Warlord dirty trick - Legal?

By HarleyWarren, in Talisman Rules Questions

When playing the Warlord. I can use his special ability to conscript bad Followers such as the Hag, The Black Cat, The Old Man of the Sea, the Gremlin, DeathStalker, or the Jynx.

"When you encounter a Follower you may immediately conscript it. Take that Follower as a conscripted Follower, even if you normally could not take it. Ignore all the card text on your conscripted Followers and instead treat them as if they said: Add 1 to your Strength during battle"

I am now able to carry around bad followers with no ill effects. I then enter the Inner region and gleefully ditch one (or possibly more) of the really awful followers on the Plain of Peril and head off to the Crown of Command knowing that in most cases, any other characters who dare follow me must take these followers when they step onto the Plain of Peril.

At first, I though this was disallowed by the FAQ entry on cards that become followers where it states that you are not allowed to ditch a card that becomes a Follower and if you are somehow forced to ditch it then the card is discarded. However, these cards are already followers, so it appears to be completely legal. Thoughts?

Edited by HarleyWarren

However, these cards are already followers, so it appears to be completely legal. Thoughts?

I agree with your reasoning. They never cease to be Followers and you ignore their text, including the part that says you cannot ditch them. When they are ditched, they don't follow the rules for cards that become Followers, so they are not discarded. It's a good idea to ditch them the Plain of Peril (or the Valley of Fire, unless they have Arnkell or Cloak of Feathers).

This is something I've never thought of and it's a clever move. It's not something you can do every game, but it's good when it happens. Thanks for sharing. :)

Wonderful strategy! Fire them from your army and they will resume their nasty behavior against those who cannot conscript them. :)

Now if that one made you think, try this. Consider playing the Tinkerer, if you use his special ability:

"You may turn any Objects you have into automated Followers: You may use the abilities and effects of automated Followers as normal (Weapon and Armour limits still apply).
Automated Followers are no longer considered Objects and do not count towards your carrying capacity.
After you encounter a space and have drawn the required number of cards, you may discard an automated Follower to discard any number of cards on the space and draw new cards to replace them, which you must encounter."

This gets very interesting, having both good and ill effects. You can't steal the Tinker's Automated Followers as they are no longer considered to be Objects, so an opponent cannot use the Acquire Spell to steal one or a Shatter Spell to discard one. Nor can the Thief steal one. Also, since these are in fact cards that have become Followers, according to the FAQ, they are only a Follower to the Tinkerer, so it cannot Mesmerized or grabbed by any Follower ability of another player. On the down side, the Tinkerer can never ditch them, and if he gets turned into a Toad, rather than ditching them, they must all be discarded.

Now if that one made you think, try this. Consider playing the Tinkerer, if you use his special ability:

"You may turn any Objects you have into automated Followers: You may use the abilities and effects of automated Followers as normal (Weapon and Armour limits still apply).

Automated Followers are no longer considered Objects and do not count towards your carrying capacity.

After you encounter a space and have drawn the required number of cards, you may discard an automated Follower to discard any number of cards on the space and draw new cards to replace them, which you must encounter."

This gets very interesting, having both good and ill effects. You can't steal the Tinker's Automated Followers as they are no longer considered to be Objects, so an opponent cannot use the Acquire Spell to steal one or a Shatter Spell to discard one. Nor can the Thief steal one. Also, since these are in fact cards that have become Followers, according to the FAQ, they are only a Follower to the Tinkerer, so it cannot Mesmerized or grabbed by any Follower ability of another player. On the down side, the Tinkerer can never ditch them, and if he gets turned into a Toad, rather than ditching them, they must all be discarded.

This one I know, I've spotted it right when the character came out. :P

Apparently it's obvious for the Tinkerer to turn all of his Objects into automated Followers to keep them safe from other characters, but this is not worth doing on standard Objects like the ones you start the game with. Once they're automated Followers, they are not Objects and cannot be alchemised for gold in case you need it. It's unclear whether the transformation is irreversible or not, but I think it's more appropriate that Objects cannot return to their previous state once automated.

Edited by The_Warlock

I thought you could ditch any follower? Even if it's a "card that became a follower?" Like the Minstrel can ditch his charmed animal, right? It's just that ditch = discard in that case.

I thought the only followers that couldn't be ditched are those "you must take..."

From the FAQ and the Minstrel is specifically referenced:

Cards That Become Followers
Some cards and special abilities allow characters to take cards as Followers even if the card type is not actually listed as a Follower. For example, the Minstrel’s special ability allows him to charm Animals into joining him as Followers. A character that has these Followers in his play area treats them as normal Followers in all regards, except he cannot choose to ditch them . If another character has an ability that affects Followers, he cannot target a card that has become a Follower.

Example: A character cannot cast Mesmerism to take one of the Minstrel’s charmed Animals because it is only considered a Follower to the Minstrel.

If a character is forced to ditch or leave a card that has become a Follower (such as the Cell space in the Dungeon, getting turned into a Toad, or because the character is killed), the Follower must be discarded instead .

Edited by HarleyWarren

Oops, thanks!

That is an awesome strategy for the Warlord! And it reminded me of a question about the Warlord I had forgotten.

The Warlord can only conscript Followers when they encounter them, or when they have defeated another character and take a Follower as a conscripted Follower in addition to the normal reward. Where this gets weird is when the Nether Bane is passed to them from the player to their right. Encounters, as described on Pg. 9 of the rulebook, don't include something like this, so would this mean that the Nether Bane couldn't be conscripted when simply passed to them? Same goes for the Warlord receiving a Follower from another player due to the Faerie Market event.

The Warlord can only conscript Followers when they encounter them, or when they have defeated another character and take a Follower as a conscripted Follower in addition to the normal reward. Where this gets weird is when the Nether Bane is passed to them from the player to their right. Encounters, as described on Pg. 9 of the rulebook, don't include something like this, so would this mean that the Nether Bane couldn't be conscripted when simply passed to them? Same goes for the Warlord receiving a Follower from another player due to the Faerie Market event.

Fully agree with you.