...sigh...

I played last store-tournament with the following crew, and got a 3rd place:

• Rexler Brath + HLC (always 4 dices + focus) -> "did 4 crits on a YT-1300 and on a VT-49, that pretty much killed em."
• Rear Adm. Chiraneau + Expose + Tactical Jammer + Rebel Captive + Moff Jerjerrod

To say a few words... 360* 5 dice attack with Rear Adm. (to remove shields), then 4 dice attack with a white-k-turn Rexler, spending focus token to make 2-4 crits. That was more than effective.
I did even beat the Rear Adm. + Whisper/Echo build, with full victory 100/0.

So please, do not underestimate the TIE Defender

...sigh...

There is a specific sub for list making. maybe you will get an answer there?

I will take any Ion defender vs a b-wing any day. One ion landed and it's probably light out for the b-wing.

I just realized that the Defender and the Aggressor have an interesting match-up.

They both excel at disengagement and re-engagement, but do so radically differently, so no-one's quite sure which is actually on the offensive at the moment.

I will take any Ion defender vs a b-wing any day. One ion landed and it's probably light out for the b-wing.

If only one could afford 4 Defenders with an Ion cannon...

I just realized that the Defender and the Aggressor have an interesting match-up.

They both excel at disengagement and re-engagement, but do so radically differently, so no-one's quite sure which is actually on the offensive at the moment.

I will take any Ion defender vs a b-wing any day. One ion landed and it's probably light out for the b-wing.

If only one could afford 4 Defenders with an Ion cannon...

It's obvious that FFG takes this kind of possibility into account when they price things. In the early waves the X-Wing and Tie Adv were pretty obviously priced at 21 to stop a 5 ship list. The same thing most likely happened so that the defender can't run 3 with deadly cannons like the HLC or 4 naked.

While also assuming that the b wing pilot doesn't know how to fly theirs...

I'm all for showing the Defender is a good ship, but I can't stand these set pieces predicated on the idea that the other pilot will make terrible choices.

Like how you are completely refusing to acknowledge that if a defender goes for a block against a k turning Keyan, Keyan can simply see where you are, barrel to the side with advanced sensors, and get a range one focused shot because of the stress!

If you are going to start adding upgrades, put an Ion on the Defender or even a Flechette if you want the points to be identical. You will need it to match the Keyan point total anyway. In either case, but especially the Ion, the Defender will murder Keyan by ionizing him on the first pass or stressing him after his shot (preventing him from k-turning OR using Adv. Sensors).

I see this a lot in these "comparison" threads. Start with two roughly equal ships in terms of points, but then attempt to invalidate one of them by assuming the other has a stack of upgrades vs. the bare version of the other.

I just realized that the Defender and the Aggressor have an interesting match-up.

They both excel at disengagement and re-engagement, but do so radically differently, so no-one's quite sure which is actually on the offensive at the moment.

That would be an interesting fight. The base size difference also makes it a weird one. I think they sort of fill similar roles for the two factions, though in somewhat different ways. They're both solid gun platforms that excel at the joust and at like you said the engaging and disengaging in turn.

I am currently 5 wins 0 losses with Rexler Brath+HLC+LoneWolf+Shield Upgrade and x4 T/F vs 5 different Aggressor containing lists.

This means next to nothing however because all of my opponents were still learning how to fly the IG. I saw very few S-Turns used against me and none 3hard K-Turns (which is the most unique thing that ship can have). Furthermore, I didn't see anyone use inertial dampeners with their aggressors, which is yet anther component to that ship that requires a lot of practice.

While also assuming that the b wing pilot doesn't know how to fly theirs...

I'm all for showing the Defender is a good ship, but I can't stand these set pieces predicated on the idea that the other pilot will make terrible choices.

Like how you are completely refusing to acknowledge that if a defender goes for a block against a k turning Keyan, Keyan can simply see where you are, barrel to the side with advanced sensors, and get a range one focused shot because of the stress!

If you are going to start adding upgrades, put an Ion on the Defender or even a Flechette if you want the points to be identical. You will need it to match the Keyan point total anyway. In either case, but especially the Ion, the Defender will murder Keyan by ionizing him on the first pass or stressing him after his shot (preventing him from k-turning OR using Adv. Sensors).

I see this a lot in these "comparison" threads. Start with two roughly equal ships in terms of points, but then attempt to invalidate one of them by assuming the other has a stack of upgrades vs. the bare version of the other.

While also assuming that the b wing pilot doesn't know how to fly theirs...

I'm all for showing the Defender is a good ship, but I can't stand these set pieces predicated on the idea that the other pilot will make terrible choices.

Like how you are completely refusing to acknowledge that if a defender goes for a block against a k turning Keyan, Keyan can simply see where you are, barrel to the side with advanced sensors, and get a range one focused shot because of the stress!

If you are going to start adding upgrades, put an Ion on the Defender or even a Flechette if you want the points to be identical. You will need it to match the Keyan point total anyway. In either case, but especially the Ion, the Defender will murder Keyan by ionizing him on the first pass or stressing him after his shot (preventing him from k-turning OR using Adv. Sensors).

I see this a lot in these "comparison" threads. Start with two roughly equal ships in terms of points, but then attempt to invalidate one of them by assuming the other has a stack of upgrades vs. the bare version of the other.

Well with this particular comparison Keyan is actually cheaper than the bare bones defender. So the points actually favor the defender in this comparison. Which is why we suggested giving Keyan adv sensors and giving the defender an additional 2 points to use for a flachette cannon or bumping up to an onyx pilot. Or just keep them both vanilla and the defender gets a point advantage.

I did see that. I was just pointing out that we began with a 30pt Defender vs. 29pt Keyan comparison, the 1 point difference being close enough we called it even. Then, the comparison became 32pt Adv. Sensors Keyan vs. 30pt Defender. If we wanted to add upgrades to create equivalent point values, then 2 or 3 points worth of Cannon added to the Defender makes it an extremely dangerous opponent for Keyan to face, with or without Adv Sensors. At 32 points, the Defender will consistently beat Keyan one on one. Which is also a bit misleading, because neither ship is likely to be alone.

In general, I often see people comparing ships "one on one" that aren't even in the same ball park in terms of points or upgrades which completely invalidates the comparison. To be helpful, comparisons should be two ships with useful/typical loadouts compared to one another based upon their point values.

I just realized that the Defender and the Aggressor have an interesting match-up.

They both excel at disengagement and re-engagement, but do so radically differently, so no-one's quite sure which is actually on the offensive at the moment.

That would be an interesting fight. The base size difference also makes it a weird one. I think they sort of fill similar roles for the two factions, though in somewhat different ways. They're both solid gun platforms that excel at the joust and at like you said the engaging and disengaging in turn.

I am currently 5 wins 0 losses with Rexler Brath+HLC+LoneWolf+Shield Upgrade and x4 T/F vs 5 different Aggressor containing lists.

This means next to nothing however because all of my opponents were still learning how to fly the IG. I saw very few S-Turns used against me and none 3hard K-Turns (which is the most unique thing that ship can have). Furthermore, I didn't see anyone use inertial dampeners with their aggressors, which is yet anther component to that ship that requires a lot of practice.

Hit me up on vassal sometime or PM me to set up a game. MY IG88BD "Terminators" squad is currently 9-2, including two landslide victories with squads with tooled out Rexler in them. It would be interested to see it played against someone that probably knows what they are doing with Rexler better.

I just realized that the Defender and the Aggressor have an interesting match-up.

They both excel at disengagement and re-engagement, but do so radically differently, so no-one's quite sure which is actually on the offensive at the moment.

That would be an interesting fight. The base size difference also makes it a weird one. I think they sort of fill similar roles for the two factions, though in somewhat different ways. They're both solid gun platforms that excel at the joust and at like you said the engaging and disengaging in turn.

I am currently 5 wins 0 losses with Rexler Brath+HLC+LoneWolf+Shield Upgrade and x4 T/F vs 5 different Aggressor containing lists.

This means next to nothing however because all of my opponents were still learning how to fly the IG. I saw very few S-Turns used against me and none 3hard K-Turns (which is the most unique thing that ship can have). Furthermore, I didn't see anyone use inertial dampeners with their aggressors, which is yet anther component to that ship that requires a lot of practice.

Hit me up on vassal sometime or PM me to set up a game. MY IG88BD "Terminators" squad is currently 9-2, including two landslide victories with squads with tooled out Rexler in them. It would be interested to see it played against someone that probably knows what they are doing with Rexler better.

Thank you for the offer but unfortunately I am behind an internet port blocker and I have never been able to connect to Vassal : (

I am glad to see though that you are using the IG88D, that one is really unpopular right now with the people I play with but I think it is the most interesting one out of the bunch!

Thank you for the offer but unfortunately I am behind an internet port blocker and I have never been able to connect to Vassal : (

I am glad to see though that you are using the IG88D, that one is really unpopular right now with the people I play with but I think it is the most interesting one out of the bunch!

D is so much better than C IMO. Listen to the first 5 minutes of the most recent NOVA episode where I talk about the squad. (I initially incorrectly call it B and C, disregard, it is B and D). B D works really well with Outmaneuver + Buzzsaw HLC FCS to really lay down the pain on your opponent.

I'm your huckleberry Bobby. I have a dual Iggy list I need to try.

I just realized that the Defender and the Aggressor have an interesting match-up.

They both excel at disengagement and re-engagement, but do so radically differently, so no-one's quite sure which is actually on the offensive at the moment.

That would be an interesting fight. The base size difference also makes it a weird one. I think they sort of fill similar roles for the two factions, though in somewhat different ways. They're both solid gun platforms that excel at the joust and at like you said the engaging and disengaging in turn.

I am currently 5 wins 0 losses with Rexler Brath+HLC+LoneWolf+Shield Upgrade and x4 T/F vs 5 different Aggressor containing lists.

This means next to nothing however because all of my opponents were still learning how to fly the IG. I saw very few S-Turns used against me and none 3hard K-Turns (which is the most unique thing that ship can have). Furthermore, I didn't see anyone use inertial dampeners with their aggressors, which is yet anther component to that ship that requires a lot of practice.

Hit me up on vassal sometime or PM me to set up a game. MY IG88BD "Terminators" squad is currently 9-2, including two landslide victories with squads with tooled out Rexler in them. It would be interested to see it played against someone that probably knows what they are doing with Rexler better.

I took a dual Defender list 2nd place in a store championship, and when I've played myself a few times with dual Aggressors, it seems like the winner would almost always be the player who guesses right. Lots of ships have a small set of obvious good moves in any given situation, but Aggressors can be almost anywhere. Defenders aren't crazy maneuverable, but they have enough dial options to get their cannons pointed in the right direction, if maneuver prediction is good enough.

Thank you for the offer but unfortunately I am behind an internet port blocker and I have never been able to connect to Vassal : (

I am glad to see though that you are using the IG88D, that one is really unpopular right now with the people I play with but I think it is the most interesting one out of the bunch!

D is so much better than C IMO. Listen to the first 5 minutes of the most recent NOVA episode where I talk about the squad. (I initially incorrectly call it B and C, disregard, it is B and D). B D works really well with Outmaneuver + Buzzsaw HLC FCS to really lay down the pain on your opponent.

I think the great thing about D is that it lets the Aggressor do something no other ship can do. C just adds some action economy that isn't always useful.

I think D is a solid option faced duel aggressors using B and D and it wasn't one sided by any means, though once I'd killed B it was pretty screwed as zixor and kavil only had one arc to worry about.

This may have been mentioned before in this thread, but I don't have the time to go through 14 pages.

The release of the Raider makes me really excited for one of my favorite Imperial pilots: Vessery.

He has one of the better abilities in the game (at least top 10) and if he was in say, a Tie Interceptor, he'd be up there with Soontir. His main problem is having a cheap, durable, and offensively powerful ship to carry TLs. The Bomber fits two of those criteria, but is offensively lacking. Ordnance and bombs can be too unreliable and can start to add up the points quickly. They also can be crippled heavily by crits, which kind of seem rampant now. Shuttles are nice and cheap (well OGP), but to keep it in the fight you are going to want EU, FCS, Gunner. They can hit 30 points in a hurry. Also, they aren't the easiest ships to fly around.

You can always throw a TC on a Tie, but they die easily and I hate modding cannon fodder. Ties rather be doing other actions too, focus, evade, etc.

The ATC equipped Tempest is now the best TL carrier for Vessery. At only 22 points you can fit 2 of them with a HLC toting Vessery and still have room for an Academy. Or you can drop the ATC off one and run 3 Tempests. They have quite an offensive punch. I can't wait to try this:

Vessery + HLC + VI

Alozen + ATC

Maarek + ATC + Predator.

Vessery is the shield stripping, while Alozen and Stele load the target up with crits.

I agree 100%. Vessery likes other people with TLs, Brath likes some heavy hitting PS8/9 pilots.

There's so many good Defender/Ad/Ad combinations based on what we know that I can't process them all right now.

For my part, I will try

Vessery with VI

3x Tempest with AC

Very consistant damage and you don't have the problem of guessing at PS2 which ship to TL to trigger ATC. 21 hit points, 9 being shields, behind 4 ships all with 3 agility; 3 of those that once the TLs are sent for Vessery to abuse, they can focus on defense and rely on AC to always do 2 hit per attack.

I also like:

Delta + Mangler

Tempest + ATC X 3

Go ahead and joust that squad. It will tear swarms to pieces. Decimators will have a bad day... really bad.

I've done a trial proxying the advanced title it worked really well with vessery.

I've done a trial proxying the advanced title it worked really well with vessery.

Yep, that's what the numbers would say about it too. Generic Defenders not so much, but Vessery loves those free Target Locks, it puts his jousting efficiency up near 100% even without HLC.