I think people are too focused on ATC as being an auto-include. While it is arguably the best offensive upgrade, especially on Vader and Maarek; we are given several good options in system upgrades. Accuracy Corrector being another one. I personally have a soft spot for Sensor Jammer, it doesn't get enough respect. I've used it and R2-D2 on an E-Wing and SJ prevented more damage than R2 did (something like 4 damage I think).

All that to say that Advanced Targeting Computer is probably the best upgrade for the named Tie Advances (which is why it costs you 1 point instead of being free), but it is in no way the only upgrade that makes the ship worth it.

Just a month ago Vader with Outmaneuver and Engine Upgrade was considered a decent ship. Albeit, light on the offense department, but still viable.

You're not wrong; ATC is definitely the new toy we can't wait to play with. It's the shiniest of what's been spoiled so far and theory-wing loves novelty. I think Vader with Sensor Jammer will definitely be viable, but serves a different, less aggressive role than the ATC build currently in vogue.

Also, I suspect that among the unspoiled Advanced ship cards there will be pilots who synergize well with the other System Upgrade cards. There's still 3 we haven't seen yet.

Aye, agreed with LB

While I don't really think Jammer serves much purpose on such already defensively capable ships, we may well see one of the 3 named pilots going HAM with it (maybe Carnor Jax V2?) and we will definetly see AC on a few of them (especially the generics, who can't really plop target locks on the right ship) because then they get to take evade/roll actions or K-turn with no offensive repercussions

with high-cost pilots such as Vader, though, I feel an innate damage of at least 3 is a must to make them worth their points value especially in this gallizon hull + shield or green dice Meta. Otherwise, they just won't make enough of an impact and take away points from the rest of the squad needlessly.

A Vader with Jammer may be incredibly difficult to kill, but fat Han is (almost) literally immortal against him.

Also, I suspect that among the unspoiled Advanced ship cards there will be pilots who synergize well with the other System Upgrade cards. There's still 3 we haven't seen yet.

That would be awfully nice.

Very true. I wonder if Accuracy Corrector with Outmaneuver would put out enough damage. You could still spend your two actions to reposition/turtle up.

And no C-3P0 for morbidly obese Solo!

You could also see Proton Rockets on Vader with Sensor Jammer, too. He stays alive longer to get into that position where he can fire it. With his ability to do 2 actions, I could see him pulling off a Focus / TL at just the right time.

Outmaneuver is a good idea, though. I like it. You turtle up and fire each turn. It might work, especially in a timed tournament event.

You could also see Proton Rockets on Vader with Sensor Jammer, too. He stays alive longer to get into that position where he can fire it. With his ability to do 2 actions, I could see him pulling off a Focus / TL at just the right time.

Outmaneuver is a good idea, though. I like it. You turtle up and fire each turn. It might work, especially in a timed tournament event.

Por que nao los dos?

(...yaaaaaaaaay)

Por que Vader só pode ter um.

Por que Vader só pode ter um.

between outmanuever, jammer, and rockets? hell no, you can stack that ****

SJ+ Outmn would be fun to try, I bet Vader could stretch those 5 hits for a looooong time.

He Has Two Actions, 3 Agility, and Shields! even with his new offensive bumps he should be one of the harder ships to kill.

Try focus and evade or better yet, boost and barrel roll to just get our of firing arcs.

Any ship in the game will go down if your opponent is willing to ignore the rest of the force to kill it. So You need to make sure that the rest of your force is something that should not be ignored.

vader should always have advanced sensors with the new fix. He must never lose his two actions. Period. He is the ultimate action economy ship. Throw on EI and 3 actions a turn that cannot be stopped if you need them.

IMO

vader should always have advanced sensors with the new fix. He must never lose his two actions. Period. He is the ultimate action economy ship. Throw on EI and 3 actions a turn that cannot be stopped if you need them.

IMO

Sadly, Vader does not work with Advanced Sensors, his ability says "during the perform action step".

vader should always have advanced sensors with the new fix. He must never lose his two actions. Period. He is the ultimate action economy ship. Throw on EI and 3 actions a turn that cannot be stopped if you need them.

IMO

Sadly, Vader does not work with Advanced Sensors, his ability says "during the perform action step".

And sensors say skip, so this is absolutely correct

Either way, though, Vader with Advance Sensors really wouldn't be all that amazing. As long as he's limited to 2 attack dice without system modifiers, he's basically an A-wing with a worse dial balanced by having what is essentially PTL that doesn't stress him.

No matter how awesome he is, no matter how many actions he gets, his value is still going to have to be measured by how many of the opponent's points he can efficiently kill or help kill. Because this value was laughably low across all advance pilots relative to their cost...well, it's how we got the fix in the first place.

And sensors say skip, so this is absolutely correct

Either way, though, Vader with Advance Sensors really wouldn't be all that amazing. As long as he's limited to 2 attack dice without system modifiers, he's basically an A-wing with a worse dial balanced by having what is essentially PTL that doesn't stress him.

No matter how awesome he is, no matter how many actions he gets, his value is still going to have to be measured by how many of the opponent's points he can efficiently kill or help kill. Because this value was laughably low across all advance pilots relative to their cost...well, it's how we got the fix in the first place.

Harsh, but very true. For the record, I am very excited about ATC. I'ts exactly what the Tie Advance has been looking for since Wave 1.

*Edit: Whoops, quote mechanic didn't work. I was quoting FickleGreenDice.

Darn. I didn't realize that. Well that sucks!

For super burst offensive Vader (although Maarek works better) - Deadeye, Cluster Missiles, ATC. TL the first turn, then focus up (or both at once with Vader) spend the focus to use CM. 2 Attacks rolling 3 Red + 1 Guaranteed Crit. Some super burst, especially against log Agility ships (Falcons or even Outriders).

ATC is primary weapon only.

Oops, missed that part. That particular combo is probably the reason.

It means you can save points by not buying ordnance though.

Indeed. If you want super burst damage vader, I suggest:

• TIE x1 title
• Accuracy Corrector/Fire Control System (to taste)
• Cluster Missiles
• Ruthlessness

Makes for some scary one-turn crowd control.

Advanced Sensors on Vader does cost you an action, because you can't use his ability. I suggest, however, that you're only going to use it when either (a) you're blocked or (b) you're pulling a red manouvre, in which case you're getting one action instead of none. The fact that you'd like to have two is irrelevant.

Pulling a barrel roll before you manouvre and not getting blocked and killed, or carrying an evade token through a koiogran turn, is still worth considering on what is, after all, a free upgrade.

If you were to take this, I would definitely take outmaneuver and/or predator, and proton rockets, though - if you're using the sensor slot to amp your ability to manouvre, you need to beef up your firepower with ordnance and/or elite talents.

Advanced Targeting Computer is an obvious, good and easy to use system, but it's not without its downsides - whilst it's only 1 point, and it's re-useable, it does have all the target lock-related downsides that ordnance normally suffers from, so it may not be the best choice for Tempest Squadron Pilots.