Or save a bucket of points and take Hera as crew? Then you can Red maneuver all day long. Lay that Stress till you can't see the model for all the tokens!

Hera is sadly one stress max and minimal (re: utterly unmodified) offense

Hence gunner

Hera is sadly one stress max and minimal (re: utterly unmodified) offense

Hence gunner

Was hera FAQ'd?

Hera is sadly one stress max and minimal (re: utterly unmodified) offense

Hence gunner

Was hera FAQ'd?

Yeahwhen did there become a 1 stress maximum on Hera? I dont recall there being a 1 stress maximum mentioned o nthe card.

we're talking about r3-a2 here, folks

gunner --> additional attack --> additional r3-a2 stress

hera --> no such thing --> one r3-a2 stress

we're talking about r3-a2 here, folks

gunner --> additional attack --> additional r3-a2 stress

hera --> no such thing --> one r3-a2 stress

Aaah, gotcha!

Wish FFG would hurry up and give us the preview article, I want to know what the tail gunner does! Would go some way to cheering me up after the you-know-what...

So this comes up a lot when people like me say we want prequel ships in X-Wing, and nasty people who don't want me to be happy say "not gonna happen - FFG have said X-Wing is Galactic Civil War era only, loser". But, as was pointed out to be the other day, and which I don't recall seeing mentioned here before: according to wookipedia

During the Galactic Civil War, ARC-170s could be found in both Imperial and Rebel fleets, where they were considered elite craft.^[19]

which means we can totally have them in X-Wing, right?! I think they'd have to be restricted to Rebels just cos they look so Rebely.

I picture them having an arc like a Firespray, and some way of firing from both in one turn. This could be like a built in gunner ("once per turn after performing a primary weapon attack that misses you may perform a second primary weapon attack from the opposite arc") or it could be something you can always use, even if the first attack hits. The trouble with that would be that it would be so valuable that it would have to be very expensive, but that you'll struggle to utilize against a good opponent. I suppose everything have cost balancing issues like that to consider though.

Who Says FFG doesn't Read the forums

So this comes up a lot when people like me say we want prequel ships in X-Wing, and nasty people who don't want me to be happy say "not gonna happen - FFG have said X-Wing is Galactic Civil War era only, loser". But, as was pointed out to be the other day, and which I don't recall seeing mentioned here before: according to wookipedia

During the Galactic Civil War, ARC-170s could be found in both Imperial and Rebel fleets, where they were considered elite craft.^[19]

which means we can totally have them in X-Wing, right?! I think they'd have to be restricted to Rebels just cos they look so Rebely.

I picture them having an arc like a Firespray, and some way of firing from both in one turn. This could be like a built in gunner ("once per turn after performing a primary weapon attack that misses you may perform a second primary weapon attack from the opposite arc") or it could be something you can always use, even if the first attack hits. The trouble with that would be that it would be so valuable that it would have to be very expensive, but that you'll struggle to utilize against a good opponent. I suppose everything have cost balancing issues like that to consider though.

Who Says FFG doesn't Read the forums

I've changed my mind a little since then - I don't think being able to shoot from both arcs would be especially useful, especially if gaining that ability meant not taking Recon. Spec. or Weapons Eng., meaning one attack would be unmodified.

shooting from both arcs at once is one of those things that seems awesome but is so wildly situational that you will use it, if at all, maybe once every 10 or so games

you need to have two different targets in two different arcs, which is no easy matter

just like the akbar slash in armada, it's far easier said than done and it's just often FAR more helpful to concentrate fire on priority targets

I rate Alliance Overhaul way over Special Forces Training in this regard; the aux arc benefit is far more generally useful.

ofc the tie/sf is also a cheaper ship due to how situational the aux arc benefit is

we're talking about r3-a2 here, folks

gunner --> additional attack --> additional r3-a2 stress

hera --> no such thing --> one r3-a2 stress

we're talking about r3-a2 here, folks

gunner --> additional attack --> additional r3-a2 stress

hera --> no such thing --> one r3-a2 stress

Now it makes sense. But that assumes you are willing to pay extra points in the hope that you miss, yes? If it didn't boost the tail gun you might even want to run Gunner - R3-A2 without the title in that case.

Besides, you WILL miss. We're talking otherwise unmodified attacks with no crackshot, gunner WILL be triggering or you'll be getting lucky.

And the title bonus is too good to ever pass up (plus I believe it's optional)

Yup double checked. Both title benefits are "you may" to make the odds of gunner as perfect as possible

shooting from both arcs at once is one of those things that seems awesome but is so wildly situational that you will use it, if at all, maybe once every 10 or so games

you need to have two different targets in two different arcs, which is no easy matter

just like the akbar slash in armada, it's far easier said than done and it's just often FAR more helpful to concentrate fire on priority targets

I rate Alliance Overhaul way over Special Forces Training in this regard; the aux arc benefit is far more generally useful.

ofc the tie/sf is also a cheaper ship due to how situational the aux arc benefit is

Exactly.

I haven't tried the Ackbar Slash, but I'd have thought that'd be easier than getting a double arc shot in X-Wing - bigger arcs, more slowly moving ships.

Akbar slash, aka turdsandwich, is just asking to get your mc80 ruined by close range imperial firepower on both sides

Anyway

The other interesting r3-a2 build is something Biophysical game up with which is

Kyle katarn + r3-a2 enabling norra to focus + TL without ptl. The stress on enemies is just a nice bonus

You can predator or VI (with vector thrusters too!) for some interesting flexibility despite a very rigid ability that requires both TL and focus mods

For hera, stay on target and targeting Astro (target keyword; coincidence!?!?!?) seem to be clear winners. Just hope the PS 3/4 synergize with SoT. Sharas sorta synergizes with targeting astro...sorta.

Akbar slash, aka turdsandwich, is just asking to get your mc80 ruined by close range imperial firepower on both sides

Anyway

The other interesting r3-a2 build is something Biophysical game up with which is

Kyle katarn + r3-a2 enabling norra to focus + TL without ptl. The stress on enemies is just a nice bonus

You can predator or VI (with vector thrusters too!) for some interesting flexibility despite a very rigid ability that requires both TL and focus mods

For hera, stay on target and targeting Astro (target keyword; coincidence!?!?!?) seem to be clear winners. Just hope the PS 3/4 synergize with SoT. Sharas sorta synergizes with targeting astro...sorta.

I didn't say it was a good idea That said, some people seem to think it works for them. I imagine you'd expect to take a lot of damage, just depends whether you think you can do more before you're destroyed.

Hmm, I like that combo.

just to point put

just to point put

Why does that Cylon ARC 170 have an imperial logo on it?

I love the tiny hal-9000 eye on it

but the ARC_170 would never gel with the imperial aesthetic in X-wing miniatures, both in form and paint scheme

the fact that the Tie/sf is coming out in the same Wave and doing, essentially, the same thing (small base aux-arc with 0 point rule bending title) nixes any hope that the empire will get the ARCs they used to use

which makes sense. The Tie Fighter is in no way shape or form a superior design, realistically speaking, but in lore it's supposed to be a very advanced fighter (but also really really cheap, because hey even the empire isn't made of UNLIMITED POWAH)

the advances in the Tie Fighter apparently come through mostly in its speed and maneuverability (represented well in x-wing minis, relative to most rebel craft imo including the arc), which really aren't shown off well in the movies because they're flown by freaking lemmings

but, in theory, the ARC-170 has no purpose being imperial anymore. It's an antique, and that's more rebel territory (or scum)

Just artistically speaking, the ARC-170 has no business being Imperial. It's design screams Rebel. It's an expensive, large, bulky, durable craft with heavy firepower. The concepts that make an ARC-170 an ARC-170 are completely divorced from the core concepts of Imperial design, which is primarily being cheap, disposable, lightweight, and fast.

It just makes the most sense to me that the Rebels get the ARC-170, as a ship like that is just up their alley. The idea is that the Empire has legions of lemming pilots in lemming ships. When you lose a cheap ship, you're only losing one pilot, the core concept being to wring every bit of firepower out of an individual ship as possible with minimal losses. With the Rebel Alliance, each pilot is more precious, but more skilled and more protected. By putting those skills in a durable frame with as much firepower as possible, the idea is the exact opposite of the Empire; to get as much out of the PILOT as possible. The ARC-170 to me is the culmination of those ideas; You risk up to 3 pilots(and an astromech), but for every additional pilot, you're getting that much more out of the ship.

You can see this in X-Wing too. Typically, ships that have co-pilots have a crew slot. Not gunners for turrets, but a co-pilot. For the Rebels, the ARC-170 will be the 5th small ship to have access to a crew slot, along with the Attack Shuttle, B-Wing, K-Wing, and the HWK-290. The Imperials have 2 small ships with a crew slot; The TIE Phantom, and the TIE Bomber(which sacrifices all ordnance to get them). This is the same reason that no imperial ships use an astromech droid. That's an additional, unnecessary cost added to each of that ship.

The ARC-170 never had a chance to be an Imperial ship.

Just artistically speaking, the ARC-170 has no business being Imperial. It's design screams Rebel. It's an expensive, large, bulky, durable craft with heavy firepower. The concepts that make an ARC-170 an ARC-170 are completely divorced from the core concepts of Imperial design, which is primarily being cheap, disposable, lightweight, and fast.

very well said

the thing about the ARC-170 that's weird is...well, it's a prequel ship. Even if the prequels were well handled, there's that confusing bit of imagery to deal with specifically in the make up of the Republic's Fleet

specifically, we have the Venator-class Cruisers, within which we can see the seeds of the ISD

there's also the...whatever the hell it's called Jedi Starfighter from Revenge of the Sith (the one Ani and Obi flew; rocking the "Tie" style cockpit design)

plus, there's even the proto-ATAT. Between these three elements, you can plainly see that the design team knew they were setting the stage for the rise of the empire out of the ashes of the republic

but then there's the ARC which, while I have nothing against the design (I actually personally love it and will be buying at least two), is a product of the tonal dissonance in the prequels.

there is nothing "imperial" about the ARC-170

1.) it's got "S-foils", which we all know from the X-wing (and B-wing). I think the gun/missileboat might've had them in the video games too? but, lets be honest, those boats aren't nearly as iconic as Ties

2.) It's a multi-seater starfighter with a rear-facing gun. The only parallel there is the Snowspeeders from Empire Strikes back

3.) freaking astromechs in the same spot the X-wing has them (as opposed to the Jedi interceptors that had the astromechs kinda sticking out on the inside of the left wing; leaving the Tie cock-pit as the focal point)

the only thing the ARC-170 could be an immediate precursor to is the X. They are, visually, very similar

The cynic in me says they were designed specifically to implant some OT nostalgia and emotional attachment to the otherwise (imo) lifeless fight scene at the start of Revenge of the Sith

but the prequels are made, and we've been left with one cool looking ship that's been gifted by the modeling wizards at FFG to its proper faction

the ARC-170 is going to be a glorious sight to behold alongside all the OT and EU ships already available

Just artistically speaking, the ARC-170 has no business being Imperial. It's design screams Rebel. It's an expensive, large, bulky, durable craft with heavy firepower. The concepts that make an ARC-170 an ARC-170 are completely divorced from the core concepts of Imperial design, which is primarily being cheap, disposable, lightweight, and fast.

very well said

the thing about the ARC-170 that's weird is...well, it's a prequel ship. Even if the prequels were well handled, there's that confusing bit of imagery to deal with specifically in the make up of the Republic's Fleet

specifically, we have the Venator-class Cruisers, within which we can see the seeds of the ISD

there's also the...whatever the hell it's called Jedi Starfighter from Revenge of the Sith (the one Ani and Obi flew; rocking the "Tie" style cockpit design)

plus, there's even the proto-ATAT. Between these three elements, you can plainly see that the design team knew they were setting the stage for the rise of the empire out of the ashes of the republic

but then there's the ARC which, while I have nothing against the design (I actually personally love it and will be buying at least two), is a product of the tonal dissonance in the prequels.

there is nothing "imperial" about the ARC-170

1.) it's got "S-foils", which we all know from the X-wing (and B-wing). I think the gun/missileboat might've had them in the video games too? but, lets be honest, those boats aren't nearly as iconic as Ties

2.) It's a multi-seater starfighter with a rear-facing gun. The only parallel there is the Snowspeeders from Empire Strikes back

3.) freaking astromechs in the same spot the X-wing has them (as opposed to the Jedi interceptors that had the astromechs kinda sticking out on the inside of the left wing; leaving the Tie cock-pit as the focal point)

the only thing the ARC-170 could be an immediate precursor to is the X. They are, visually, very similar

The cynic in me says they were designed specifically to implant some OT nostalgia and emotional attachment to the otherwise (imo) lifeless fight scene at the start of Revenge of the Sith

but the prequels are made, and we've been left with one cool looking ship that's been gifted by the modeling wizards at FFG to its proper faction

the ARC-170 is going to be a glorious sight to behold alongside all the OT and EU ships already available

Yeah, i agree with basically everything here. You can see a lot of precursor stuff in the military vehicles to both sides of the GCW. The Eta-2(That was the Ep. 3 Jedi Starfighter) was an obvious precursor to TIE variants along with the V-Wing, the ARC-170 shared common design traits with the X-Wing, so on. And i think where the big difference comes in is that the Republic isn't...QUITE the Empire, but some of it's tactics are similar. The V-Wing being a big example; Those were the TIE Fighters of it's time. Small, fast, maneuverable, and deployed in swarms. The big difference is the line at which it is drawn; The V-Wing possesses shields. It has an astromech slot. It's not a cheap craft, coming in at about 100,000 credits. They were expertly built. Designed with extremely durable components, as unlike a TIE Fighter, the Republic was hoping to keep it's V-Wings alive.

And that's where you really see the Rebel part of the Republic. After all, the Rebellion is trying to restore the Republic, and keeps it's philosophies at heart. For everything that the Republic built that in one way or another became Imperial, there is an equal part of that piece of equipment that becomes Rebel. Even with the Eta-2, it has an astromech slot, ion cannons, and heat-radiating S-Foils. It has life-support. Meanwhile, it's a tiny, ludicrously fast and maneuverable craft with no shields and possesses critical parts of TIE Fighter design like it's engines, targeting computer, and survival philosophy based on simply not being hit at all.

In one way or another, everything in the Republic's arsenal is divvied out to one faction or another in the GCW. It's fascinating. I'm not a fan of the prequels very much at all, but i will say this with 100% certainty, there are a lot of ships in the prequels that are worth loving.

Regardless of whether people like or dislike ARC's being used on Imperial side, they were. End of.

Empire used them, until they probably started falling apart and then simply replaced them.

Now, whether they were used long enough for FFG to warrant them being used on Imperial side

within the Xwing game is a different matter.

I will throw a guess that they weren't, unfortunately for me.

So I won't shed tears if I never get to field them on the imperial side.

They look lovely, and I will get to field them anyway on my Rebel side, fine by me .

The cynic in me says they were designed specifically to implant some OT nostalgia and emotional attachment to the otherwise (imo) lifeless fight scene at the start of Revenge of the Sith

I don't buy that - I think it would have been weird if they hadn't shown the beginning of the evolution into the ships from the OT. Personally, I'd have gone further and had them using the actual ships from the OT, at least the rebel ones; the cynic in me says they didn't because they wanted to maximise the number of new toys (and yay for that!).

Regardless of whether people like or dislike ARC's being used on Imperial side, they were. End of.

Empire used them, until they probably started falling apart and then simply replaced them.

Now, whether they were used long enough for FFG to warrant them being used on Imperial side

within the Xwing game is a different matter.

I will throw a guess that they weren't, unfortunately for me.

So I won't shed tears if I never get to field them on the imperial side.

They look lovely, and I will get to field them anyway on my Rebel side, fine by me .

I suspect fluff about how often they were used has no bearing on FFG's choice (other that said fluff putting them in anything less than iconically Imperial status), I think it's 100% about aesthetics.

And the astromech slot, they'd have to introduce a new upgrade type for maybe two ships (ARC and V-wing).