When should you NOT use the Advanced Targeting Computer?

By DraconPyrothayan, in X-Wing

In defense of the other System upgrades:

Enhanced Scopes lets you move as a level 0 pilot. That means:

You have full knowledge of the board-state when you plan your maneuver

You will not be blocked, unless you wish to be

Your action economy is guaranteed, unless you are stressed

You become a substantially better blocker

You activate at the same time as other allied ships with Enhanced Scopes.

This is powerful, but not against this high PS metagame. Still, it's worth considering once the metagame shifts.

It's also not that worth it when you can just buy an Academy for 12 pts. Why turn your high value ship into a blocker? It's a waste of points to me.

Advanced Sensors lets you perform your action before executing your maneuver.

You will not lose action economy to collisions or to red maneuvers.

You can perform a Barrel Roll (or Boost with an upgrade) before executing a maneuver.

You become substantially better at arc-dodging, as any chosen maneuver has 7 (or more with upgrades) different flightpaths. Even Koiograns.

This is what made B-Wings deadly, and now the TIE/A can have it too. We won't use it to quite the same extent, as we deal less damage, but hypermobility would allow us to usually get the Range 1 shot we so desperately need.

Also, it would make for an interesting Stall game. Get the 12 point advantage as swiftly as possible, then spend the rest of the game not getting shot at. It works!

The B-wing also has a native 3 red attack die while the Tie Advanced only has two, but they cost about the same for a generic. The ability to barrel roll before you move is sub-par to the ability to actually make meaningful attacks. I'd rather bump someone and use AC to get hits on someone else than barrel roll out of the way.

Sensor Jammer turns one enemy [{Boom}] result into an [{Eye}] result. They cannot re-roll the result.

If they have no Focus token, or other ability that uses [{Eye}]s, we have simply reduced their damage.

If they have a Focus token, they are now forced to choose whether to use it offensively, or lose damage to defend later.

In the current metagame, I see a lot of people relying on non-action offense, so they can stack up on defense. Sensor Jammer punishes this.

In the current metagame, I see a lot of high PS ships. Sensor Jammer + Opportunist turns this into extra damage for us.

Moreover, the TIE/A has 3 agility, which means that extra damage mitigation turns us into incredible tanks. Our native 2 attack may be piddly, but we'll deal more damage to you than you deal to us!

While this is not that bad, it also isn't that good. First off, they must not have a Focus. If they have one, then it doesn't do anything. So, you have the chance of blocking one of their attacks. Next, when you attack, you still have to roll for it, but get either a Focus or TL of your own. That's alright. You might get 2 hits. If you take AC, you can always take an Evade. This way, you are ALWAYS blocking a hit. Next, you are ALWAYS getting 2 hits in. You don't need the TL or Focus.

One thing I don't think I saw anyone mention on here for Vader is:

Accuracy Corrector + Outmaneuver + Engine Upgrade + Cluster Missiles for one really high damage turn.

This allows Vader to spend most of his time arc dodging his enemies and landing pretty high chances of good damage. Against a B-Wing, it's pretty amazing at range 1-2. 100% chance of 2 damage.

One could still argue for just doing ATC + Outmaneuver instead. The only issue I see with that is, sure in a vacuum, especially in a 1vs1 dog fight, the ATC is probably better most of the time (some cases might still favor the AC, but rarely) but the reality is that you're not going to get Vader down to a 1vs1 fight all that often, at least it doesn't seem that way to me. When you're fighting multiple targets, you're not going to be getting the benefits from ATC on many turns unless you're going to be giving up an action to keep changing your lock so that you can use it's advantage on what's in arc. Meanwhile, you might be better off spending that action getting out of someone's arc or getting into a position that triggers outmaneuver on someone.... or just tanking up.

I don't know. I've been battling in my mind with this a lot lately because I really love Vader in my Imperial Aces list.. I also love burst damage.. and I love being insanely mobile and arc dodging. I'm just having a hard time deciding.

It just seems like arc dodging doesn't really pair up well with ATC. Anyone know if I'm missing anything with being able to arc dodge while taking advantage of ATC? Any piloting suggestions?

Why doesn't arc dodging work with ATC? Once you get the TL on someone, you only need to move it if that target is out of firing arc or dead. With PS 9 and all those movement upgrades, that makes it quite likely you keep them in firing arc.

Edited by heychadwick

Why doesn't arc dodging not work with ATC? Once you get the TL on someone, you only need to move it if that target is out of firing arc or dead. With PS 9 and all those movement upgrades, that makes it quite likely you keep them in firing arc.

Yeah, what he said. ATC and arc-dodging work very well on Vader, because he's the most likely pilot in the game to have an extra action to both reposition and acquire a target lock.

In general, low-PS TIE Advanced want Accuracy Corrector, and high-PS TIE Advanced (who mostly have access to shenanigans that change the action economy) would rather have Advanced Targeting Computer.

This is the second of my threads that's been necro'd today.

I'm starting to get a bit paranoid.

This is the second of my threads that's been necro'd today.

I'm starting to get a bit paranoid.

Bad news: you're gonna need necroing yourself soon.

Good news: someone is practicing.

you people are pretty awesome

You're awesome too BB

This is the second of my threads that's been necro'd today.

I'm starting to get a bit paranoid.

Bad news: you're gonna need necroing yourself soon.

Good news: someone is practicing.

0,o

Not sure whats more depressing, discussing a necro'ed thread that is 3 months old or the fact that the topic of said necro'ed thread is an upgrade card that we still cant play with for about another 2 months....

Because you can go Accuracy Corrector and always choose a defensive action. Also nice to save a point. It also doesn't require you to be target locked onto anything specific, so if you're up against a swarm or something like super Corran who is just going to sponge all of your target locks and then run for the whole game it would be nice to not have to deal with TL.

I agree that ATC is usually the superior option, but AC shouldn't be that bad either.

I'm thinking I'll have to turtle up with Vader for the first portion of the game to keep him alive. He will have a big target. It might be best to save him until mid to late game and let him shine. Use him as a distraction, but keep him alive. At least that's my theory for how I will play him when this card is eventually released...

To make this an easy rule of thumb:

AC for the grunts

ATC for the named

To make this an easy rule of thumb:

AC for the grunts

ATC for the named

That's actually what i've been doing.

Proxed it as well.

I especially liked:

Vader, Title, ATC, Expose, EI (37 points)

3 x Tempest, Title, AC

Vader Predator X1 ATC EU is my standard. He is paired either with vessery and/oror Tempest ACs.(with EU where I can fit them).

Predator on Vader with ATC is really good as you still get the rerolls, let me tell you he is a beast.

By the way, your new sig is awesome.

Edited by DariusAPB

Because you can go Accuracy Corrector and always choose a defensive action. Also nice to save a point. It also doesn't require you to be target locked onto anything specific, so if you're up against a swarm or something like super Corran who is just going to sponge all of your target locks and then run for the whole game it would be nice to not have to deal with TL.

I agree that ATC is usually the superior option, but AC shouldn't be that bad either.

Actually if you run into a 1v1 situation against Corran, more than likely he'll want to fight as you'll be pretty close in points and a modified win is really bsd for tournament score and MoV.

Advanced Sensors is more useful on Vader, since if he's blocked or crashes that's his (pretty fantastic) ability negated.

Advanced Sensors is more useful on Vader, since if he's blocked or crashes that's his (pretty fantastic) ability negated.

Advanced Sensors eliminates his pilot ability, though--Vader gets the one free action indicated by the card, not two.

So it says on the card, I forgot that!

Surely that should be FAQ'd in the wake of the Raider release.

Yeah, the more i test it out, it seems like ATC is probably better on vader unless you absolutely need the point for some reason. I do really like using outmaneuver on him instead of predator though. Reducing an enemy's agility is just so massive.

So it says on the card, I forgot that!

Surely that should be FAQ'd in the wake of the Raider release.

Why would they? The timing of it is pretty clear, even if it is unituitive to people. The same applies to Night Beast.