Also pc games mandatory mechanics and tabletop mandatory mechanics are different. In a pc game mandatory effects simply take their place but in x-wing one person might forget his upgrade cards like r2 astromech or rebel captive which might elude the other player as well.

Then there are also optional stuff like whisper's and fel's focus tokens which are not mandatory, the opponent should not remind people those stuff in tournaments, since a tournament is a comparison of many things, fatigue and knowledge of your own list being two of them.

It's one thing if it's a new player, but experience players should not expect this.

The more skilled player will remember his actions and abilities more than a less skilled player, as it is all part if the game. Along with maneuvering

If someone is serious and wants to win they ate going to go in with their best squad and give their 100%

If someone is just their for fun, they probably wouldn't care so much if they did forget something and just shrug it off and carry on.

In big events that can take 10-14 hours the game will take its toll and wear people out mentally. Only the best will come out on top.

If your having to be reminded to take whispers focus or use gunner then imo your probably not the best.

Maybe early on, they could be, but over time maybe they lack the mentality to stay focus vs other players.

And this is one aspect about tournaments.

It's not just how good you are with your squad, but how focus you can stay over long periods of time.

I couldn't imagine winning an event knowing I probably wouldn't have if I was to be excused for making mistakes and allowed backsies.

I'd almost feel as though I cheated even though that isn't the case

Concept situations:

1) Opponent, has played in tourney of sort/had some one to teach them.

2) Opponent has had zero help in learning above reading rule books and forums.

It seems to me the Op's commentator fell into the first one.

In such case the proverb "Fly casual" applies *ducks* where needed. Meaning that you either give them a classic schooling in how to not win. Or you try to help them out. Either way it is your choice. If the person reacts badly or does not like the fact that you are using the rules to keep the game clean then perhaps he needs to find another game.

In case 2, Player maybe being a poor looser and not knowing exactly how every little thing works might call for intervention so that someone who does react badly to loosing while playing by the rules does not go berzerk when said noob is trying hard to play.

You hold his hand and help him play his own list.

Why? Because you are a good person. Because it makes him a better player. Because you'd rather beat him at his best.

Lately, I've been playing a guy at am FLGS, first time I've played someone I didn't previously know, and first time I've played at an FLGS.

The guy is fairly new, and a large part of our games have been him learning what various cards do. For me, it's been a chance to fly things I don't usually get a chance to fly.

So of course I'm reminding him of things he can do, and explaining why I'm doing what I am doing. I felt bad running a couple Buzzsaw B-Wings against him, but it was fun.

Would I extend that same courtesy to a more experienced player? I probably wouldn't have to. But if I did, it seems like the right thing to do. In general, I want to make sure we're all having a good time. If that means reminding my opponent of ways they can hurt me, well... Here's hoping I win anyway. Or that the favor is returned.

To the OP: sounds like there was something else going on. Maybe he had net decked, or maybe he had built his list in a hurry, or something. Such a weird bit of not knowing what he had and what it did. And then he went on tilt and became a bit of a jerk.

You hold his hand and help him play his own list.

Why? Because you are a good person. Because it makes him a better player. Because you'd rather beat him at his best.

Regarding the part in bold. Helping someone play the game against you does not make you a good person, nor does it mean that by not helping them you are not a good person. That is a very generalized statement. I'd say helping them with their game means you are genuinely interested in them learning the game rules and having a good time. Otherwise you wouldn't really be helping them.

As far as the beating them at their best thing, this is going too far into the what "Fly Casual" philosophy has become. When that idea itself was proposed by hothie, it was very generic in terms and the intent was just to show that one would "play this game to have fun and to share our experiences with others". While I like that idea, what it has been turned it into is "I have to help my opponent remember everything and help them throughout the game because otherwise I'm not playing them at their best." Quite contradictory to help someone and then think to yourself that this is *their* personal best. Though the original idea of Fly Casual seems like a nice thought, I never really subscribed to it. I don't see the point in using a T-Shirt with a line from the movies just to show how much better I think I am than players who are competitive by nature. All that movement seems to do is divide the X-Wing community into two groups: Those who think they are better than others & feel the need to show it and everyone else.

In all games there are a certain level of mistakes. You might even say that the winner is determined to be the person who makes the least mistakes. If I know without a doubt that the person across from me knows the game well, I'm going to treat the game with some level of seriousness and probably not help them, unless I'm feeling really nice. I also expect no help in return. If they are new to the game, then I will help them reach that point, so in time I can play them without needing to remind or help them with anything.

Been playing for a year now, but I always forget things when I play a new list I've never tried. I just give my opponent puppy dog eyes. It works 90% of the time. Suckers!

I would always remind a player if he forgot something and I noticed whatever the game. Its called sportsmanship.

If its a new player or a friendly game I'll point out things like forgetting abilities or whatever. I don't see the point in winning because your opponent forgot something.

If its an especially new player and they performed a maneuver but forgot to do an action and moved on I tell them to put a focus token on the model. Maybe not what they wanted to do but at least its something.

Most of the time I'll ask my opponent "Action?" after he moves a ship and doesn't declare the action immediately, as though I want to confirm for myself what he's doing. He gets his action and we don't lose a whole lot of time on it. But I certainly won't demand the same from my opponent, or question his character if he allows me to miss something (how would I know that he spotted it, anyway)?

That being said, it depends on a number of factors. Is the ability optional? Is the opponent experienced enough that he should know better? Is it a friendly match or a tournament round? Have they already been reminded before? There are too many variables to have a hard and fast rule on this.

I would remind the guy about his cards. To me, this is a game. It's about having fun. While I like to win, I like to win honestly. We all have bad days. We all start somewhere. I'd rather make sure the other guy has fun and is laughing by the end of the game and wants to come back.

If it were a tournament, I'd still probably tell the guy....unless he was being a jerk.

I'd expect in a friendly game for the person to tell me that they are trying out a new list and to ask to be told if they forget something. Not get mad when you point out that something they did is not correct. I've done lots of things that are not legal or forgotten to take actions as I'm learning. It's why you play friendly games.

On the other hand, it frustrates me to watch someone play in a competition in anything and give their opponent the option to fix a mistake. After the game, it's fine to say, I was surprised to see you not take your actions, or not roll gunner. But if your objective is to win, why would you point this out? Conversely if you are playing for fun you should not get upset when someone points out a mistake. You are allowed to be frustrated with yourself for forgetting, but don't take it out on the guy/gal across the table. I find it also helps to state the feeling out loud. "I get so frustrated at myself when I make mistakes, thanks for pointing that out."

Competitive people strive for perfection and sometimes their anger at themselves can be taken the wrong way by an opponent, if not handled properly. By verbalizing the internal frustration, you diffuse the situation and keep the game friendly. Additionally if you find yourself getting frustrated or angry at yourself or your opponent, it doesn't hurt to ask to step away for a minute, get a drink or get some air. Now if the person is obviously angry with you for pointing out a learning opportunity, then maybe you just don't play them anymore. Or if you know them well, take the time to ask them why they are getting angry. They may not realize they are doing it and are just displacing anger about something else going on in their life. Who knows that guy being a jerk across the table may just be having a bad day. You could help them realize they are having a hard time in life and could end up with a long term friend.

Having read though all of this I realize there was one step of the X-Wing game process he forgot to do before our game and after reading so many replies I now know why that step is so important. Call it a tradition or custom of x-wing, but before every game I always walk through my list with my opponent. I tend to play a tricky list most of the time and not everyone remembers what Carnor Jax's ability is. Now that I think back to it he didn't walk through his list, not sure if that would have helped the situation or not but it couldn't have hurt.

Reading the responses so far I see a lot of people differentiate between casual and competitive gaming. I played 40k for years and watched as during 5th edition the competitive scene hit it's absolute zenith. There became this massive devision of players into carebears, win at all cost players, and hobbyists to name a few groups. I played in a few tournaments here and there but the scene became so competitive and vicious it turned me off of 40K forever. I'm not saying that X-Wing is headed in that direction, I have seen people's passions flair but I have yet to see a fist fight break out over a dice roll (actually happened). Usually it seems everyone has a good time playing even if we lose, I think that is part of the fun of a game like this. However I do worry that I might let me competitive spirit gets the best of me sometimes.

A few times, but in some games you'll just go to time trying to teach them everything. Won't go that far.

I remind my opponent of things that should be automatic in his list (predator, rebel captive, regenerate a shield after a green maneuver on R2, etc.) that there's really no reason skip. Mostly I do this because I feel like it creates a more enjoyable atmosphere to play the game but I also want to play against my opponents's list at its best possible efficiency so I can become a better player myself. Tactical decisions or upgrades with consequences (stress droid, Vader, etc.) are completely up to my opponent.

You hold his hand and help him play his own list.

Why? Because you are a good person. Because it makes him a better player. Because you'd rather beat him at his best.

For me, it is because I get a very limited amount of time to play this game each month and beating someone who is not thinking straight iinteresting challenging than beating someone with a low IQ.

I try to have a level of sportsmanship for my opponent that I would like to see in return. So I know that I occasionally (less and less as time goes on) forget upgrades or abilities, and would like my opponent to remind me when I do. So I remind him when he does. If he takes it the wrong way, I won't bother in future. I'm not too bothered about the "best" way for someone to learn from their mistakes, inasmuch as I want our specific game to be as error-free as possible, for a variety of reasons.

While I would by no means expect my opponent to remind me of my upgrades and abilities, I think intentionally trying to win on a mistake makes you a bit of a dork. If you want to win that badly, take it. You want it more than I do.

I always try to remind my opponents to take actions and use abilities when it seems obvious that they are forgetting. However, I won't give them tactical advice.

I always try to remind my opponents to take actions and use abilities when it seems obvious that they are forgetting. However, I won't give them tactical advice.

Yeah, that's how I feel as well. That's why when my opponent has obviously forgotten his action and we've moved on, maybe to shooting or to another model (depending on when we notice it) I'll usually allow them to focus, but usually not something else like target locking or barrel rolling.

In the OP's case, I'd say it's less a matter of good sportsmanship as it is ensuring the game's being played correctly. A YT-2400 shooting out of arc with a HLC without the Outrider title is something that can't happen. If my opponent's trying to do something that they cannot do in X-Wing, then I'll point that out every time, in the interests of playing by the rules.

Though regarding pointing out opponents' lists and abilities, in a casual game I have no qualm with it if it's someone's first time flying it, or if they're new to the game. Experienced I'd be less likely to point out; I wouldn't let myself correct a mistake I'd made, I think I should know better by now, and remember my own abilities and all. Though saying that, my casual crowd tends to have a house rule where if you forgot to perform an action, we just say you performed a focus, since every ship can do that.

If it's a mandatory effect, then as I said earlier I'd point that out, want to play the game as it's defined (unless we're doing something crazy like randomly moving asteroids).

Competitive setting, I'd say if it wasn't a mandatory effect, I more than likely wouldn't point out an opponent's mistake. And I wouldn't expect them to point out mine, we're not playing casually there and if I forgot to get a focus for my proton rockets and got into range 1 to use them, well, I'm not going to use proton rockets, because I really should have had a focus, and known that.

So as with all things on definitions of sportsmanship it all comes down to setting, who you're playing with and whether what the'yre doing is either intentionally or unintentionally breaking the rules. The last part I'd say is the most important.

The burned hand teaches best. That whole playing them at there best is complete hog wash in my opinion.

Now if you're showing them the game or they are asking you to teach them then that's one thing.

I was at regionals last year and I forgot to shoot with a ship. It was ps2 and was supposed to shoot last anyway and we were near the end of the game. We started setting our dials and when I got to my y wing dial it struck me that I forgot to shoot with him. I asked him if I could shoot real quick since he was the last shot anyway and we haven't even moved ships. His bounty hunter was range 1 of my y wing and this primary attack could have killed it and won me the game. He said no since he already started planning his moves. I just said oh OK and kept playing I never got that good of a shot again and the game went to time and he won knocking me down to 18th place and missing the cut. Yeah I was bummed out but you know what I've never done since? I've never forgotten an attack or action since. Why? Because I never wanted that to happen again so when I'd play with friends I told them to hold me to the highest standard and not let me take missed actions, or do take backs or anything. It really cleaned up the way I play and I like to think I play at a high level of how the rules are written.

You can take advantage of a mistake and not be a jerk about it. You can also make a mistake and own it like a men and take your medicine. Keep playing and minimize mistakes.

I'll have to respectfully disagree with you. Sportsmanship doesn't have caveats of setting or who the players are. Sportmanship is about whether or not you want to play the game the way it was intended to be played. That means being fair, being courteous, being respectful, and not trying to take advantage of situations outside the intent of the game.

You'd be hard pressed to convince me that winning a game of X-Wing is supposed to be about capitalizing on your opponent's forgetfulness but hey, if you truly believe that, I'm all ears. Otherwise, I want to win a game of X-Wing, not simply defeat an opponent.

So as with all things on definitions of sportsmanship it all comes down to setting, who you're playing with and whether what the'yre doing is either intentionally or unintentionally breaking the rules. The last part I'd say is the most important.

I'll have to respectfully disagree with you. Sportsmanship doesn't have caveats of setting or who the players are. Sportmanship is about whether or not you want to play the game the way it was intended to be played. That means being fair, being courteous, being respectful, and not trying to take advantage of situations outside the intent of the game.

You'd be hard pressed to convince me that winning a game of X-Wing is supposed to be about capitalizing on your opponent's forgetfulness but hey, if you truly believe that, I'm all ears. Otherwise, I want to win a game of X-Wing, not simply defeat an opponent.

So I guess in football when there's a false start or too many men on the field the other team aren't being good sports for accepting the penalty?

So as with all things on definitions of sportsmanship it all comes down to setting, who you're playing with and whether what the'yre doing is either intentionally or unintentionally breaking the rules. The last part I'd say is the most important.

I'll have to respectfully disagree with you. Sportsmanship doesn't have caveats of setting or who the players are. Sportmanship is about whether or not you want to play the game the way it was intended to be played. That means being fair, being courteous, being respectful, and not trying to take advantage of situations outside the intent of the game.

You'd be hard pressed to convince me that winning a game of X-Wing is supposed to be about capitalizing on your opponent's forgetfulness but hey, if you truly believe that, I'm all ears. Otherwise, I want to win a game of X-Wing, not simply defeat an opponent.

So I guess in football when there's a false start or too many men on the field the other team aren't being good sports for accepting the penalty?

That's a terrible analogy. Infractions of the game's rules is not the same thing as forgetfulness. Instead, it would be like a quarterback forgetting that you can use you hands in football with you just standing there letting him try to take the snap with his teeth.

So as with all things on definitions of sportsmanship it all comes down to setting, who you're playing with and whether what the'yre doing is either intentionally or unintentionally breaking the rules. The last part I'd say is the most important.

I'll have to respectfully disagree with you. Sportsmanship doesn't have caveats of setting or who the players are. Sportmanship is about whether or not you want to play the game the way it was intended to be played. That means being fair, being courteous, being respectful, and not trying to take advantage of situations outside the intent of the game.

You'd be hard pressed to convince me that winning a game of X-Wing is supposed to be about capitalizing on your opponent's forgetfulness but hey, if you truly believe that, I'm all ears. Otherwise, I want to win a game of X-Wing, not simply defeat an opponent.

So I guess in football when there's a false start or too many men on the field the other team aren't being good sports for accepting the penalty?

That's a terrible analogy. Infractions of the game's rules is not the same thing as forgetfulness. Instead, it would be like a quarterback forgetting that you can use you hands in football with you just standing there letting him try to take the snap with his teeth.

The rules clearly talk about missed opportunities. So because it is in the rules I would say that capitalizing on a mistake is not poor sportsmanship. Again if you act like jerk while doing it then yes you're a bad sport.