes down to a Viper verses one other ship, that maneuver will help give it an advantage.

Since when PtL must be taken to be considered a flanker? The Starviper has all the tools available to be a great flanker. And if you're afraid about getting block, you can take Advanced Sensor and boost or Barrel Roll before you move.

So, I guess it's a matter of perspective. Feel free to limit your options by flying in formation and waiting for the end-game to benefit from the S-Loop. For my part, I'll dance with the ship from the start.

As for formation flying, I think the Tie Fighter is one of the ship that is flown in formation the most and it doesn't have the 1 straight or bank, so I don't think a particular maneuver is needed to be flown this way, as long as the dials are close.

So: Fel played by an experienced player against one of lower skills might end up with the inexperienced player coming on this forum to whine about Fel because he was not able to take a shot.

You have to admit that it would at least be a change of pace from all the whining about Phantoms and Fat Hans.

So: Fel played by an experienced player against one of lower skills might end up with the inexperienced player coming on this forum to whine about Fel because he was not able to take a shot.

I plan on being the cause of many of those posts.

I think starvipers will show up at first because people want to see what they can do, but will then disappear entirely from the competitive scene. With Virago, they're more similar to E-wings than anything else but the only competitive E-wing has higher PS and a better pilot ability than the vipers. FFG really dropped the ball here.

Guri ability is really nice, but she's hurt by her low PS. As for Xizor, I have a harder time with his ability: his ability ask you to pair him with some low cost ship like Z-95 or Y-Wing but his dial ask you to fly on your own and exploit your dial to the fullest to pull some tricks. So, I fell like Xizor will be like Brath, a pilot that you take mostly because of his PS because his ability won't be useful every game. Unless you decide to fly in formation, but I'm not sure the StarViper is really meant for formation flying. I'll definetely have to fly it a couple of games because I really want to love that ship, but I'm not impress by Xizor ability. Is it confirmed that the PS3 pilot doesn't have access to an EPT?

I disagree about the Starviper not being a formation flyer. Its 1 banks and 1-3 forwards are green. This is a formation flier if ever I saw one. Xizor is built to be the ship you can safely load up because he'll shed the damage. Pair him with some Y-wings and he will be a force!

Any ship can be a formation flyer, of course.

But with all the maneuver options the Star Viper has (hard 1, S-Loop, Barrel Roll, Boost, possibility to equip Advanced Sensor), I think it was meant as a sneaky flanker/knife fighter more than a ship that you'll limit to follow ships with a more generic dial. Just with the S-Loop, you'll break formation as soon as you do a k-turn.

So yeah, you could pair Xizor with a couple Zs and Y-Wings, but you will pay for a dial and action bar that you won't use to his full potential. I would have prefered to see him with an ability that would help him be a better flanker/close fighter than one that limit his potential.

While all ships CAN fly in a formation, those with 1 maneuvers do so better. This ship COULD be a flanker, but it's lack of diversity in green moves makes PTL an unattractive upgrade for this ship; as it would cause its movement to become predictable and easily blocked.

This is a leader's ship. It can deliver a big offensive punch and rely on the ships around it to keep it in the fight. What is the S-loop for? End game. When it comes down to a Viper verses one other ship, that maneuver will help give it an advantage.

Since when PtL must be taken to be considered a flanker? The Starviper has all the tools available to be a great flanker. And if you're afraid about getting block, you can take Advanced Sensor and boost or Barrel Roll before you move.

So, I guess it's a matter of perspective. Feel free to limit your options by flying in formation and waiting for the end-game to benefit from the S-Loop. For my part, I'll dance with the ship from the start.

You miss understand my post. This ship CAN be a flanking ship, especially when you put Advanced Sensor on it. I'm just stating that this isn't the only thing it is good at. In actuality, the StarViper isn't the best at anything and can fill many rolls. I am more warning against the idea that this ship is a flanker first and only.

So: Fel played by an experienced player against one of lower skills might end up with the inexperienced player coming on this forum to whine about Fel because he was not able to take a shot.

I plan on being the cause of many of those posts.

Heh... as long as you don't start talking about it in every single post you make on this forum, I should be able to live with it.

I think starvipers will show up at first because people want to see what they can do, but will then disappear entirely from the competitive scene. With Virago, they're more similar to E-wings than anything else but the only competitive E-wing has higher PS and a better pilot ability than the vipers. FFG really dropped the ball here.

Guri ability is really nice, but she's hurt by her low PS. As for Xizor, I have a harder time with his ability: his ability ask you to pair him with some low cost ship like Z-95 or Y-Wing but his dial ask you to fly on your own and exploit your dial to the fullest to pull some tricks. So, I fell like Xizor will be like Brath, a pilot that you take mostly because of his PS because his ability won't be useful every game. Unless you decide to fly in formation, but I'm not sure the StarViper is really meant for formation flying. I'll definetely have to fly it a couple of games because I really want to love that ship, but I'm not impress by Xizor ability. Is it confirmed that the PS3 pilot doesn't have access to an EPT?

I disagree about the Starviper not being a formation flyer. Its 1 banks and 1-3 forwards are green. This is a formation flier if ever I saw one. Xizor is built to be the ship you can safely load up because he'll shed the damage. Pair him with some Y-wings and he will be a force!

Any ship can be a formation flyer, of course.

But with all the maneuver options the Star Viper has (hard 1, S-Loop, Barrel Roll, Boost, possibility to equip Advanced Sensor), I think it was meant as a sneaky flanker/knife fighter more than a ship that you'll limit to follow ships with a more generic dial. Just with the S-Loop, you'll break formation as soon as you do a k-turn.

So yeah, you could pair Xizor with a couple Zs and Y-Wings, but you will pay for a dial and action bar that you won't use to his full potential. I would have prefered to see him with an ability that would help him be a better flanker/close fighter than one that limit his potential.

While all ships CAN fly in a formation, those with 1 maneuvers do so better. This ship COULD be a flanker, but it's lack of diversity in green moves makes PTL an unattractive upgrade for this ship; as it would cause its movement to become predictable and easily blocked.

This is a leader's ship. It can deliver a big offensive punch and rely on the ships around it to keep it in the fight. What is the S-loop for? End game. When it comes down to a Viper verses one other ship, that maneuver will help give it an advantage.

Since when PtL must be taken to be considered a flanker? The Starviper has all the tools available to be a great flanker. And if you're afraid about getting block, you can take Advanced Sensor and boost or Barrel Roll before you move.

So, I guess it's a matter of perspective. Feel free to limit your options by flying in formation and waiting for the end-game to benefit from the S-Loop. For my part, I'll dance with the ship from the start.

You miss understand my post. This ship CAN be a flanking ship, especially when you put Advanced Sensor on it. I'm just stating that this isn't the only thing it is good at. In actuality, the StarViper isn't the best at anything and can fill many rolls. I am more warning against the idea that this ship is a flanker first and only.

Probably misunderstood you then. The big ''COULD'' before ''be a flanker'' just before saying that his lack of green and PtL not being the best choice of EPT made me believe that you thought it would not be be a good flanker and better to be flown in formation.

If you've actually tried even dice rolling with Soontir PTL Auto and STEALTH. you will understand very quickly that Soontir now can completely evade fire from Fat Han for the full duration of surviving to nearly the same amount of time. Read that again.

Now try it.

Yeah to counter fel in an autoceptor you need to inflict stress on him, he moves late so can use boost and barrel roll to get out of arc, rolling four dice he's going to get at least one blank for AT he has the focus to convert eyeballs.

Killing fel with a turret is going to be tough, hell I've seen tur evade every attack from a mangler cannon outrider, and this was not just one turn but six with my friend getting two or three hits each turn.

You want to kill del you need a snub fighter to do it cannons will just be wasting their shots.