Hi all

I just had some suggestions, what about the TIE scout?

I am thinking about a ship acting like a passive supporting buoy would be fun to play and very strategic (for example for secondary weapons and against cloaked ships)

Suggestions:

Attack: 0-1

Defense: 3

Hull: 2-3

Maneuver: „sluggy“

Points: 7-8

Optional: Possibility of TIE scout to start even outside Range 1 from border

Abilities could be:

* In Range 1-3: For every friendly ship: Attack Target Lock = Attack Focus

* In Range 1-3: When a friendly ship is attacking with a secondary weapoon, reroll one attack die

* In Range 1-3: Reduce one agility of every cloaked enemy ship

* In Range 1-3: You automatically have initiative on ships with same pilot skill like enemy

* In Range 1-3: Automatic munition failsafe inside range

Some more/different suggestions? Looking forward for some interesting ideas

Points: 7-8

FFG said there will never be a ship under 12 points.

Its more a supporting ship. I guess FFG said that to make sure there would not be a larger swarm in the future. But it could be 12 points too, depends on the abilities Maybe unique too (that you are allowed to have only one in your squad, who knows)

I would love to see this and the vanguard in the game. I like the look of the vanguard better though.

Points: 7-8

Game has a minimum point cost of 12 because the amount you can run rises exponentially after that. 8pt ship, you can run twelve. Imagine twelve ships in a 100pt game. 7 pushes that to 14.

Synergy's a little anti-Imperial, so bear that in mind. Imperial Support is usually either in some way to the detriment of the buffing ship or AoE command buffs you can kill by taking out the commander. Be careful not to make this a Rebel ship.

* In Range 1-3: For every friendly ship: Attack Target Lock = Attack Focus

* In Range 1-3: When a friendly ship is attacking with a secondary weapoon, reroll one attack die

* In Range 1-3: Reduce one agility of every cloaked enemy ship

* In Range 1-3: You automatically have initiative on ships with same pilot skill like enemy

* In Range 1-3: Automatic munition failsafe inside range

First one, I'm assuming this means Han Solo's crew ability? I guess this one fits Imperial in design philosophy, although Imperial ships tend to not have the TL action so it's not really that useful.

Next one is Captain Jonus over long range. I'd stick a Once Per Round condition on this.

Third one is, no way around this, awful game design. Never target one ship, because the ability is junk if no TIE phantom shows up. This is on an Imperial ship too, so it's only good in mirror. If you want some anti-cloak, you need to give it universal utility. Have it target a ship and reduce its agility by one. Then again, that's a little more of a Scum ability than an Imperial one. Are there any Rebel or Imperial debuffs? I guess there's Wedge, but as that's only on his attack it's more of an attack powerup than a debuff.

Fourth likely harms you more than helps you. Initiative is, more often than not, a bad thing. I'd make so that it allows you to choose who has initiative for the purposes of simultaneous activations within range. Not the most useful ability but it has its uses and it'd probably be an ability you didn't pay points for on a low PS pilot.

Not sure what to make of the fifth ability.

I would love to see this and the vanguard in the game. I like the look of the vanguard better though.

Bend the wings on your TIE. Instant Vanguard. As for build, slap a Shield Upgrade on a TIE fighter. Instant Vanguard.

To be honest I think what's in store for the Empire next is probably something like the Assault Gunboat (been playing too much of the space sims recently ), the TIE hunter (appears in the RPG) or the TIE scout here. Not sure what else is left really.

I guess there's the Galaxies TIEs. FFG does like sourcing from Galaxies.

Yeah, I do not see FFG ever producing a ship with less then 12 points. A cool idea, reminds me of the old CCG, but not a realistic ship to see for the Empire. At least, not at that cost.

Apparently Stay on Target has the giant TIE bomber from Galactic Battlegrounds in it. The four pod one.

Here's a thread I did a while ago:

http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/130387-the-tie-scout/

Points: 7-8

Game has a minimum point cost of 12 because the amount you can run rises exponentially after that. 8pt ship, you can run twelve. Imagine twelve ships in a 100pt game. 7 pushes that to 14.

Synergy's a little anti-Imperial, so bear that in mind. Imperial Support is usually either in some way to the detriment of the buffing ship or AoE command buffs you can kill by taking out the commander. Be careful not to make this a Rebel ship.

* In Range 1-3: For every friendly ship: Attack Target Lock = Attack Focus

* In Range 1-3: When a friendly ship is attacking with a secondary weapoon, reroll one attack die

* In Range 1-3: Reduce one agility of every cloaked enemy ship

* In Range 1-3: You automatically have initiative on ships with same pilot skill like enemy

* In Range 1-3: Automatic munition failsafe inside range

First one, I'm assuming this means Han Solo's crew ability? I guess this one fits Imperial in design philosophy, although Imperial ships tend to not have the TL action so it's not really that useful.

Next one is Captain Jonus over long range. I'd stick a Once Per Round condition on this.

Third one is, no way around this, awful game design. Never target one ship, because the ability is junk if no TIE phantom shows up. This is on an Imperial ship too, so it's only good in mirror. If you want some anti-cloak, you need to give it universal utility. Have it target a ship and reduce its agility by one. Then again, that's a little more of a Scum ability than an Imperial one. Are there any Rebel or Imperial debuffs? I guess there's Wedge, but as that's only on his attack it's more of an attack powerup than a debuff.

Fourth likely harms you more than helps you. Initiative is, more often than not, a bad thing. I'd make so that it allows you to choose who has initiative for the purposes of simultaneous activations within range. Not the most useful ability but it has its uses and it'd probably be an ability you didn't pay points for on a low PS pilot.

Not sure what to make of the fifth ability.

First of all. thanks for your arguments (and your invested time). But instead of argueing against, you could have added an "but" and suggest a better idea or refinement. I clear it up a bit:

Ad First one: No, this is like the EPT skill "Deadeye". So this is not overpowered, its just for secondary weapons. With this you can make a better alpha strike.

Second one: Could be once per round, but how many secondary weapons do you have per round? One could exclude HLC and other cannons and refining rules to be just for missiles and torpedoes.

Third one: This is not mentioned to be the ONLY ability. Example: The ship could have 0 abilities, but with 2-3 free slots for 0 point card upgrades (out of many). Then you could mix together what you want.

Fourth one: Really, instead of argueing against, you can easily correct your objection: You could add a "may", "Once per round and ship, you may decide..."

Concerning point cost: I already mentioned you could have this ship "unique", or the second possibility to make a ship with several "small" but helpful abilites to justify point costs of 12 or higher.

Honestly, looking at the ships FFG has chosen to produce so far, particularly the version of the Defender that they chose, the Scout is probably too ugly.

They're producing Aggressors...

They're producing Aggressors...

My point stands.

What did you mean about the version of the Defender anyway? Is there a significantly uglier version they could have made?

I like the idea of a cheaper model that has 0 attack, and only 2 agi. Even at 10 points it might be cool. Enough that it gives you room to add a couple of minor upgrades to a swarm and just replace one or two ties with it. It should definitely provide some sort of buff or debuff.

Obviously it should have a sensor slot.

Maybe:

A single missle slot to go with it, so it can attack once in a game.

A modification that lets you start within 1 range of your normal deployment area.

A named pilot that allows it to swap its movement choice with one lower PS fighter when that fighter reveals its selection

A named pilot that allows you to copy one action printed on a ship within 1 range of it and perform it for free (for a stress).

A new sensor upgrade that lets you up or lower your PS by one during the movement phase.

Edit: Maybe not copy the cloak action though...

What did you mean about the version of the Defender anyway? Is there a significantly uglier version they could have made?

There's 2-3 different versions of the panels, they picked the longer Interceptor-style ones rather than the shorter Avenger type.

Point is, my argument isn't that they don't produce ugly ships (and I like the Aggressor, top 5 easily), it's that they produce certain /types/ of ship, visually, and the Scout isn't one of those.

Points: 7-8

Game has a minimum point cost of 12 because the amount you can run rises exponentially after that. 8pt ship, you can run twelve. Imagine twelve ships in a 100pt game. 7 pushes that to 14.

Synergy's a little anti-Imperial, so bear that in mind. Imperial Support is usually either in some way to the detriment of the buffing ship or AoE command buffs you can kill by taking out the commander. Be careful not to make this a Rebel ship.

* In Range 1-3: For every friendly ship: Attack Target Lock = Attack Focus

* In Range 1-3: When a friendly ship is attacking with a secondary weapoon, reroll one attack die

* In Range 1-3: Reduce one agility of every cloaked enemy ship

* In Range 1-3: You automatically have initiative on ships with same pilot skill like enemy

* In Range 1-3: Automatic munition failsafe inside range

First one, I'm assuming this means Han Solo's crew ability? I guess this one fits Imperial in design philosophy, although Imperial ships tend to not have the TL action so it's not really that useful.

Next one is Captain Jonus over long range. I'd stick a Once Per Round condition on this.

Third one is, no way around this, awful game design. Never target one ship, because the ability is junk if no TIE phantom shows up. This is on an Imperial ship too, so it's only good in mirror. If you want some anti-cloak, you need to give it universal utility. Have it target a ship and reduce its agility by one. Then again, that's a little more of a Scum ability than an Imperial one. Are there any Rebel or Imperial debuffs? I guess there's Wedge, but as that's only on his attack it's more of an attack powerup than a debuff.

Fourth likely harms you more than helps you. Initiative is, more often than not, a bad thing. I'd make so that it allows you to choose who has initiative for the purposes of simultaneous activations within range. Not the most useful ability but it has its uses and it'd probably be an ability you didn't pay points for on a low PS pilot.

Not sure what to make of the fifth ability.

First of all. thanks for your arguments (and your invested time). But instead of argueing against, you could have added an "but" and suggest a better idea or refinement. I clear it up a bit:

Ad First one: No, this is like the EPT skill "Deadeye". So this is not overpowered, its just for secondary weapons. With this you can make a better alpha strike.

Second one: Could be once per round, but how many secondary weapons do you have per round? One could exclude HLC and other cannons and refining rules to be just for missiles and torpedoes.

Third one: This is not mentioned to be the ONLY ability. Example: The ship could have 0 abilities, but with 2-3 free slots for 0 point card upgrades (out of many). Then you could mix together what you want.

Fourth one: Really, instead of argueing against, you can easily correct your objection: You could add a "may", "Once per round and ship, you may decide..."

Concerning point cost: I already mentioned you could have this ship "unique", or the second possibility to make a ship with several "small" but helpful abilites to justify point costs of 12 or higher.

The abilites that potentially work I have provided suggestions for. Oddly Four is the example you cite and that's the one I've gone into the most depth on how to improve. The only one I've said flat out don't do is 3.

Never target the enemy cloak action specifically. Ever. That upgrade, even at 0 points, is bad design as it stands. Never make the player gamble on the enemy list when designing. Even Autothrusters, the turret counter, still has uses if turrets don't show.

As for 2, I mean it only provides one reroll per round. If you have two ships shooting secondaries on the same round, the Scout will only provide one of them a reroll.

Concerning point cost: I already mentioned you could have this ship "unique", or the second possibility to make a ship with several "small" but helpful abilites to justify point costs of 12 or higher.

Or just raise its stats. Make it a 2/3/3/1.

The empire is now getting a pretty good upgrade for the advanced. I was honestly expecting the 'fix' to come in an aces pack with a bomber and advanced.

I still expect a bomber in the next aces pack, but what if said pack came with a TIE scout? A ship to fill the role of supplementing the bomber (and other ships).

Here's what I propose:

TIE scout

Attack 1

Agility 1

Hull 5

Actions:

Focus

Target lock

Crew slot

System* slot

System* slot

Other things to consider: the movement dial should not be great, as the ship is not fast or agile, but a white zero maneuver could be interesting.

New system* upgrades

Sensor Ping

5 points

Action

Choose a ship at range 1-3 and remove a cloak token or stealth device from that ship, then discard this card.

Long Range Tracking

3 points

Before attacking, you may spend a targeting lock to increase your range by one.

New Elite Pilot Talent:

Fire on my mark!

allied ships within range 1-2 can spend target locks from from this ship rather than their own when firing ordnance.

Edit *changed from sensor slot to system slot. To me they are the same, I have heard system and sensor used interchangeably, I figured it was common. To avoid confusion I have changed it.

I put some more thought into the Sensor Ping upgrade and agree it is too narrowly focused on removing a cloak token. Instead I propose this:

Sensor Ping

System upgrade 5 points

Before you attack, you may spend a target lock to remove all evade tokens or remove a cloaking token from a ship.

For those who don't or won't read another thread, here is my take above.

Sensor Ping

System upgrade 5 points

Before you attack, you may spend a target lock to remove all evade tokens or remove a cloaking token from a ship.

Five points potentially down the drain.

For those who don't or won't read another thread, here is my take above.

I like some of the ideas very much, keep it up

The Tie scout should really have no viable attack and very sluggy maneuverability. It should be no harm, but simultaneously be a worthiwhile goal to eliminate. A "sensor slot" would be great. Maybe 2 or 3 of them with 1-2 point upgrades, to give room to compile a lot of different sensor arrays. Also, the scout should be "unique" to avoid flooding the play area with it

Also, the scout should be "unique" to avoid flooding the play area with it

Or just put it in the 12-20 point range. It's basically a turretless Imperial HWK anyway.

FYI there have been many threads about the TIE Scout already.

Here's what it should offer:

2 Attack

2 Agility

4 Hull

2 Shields

Actions: Focus, Target Lock, Barrel Roll, Sensor Ping

Upgrades: System, Crew

Dial:

1s - Turn (white), Bank (green), Straight (green)

2s - Turn (red), Bank (white), Straight (green)

3s - Bank (white), Straight (green), K-turn (red)

4s - Straight (white)

5s - Straight (red)

Full Stop (red)

New Action: Sensor Ping.

Action: Place a Ping token on one enemy ship within your firing arc and at Range 1-3.

New Token: Ping.

When you attack a ship with at least one Ping token assigned to it, after the defender rolls his defensive dice, you may choose one defense die. The defender must reroll that die. Ping tokens clear during the End Phase.

New System upgrade: Enhanced tracking array. 2 points. TIE Scout only.

When you take a Sensor Ping action, you may choose up to two enemy ships within your firing arc and at Range 1-3. Assign a Ping token to both.

New Modification: Chaff dispenser. 2 points. Small Ship only.

Action: Remove any Ping tokens from your ship, as well as any red Target Lock tokens.

Pilots would include a named PS 6 with an EPT. When you take the Sensor Ping action, you may assign the Ping token to a ship that is not in your firing arc.

Also a PS 8 with an EPT. When you take the Sensor Ping action, you may also take a free Target Lock action. Then you may pass the blue Target Lock token to one other friendly ship at Range 1-2.

Its a thread about some ideas, not neccessarily for the Tie scout, but it would fit very well.

Concerning your stats: 2 Attack is too much, it should be something completely different, it should shine by its features not by stats. But your ping idea is interesting. Maybe all the effects should affect inside a specific range and not only to one ship

Its a thread about some ideas, not neccessarily for the Tie scout, but it would fit very well.

Concerning your stats: 2 Attack is too much, it should be something completely different, it should shine by its features not by stats. But your ping idea is interesting. Maybe all the effects should affect inside a specific range and not only to one ship

The only reason I went with 2 instead of 1 for the attack value is because FFG has said that they regret giving the Hawk only 1 attack. Also, with a System slot, 1 attack becomes redundant, as you just take an Accuracy Corrector and get 2 hits no matter what.

Its a thread about some ideas, not neccessarily for the Tie scout, but it would fit very well.

Concerning your stats: 2 Attack is too much, it should be something completely different, it should shine by its features not by stats. But your ping idea is interesting. Maybe all the effects should affect inside a specific range and not only to one ship

It wouldn't shine on its stats. Two attack is not something special unless it's on a swarmer: it's basic armament.

There's one 1ATK ship in the game, the HWK, and the designers actually regret making it that.