It's not a tournament winning list but double D is fun, it's not that far behind with eight attack and has more hit points than a triple interceptor list.

I'm unconvinced of that. I'm taking my Defender list to a Store Championship in a couple weeks.

Take pics I'm interested to know how you do.

I also would like an update. Vessery is certainly the cream of the crop. With a focus and TL he is a killing machine. I used him with Kagi the other night to ensure a TL and he was murderous. Vader+ATC would fit in a list with those two for more TL synergy. With the defender though you have more options, unlike the E-Wing I think the 30 point defender is very viable.

I'll definitely do a write-up, and I'll take pictures if I remember/have time. I think the Advanced fix helps both named Defenders out a lot. It brings a source of high quality Target Locks for Vessery and it makes more high PS pilots usable that can fire before Brath.

I feel like I should try "Push up bra".

Delta Squadron Pilot (30)

Delta Squadron Pilot (30)

"Echo" (30)

Veteran Instincts (1)

Fire-Control System (2)

Recon Specialist (3)

Advanced Cloaking Device (4)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

That could be pretty cool. It brings a ton of beef without an easy target like a Decimator.

In a 100 point list, it's hard to justify 40 of those on a ship that can't turn and only has 6hp.

The defender can't just be the best ship at its price tag, it needs to be head and shoulders above the rest and it's not.

You're doing it wrong.

Quoted for truth.

More truth.

For my behalf

Sigma + Stygium Particle Accelerator + 3 Point Crew/System Upgrade >> naked Delta

Well yeah, Defenders should be packing a cannon. Its like not putting a cloaking upgrade on said Phantom.

Well yeah, Defenders should be packing a cannon. Its like not putting a cloaking upgrade on said Phantom.

No, they really don't have to. I have flown many time with Defenders with and without cannons, and both way is effective, as long as you know what you're doing and it serve his purpose with the rest of your team.

Vessery without any cannon is still very deadly while not having the big red target painted on him if he had a HLC. It also leaves you more points to customize your team so he can pick more target, making him more unpredictable, by having more ship that can TL for him while also leaving enough room for a good flanker if you want to.

Vessery with 4 Scimitar, Vessery with 3 Advanced+AC (once raider is out), Vessery with 2 Scimitar and Soontir, Vessery with 2 Scimitar and Vader, Vessery with 2 Scimitar and a Bounty Hunter, etc...

Colonel Vessery — TIE Defender 35
Veteran Instincts 1

Sigma Squadron Pilot — TIE Phantom 25
Fire-Control System 2
Weapons Engineer 3
Stygium Particle Accelerator 2

Sigma Squadron Pilot — TIE Phantom 25
Fire-Control System 2
Weapons Engineer 3
Stygium Particle Accelerator 2

The SPAs could be a 4pts spent elsewhere, maybe a Shadow upgrade. Though when playing mid-PS I'd prefer 4-5 ships the list it quite fun.

Vessery just works so well with a HLC though, you deny them range bonuses and put a steady stream of accurate fire where it's needed most.

No one thinks twice about knitting out a phantom, you'd think by now the value of the HLC that hits 3-4 times almost every attack would be plain to see.

Hit first hit hard.

The all-new, improved Jonus Bros' list (sans Jonus):

Delta Squadron Pilot - Heavy Laser Cannon

Delta Squadron Pilot - Heavy Laser Cannon

Omicron Group Pilot - Fire Control System, Fleet Officer

Rain hot lasery death upon all thine foes...

But I such with the shuttle, it's my albatross.

But I such with the shuttle, it's my albatross.

3 under Par is pretty good though...

I c wat u did thar.

But I such with the shuttle, it's my albatross.

1 forward, activate Fleet Officer, repeat.

It actually works much better with Advance Sensors (activate Fleet Officer, 1 forwards) because then you can stall the following turn if necessary, but one point short, dammit.

But I such with the shuttle, it's my albatross.

3 under Par is pretty good though...

ALBATROSS. Get it onna stick!

Vessery just works so well with a HLC though, you deny them range bonuses and put a steady stream of accurate fire where it's needed most.

No one thinks twice about knitting out a phantom, you'd think by now the value of the HLC that hits 3-4 times almost every attack would be plain to see.

Hit first hit hard.

I didn't say that he wasn't good with a cannon, just that it is not something you 'must' include to make him effective. He's still a very good choice even without. The guy is a surgeon.

When designing a team around him, I found that more often than not, I prefered to use those 7 points to boost his teamates instead. So, while Vessery is not as good without the HLC, the team in general is and it opens my playbook while in-game. There's a thread I started not so long ago where I wanted to make a team with Vessery + HLC for a tournament, I ended up dropping it for a better escort. While testing a lot of those builds, I found that, while Vessery is better with the HLC, I had better results with teams where he didn't had one.

If I want to use a Defender with a HLC, I'll go with Brath. Since you don't have to include ships that can TL to get the most out of his ability, it opens up the possibilities for the escort. So his high cost is not as bad. As for generics, sometime I run them with a cannon (mostly ion cannon) sometimes vanilla.

Help me understand how this works...

Rexler Brath (37)
Veteran Instincts (1)
Heavy Laser Cannon (7)
Proton Rockets (3)
Shield Upgrade (4)

Colonel Vessery (35)
Decoy (2)
Heavy Laser Cannon (7)
Shield Upgrade (4)

Total: 100

http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v3!s!71:27,23,73:-1:2:;70:55,23,-1:-1:2:

I get the Double Ds are powerful and for that pretty awesome. But!

• Rexler Brath's ability states: "After you perform an attack that deals at least 1 Damage card to the defender, you may spend a focus token to flip those cards faceup."
• Colonel Vessery's ability states: "When attacking, immediately after you roll attack dice, you may acquire a target lock on the defender if it already has a red target lock token"

Vessery needs someone to put a Target Lock on the defender first. If so Vessery gets a free Target Lock that is can spend to reroll his attack dice. BUT! Brath wants a focus for his ability to work and can't used his ability with a target lock?

If I understand the logic (help me here). Brath Target Locks ASAP and leaves it without spending it. This is Vessery's opponent. Then Brath is free to focus until Vessery's needs a new opponent. If both target the same defender or Brath acts as a wingman to Vessery then Brath only 'wastes' one Action per defender. Waste may not be the optimal description, but an action that he (Brath) doesn't personally benefit from but the team does.

Is that right?

Basically yes. Brath's ability isn't needed all that much, its mainly the fact he is bringing ps 10 to help take out phantoms, as well as letting Vessery shoot as ps 10 with a TL and focus.

Vessery moves first, focuses.

Brath moves then target locks Vessery's target, gives Vessery ps 10, Vessery shoots with a target lock and a focus, then Brath can shoot, and use the TL if needed (but will obviously need to grab it again next turn) or doesn't use the target lock so Vessery can keep shooting the TLed enemy.

Basically yes. Brath's ability isn't needed all that much, its mainly the fact he is bringing ps 10 to help take out phantoms, as well as letting Vessery shoot as ps 10 with a TL and focus.

Vessery moves first, focuses.

Brath moves then target locks Vessery's target, gives Vessery ps 10, Vessery shoots with a target lock and a focus, then Brath can shoot, and use the TL if needed (but will obviously need to grab it again next turn) or doesn't use the target lock so Vessery can keep shooting the TLed enemy.

Also Brath's ability is mitigated by shields. So using him simply as a TL Painter works, as well as having him attack second until Target Shields drop.

Love reading about Defenders and ways to make them viable, so this is a great thread.

I've got store champs this weekend. There will be Defenders in it. 2xDelta HLC with Doomshuttle possibly. Very low PS though.

Truly, after lots of playing with Defenders, I found that Brath and Vessery just don't seem to work all that well together. Too often you're making choices that help one and hinder the other. These guys just seem to work best solo. And… speaking of which, I can't wait to try out Brath like this:

Rexler Brath + HLC + Lone Wolf

I normally run him with Predator instead, so this sacrifices a slight damage potential (never know if the enemy is bringing PS 1-2 or not) for some defensive mitigation. Actually coming in a point cheaper opens up a world of possibilities, as I can squeak another ship into my normal squad build. My standard tactic is to bring Rexler up the side on his own anyway, might as well get something out of it.

Of course for Epic play, I'd probably switch Predator back in.

nurglez and lvlerlin have explained it pretty well already, but I'll try and elaborate a little more:

You can't really think about their abilities (particularly Rexler Brath's) as happening every turn. Think about Brath's as a multi-turn set-up against a certain sort of target (big, tough, expensive).

So against Fatties:

Turn 1: Vessery Focuses, Brath TLs, Vessery fires with Focus/TL, Brath fires with no bonus (you're probably getting 6 hits before green dice with this)

Turn 2: Vessery Focuses, Brath Focuses, Vessery Fires with Focus/TL, Brath Fires with either Focus/TL or holds Focus to flip crits. My general rule of thumb is that if I think I can punch 2 damage through, then I'll hold the Focus for crits (unless extra damage would kill the target).

-Against most other Targets you can use the TL on Brath the turn it's placed to try and take out one ship in the turn.

-You can also just leave Rex's TL on a target and peel him off if he's taken a lot of damage early. This lets Vessery get a continual double-bonus against a target while Rex turns around. I've done that against Fat Han before. Vessery with an HLC and Focus/TL every shot will put some damage through every turn even on 3PO/Title. A couple of turns of this and Rex can come back and put on a crippling blow with a pile of crits.

-The nice thing about PS 10 is that against PS8/9 stuff you're guaranteed to use Vessery's ability first turn, when you're probably at range 3. This is nice because it's an extra turn to get his boosted shooting, and it's extra defense for Rex. The second turn of the engagement is usually at range 2 or 1, so you'd often rather have a Focus for defense on the close pass turn.

Would it make sense to give Vesserly veteran instincts and leave Rexler at 8 so that you can choose to fire Vesserly first and let them both spend target locks?

I can't wait to try out Brath like this:

Rexler Brath + HLC + Lone Wolf

I normally run him with Predator instead, so this sacrifices a slight damage potential (never know if the enemy is bringing PS 1-2 or not) for some defensive mitigation. Actually coming in a point cheaper opens up a world of possibilities, as I can squeak another ship into my normal squad build. My standard tactic is to bring Rexler up the side on his own anyway, might as well get something out of it.

Yeah, that's an awesome set up. I like it with Stealth Device on paper, but in reality, he seems to draw the big guns early, so Stealth Device doesn't help quite as much as it would. It's a tough choice, though, Predator is so freaking good on him both for the chance to re-roll multiple dice and the chance to re-roll eyes (because you're saving your Focus to flip).

I've tried the SD it usually drops off first time i roll because green dice are dicks, so either a hull or shield is my go to.

Would it make sense to give Vesserly veteran instincts and leave Rexler at 8 so that you can choose to fire Vesserly first and let them both spend target locks?

I think if you don't see a lot of dangerous PS9 stuff around, that's a great option, but against PS that moves after Rex, you often don't get to TL on that first turn because you won't be in range until they move, which raises all sorts of difficulties I mention above. I like PS10 a lot also because my final 3 points in my list is an Ion Pulse Missile on Rex. When you have one of those moving last, it seriously restricts the movements that certain ships can make for fear of getting ioned off the board or onto a rock. With Rex at a lower PS, higher PS opponents would know if I had a Target Lock or arc on them, and could maneuver more freely near the edge of the board.