Or, to answer the question in the title: whenever you feel like it. To my opinion, there's too much talk of how you should only run a ship in a single configuration. Interceptors MUST have PTL or are useless, if you don't put VI on Whisper you are making a mistake. Han without 3P0? Inconceivable!

On the hand people are complaining about the monotonous state of the game, on the other hand people are themselves unwilling to take a list in a different direction, to try something new. Too scared to run something that might be called suboptimal. Where's the innovation?

I'll tell you that 4 naked bombers with 2 alpha interceptors doesn't work as a list...

4 naked bombers with 3 Academies worked quite well for me

I might try that. To be fair, my opponent played it logically and nuked my alphas before they did anything, the 3 Academies is probably the better choice.

If, for some reason, you favor Vader as a squad leader option then having him with sensor jammer could make him far harder to hit, increasing his survivability as he either buffs or realigns weaker PS pilots (maybe Lorrir?).

I won't take anything but Darth Vader for the Tie Advanced, that aside. But I don't see the need for Accuracy Corrector even for the Tempest. The Advanced Targetting Computer is superior. Worst case, you need an action for Target Lock. That is a guaranteed crit and two unmodified red dice giving an average of a crit and a hit, which is statistically already slightly better than two guaranteed hits from AC. Sure, AC frees an action for defence, but the Tie Advanced has already more staying power than any other tie except the Defender.

Unfortunately, it's just not possible with the current range of upgrades

Sure it is, if you want to. Not everything needs to be min/maxed.

You know, just writing it out doesn't make it true.

The very mechanics of the PS 0, Sensor Jammer, and FCS make them superfluous because of the current popular options (not including worlds, including what I have to fly against)

Its like using the Slave1 title without a torpedo and calling it innovation (which I do, but only in jest)

I won't take anything but Darth Vader for the Tie Advanced, that aside. But I don't see the need for Accuracy Corrector even for the Tempest. The Advanced Targetting Computer is superior. Worst case, you need an action for Target Lock. That is a guaranteed crit and two unmodified red dice giving an average of a crit and a hit, which is statistically already slightly better than two guaranteed hits from AC. Sure, AC frees an action for defence, but the Tie Advanced has already more staying power than any other tie except the Defender.

If your opponents are high PS you could miss an opportunity for TL due to ranging on a tempest, that's where you want the AC.

I'd give it to Vader because of his high PS and the fact he can take two actions. Steele, probably, because of his (her? someone clarify for me) ability and its relation to crits. I probably won't even take generic Adv's because they're still too expensive and I'm not sure this will help justify that.

Can't wait to see the new pilots

Stele was a he.

I won't take anything but Darth Vader for the Tie Advanced, that aside. But I don't see the need for Accuracy Corrector even for the Tempest. The Advanced Targetting Computer is superior. Worst case, you need an action for Target Lock. That is a guaranteed crit and two unmodified red dice giving an average of a crit and a hit, which is statistically already slightly better than two guaranteed hits from AC. Sure, AC frees an action for defence, but the Tie Advanced has already more staying power than any other tie except the Defender.

If your opponents are high PS you could miss an opportunity for TL due to ranging on a tempest, that's where you want the AC.

You also miss the opportunity to evade/roll (every turn without affecting your damage at all...works with cluster missiles...)

I won't take anything but Darth Vader for the Tie Advanced, that aside. But I don't see the need for Accuracy Corrector even for the Tempest. The Advanced Targetting Computer is superior. Worst case, you need an action for Target Lock. That is a guaranteed crit and two unmodified red dice giving an average of a crit and a hit, which is statistically already slightly better than two guaranteed hits from AC. Sure, AC frees an action for defence, but the Tie Advanced has already more staying power than any other tie except the Defender.

If your opponents are high PS you could miss an opportunity for TL due to ranging on a tempest, that's where you want the AC.

You also miss the opportunity to evade/roll (every turn without affecting your damage at all...)

The point is though is that with that the AC is actually safer, as you always get your hits.

ATC is good, really good but it requires the TL.

If for whatever reason you don't get TL - maybe the enemy was out of range in your movement but moved in range - then AC is just safer, it always works. I'd like to see the mathwing which does more damage at which range against which target.

I suspect the air conditioning might be more effective over time.

Named pilots and maybe storms depending on the day I'd give the ATC... but the AC is (probably) better on generics, especially tempests.

Unfortunately, it's just not possible with the current range of upgrades

Sure it is, if you want to. Not everything needs to be min/maxed.

You know, just writing it out doesn't make it true.

The very mechanics of the PS 0, Sensor Jammer, and FCS make them superfluous because of the current popular options (not including worlds, including what I have to fly against)

Its like using the Slave1 title without a torpedo and calling it innovation (which I do, but only in jest)

Two tempests with sensor jammer, very hard to kill wingmen for Vessery. Kill something, then run and hide till time runs out.

I won't take anything but Darth Vader for the Tie Advanced, that aside. But I don't see the need for Accuracy Corrector even for the Tempest. The Advanced Targetting Computer is superior. Worst case, you need an action for Target Lock. That is a guaranteed crit and two unmodified red dice giving an average of a crit and a hit, which is statistically already slightly better than two guaranteed hits from AC. Sure, AC frees an action for defence, but the Tie Advanced has already more staying power than any other tie except the Defender.

If your opponents are high PS you could miss an opportunity for TL due to ranging on a tempest, that's where you want the AC.

You also miss the opportunity to evade/roll (every turn without affecting your damage at all...)

The point is though is that with that the AC is actually safer, as you always get your hits.

ATC is good, really good but it requires the TL.

If for whatever reason you don't get TL - maybe the enemy was out of range in your movement but moved in range - then AC is just safer, it always works. I'd like to see the mathwing which does more damage at which range against which target.

I suspect the air conditioning might be more effective over time.

Named pilots and maybe storms depending on the day I'd give the ATC... but the AC is (probably) better on generics, especially tempests.

Sorry if I was unclear, but I was in support of the AC on generics

AC is guaranteed damage, which in turn lets you throw offensive actions to the wind and turtle/dodge every turn. It also works with cluster missiles, which ATC does not (primary weapon)

ATC needs the initial target lock, which means the opponent is in range and can probably shoot you, doesn't modify the other two dice, and only works on the one target (which the tempests have no guarantees that they'll be able to shoot at, and shooting at something else means no ATC benefit)

I still wonder what Vader would be like if he took AC. He could just Focus and Evade each turn and then always get two hits. It sure reduces his damage potential, but it increases his ability to stay alive. Or maybe arc dodge and Focus.

Unfortunately, it's just not possible with the current range of upgrades

Sure it is, if you want to. Not everything needs to be min/maxed.

You know, just writing it out doesn't make it true.

The very mechanics of the PS 0, Sensor Jammer, and FCS make them superfluous because of the current popular options (not including worlds, including what I have to fly against)

Its like using the Slave1 title without a torpedo and calling it innovation (which I do, but only in jest)

Two tempests with sensor jammer, very hard to kill wingmen for Vessery. Kill something, then run and hide till time runs out.

Hmm, I thought about this, and it seems strange at first, but:

Vessery

Tempest with AC x 3

What you do is get target locks as soon as something comes into range with your Tempests, and then just leave them for Vessery. After that first round of grabbing TLs, just evade or whatever you like. You'll be pumping out 2 damage per ship plus Vessery will in all likelihood have a TL on anything he wants to shoot at.

I won't take anything but Darth Vader for the Tie Advanced, that aside. But I don't see the need for Accuracy Corrector even for the Tempest. The Advanced Targetting Computer is superior. Worst case, you need an action for Target Lock. That is a guaranteed crit and two unmodified red dice giving an average of a crit and a hit, which is statistically already slightly better than two guaranteed hits from AC. Sure, AC frees an action for defence, but the Tie Advanced has already more staying power than any other tie except the Defender.

If your opponents are high PS you could miss an opportunity for TL due to ranging on a tempest, that's where you want the AC.

If your opponents are high PS, you may find that your target-locked opponent has already danced their way out of your arc by the time you get to shoot. Your TL provides no benefit this turn. You're left shooting two unmodified red dice that will average one hit against any ships still in your arc.

If you had AC, you would guarentee two hit results per attack, and your ship also last longer because your actions can be dedicated entirely to defense and positioning without a loss in damage.

But I don't see the need for Accuracy Corrector even for the Tempest. The Advanced Targetting Computer is superior.

It has a harder time maintaining the lock on the target ship at that low a pilot skill and without Vader's double action. ATC from a jousting perspective is flat out better but X-Wing's not really much of a jousting game. AC is powering ATC down in trade for more reliable triggering.

If you can get ATC to fire constantly on PS2s then by all means use ATC. If you can't, AC's better reliably can translate into more damage.

Edit: misread the card, so this part is null.

Really though, Acc Corrector buys you more. Spend zero points on consistent attacks and increased durability. Seems pretty great.

My rule of thumb has been: PS 4 and lower gets AC, and 6 and higher gets ATC. PS 5 is a fence case.

Something I love about AC on a low PS ship is how it causes a fat Han to make an uncomfortable decision. Any time Han wants to think about using a token or 3P0 for damage mitigation, he has to be aware that the Tempest _will_ put 2 damage dice against Han. And against that, Han _will_ want to modify his evade results. Except... How many hits did Fel just score? And maybe I should spend an evade token right now? Man, I wish I'd put points into an EPT that wasn't VI, the PS bump isn't doing much for me...

AC makes lower PS ships really viable, and that should make us all happy.

I won't take anything but Darth Vader for the Tie Advanced, that aside. But I don't see the need for Accuracy Corrector even for the Tempest. The Advanced Targetting Computer is superior. Worst case, you need an action for Target Lock. That is a guaranteed crit and two unmodified red dice giving an average of a crit and a hit, which is statistically already slightly better than two guaranteed hits from AC. Sure, AC frees an action for defence, but the Tie Advanced has already more staying power than any other tie except the Defender.

If you adjust for its cost, the TIE advanced is actually far better than the TIE defender, in terms of staying power.

TIE Pilot did a pretty good job of addressing the rest of your argument, but I wanted to add this: a Tempest Squadron Pilot matched up against someone who moves later is likely to miss out on ATC during the first round of engagement due to timing issues with movement and target lock. In the second round of engagement, the Tempest Squadron Pilot gains a TL during its perform action step, and is likely attacking with the naked results of 2 or 3 dice plus the ATC crit. In either case, though, ATC is better than rerolling dice only because it's guaranteed, not because it's likely to produce more successes.

Only on the third round of engagement is the Tempest functioning at full capacity, with TL to trigger ATC and a focus token to modify dice--that is, as long as it wasn't forced to K-turn to maintain a firing arc on the ship it locked on the previous round.

In the mean time, the Tempest with Accuracy Corrector has generated no fewer than six hit results. The Tempest with ATC has generated an average of six successes, but that incorporates about a 30% chance to do less than six--and the ATC ship is locked into a particular target and has to start the dance over again if and when that target dies.

I'm not arguing that ATC isn't a very good upgrade, but as far as I can tell, Accuracy Corrector is being seriously underestimated by a lot of people here.

In general, I certainly feel like Accuracy Corrector is a better option for Vader, but imagine him with Proton Rockets and ATC.

ATC only works with primary attacks.

I won't take anything but Darth Vader for the Tie Advanced, that aside. But I don't see the need for Accuracy Corrector even for the Tempest. The Advanced Targetting Computer is superior. Worst case, you need an action for Target Lock. That is a guaranteed crit and two unmodified red dice giving an average of a crit and a hit, which is statistically already slightly better than two guaranteed hits from AC. Sure, AC frees an action for defence, but the Tie Advanced has already more staying power than any other tie except the Defender.

If you adjust for its cost, the TIE advanced is actually far better than the TIE defender, in terms of staying power.

TIE Pilot did a pretty good job of addressing the rest of your argument, but I wanted to add this: a Tempest Squadron Pilot matched up against someone who moves later is likely to miss out on ATC during the first round of engagement due to timing issues with movement and target lock. In the second round of engagement, the Tempest Squadron Pilot gains a TL during its perform action step, and is likely attacking with the naked results of 2 or 3 dice plus the ATC crit. In either case, though, ATC is better than rerolling dice only because it's guaranteed, not because it's likely to produce more successes.

Only on the third round of engagement is the Tempest functioning at full capacity, with TL to trigger ATC and a focus token to modify dice--that is, as long as it wasn't forced to K-turn to maintain a firing arc on the ship it locked on the previous round.

In the mean time, the Tempest with Accuracy Corrector has generated no fewer than six hit results. The Tempest with ATC has generated an average of six successes, but that incorporates about a 30% chance to do less than six--and the ATC ship is locked into a particular target and has to start the dance over again if and when that target dies.

I'm not arguing that ATC isn't a very good upgrade, but as far as I can tell, Accuracy Corrector is being seriously underestimated by a lot of people here.

In general, I certainly feel like Accuracy Corrector is a better option for Vader, but imagine him with Proton Rockets and ATC.

ATC only works with primary attacks.

You're totally right.

you people are pretty awesome

Why would you not use advanced targeting computer. Here is an easy reason why.

You are not fielding a Tie Advanced.

Now to be honest I wished it would have been like the auto thrusters so that unless you have a Target Lock in you action bar you cannot equip this in the sensor slot. That would have limited to the Tie Advanced with Tie 1x title, B-wings, E-wings and Lambda Shuttles. But the B-wings and E-wings don't need that much help.

Why would you not use advanced targeting computer. Here is an easy reason why.

You are not fielding a Tie Advanced.

Now to be honest I wished it would have been like the auto thrusters so that unless you have a Target Lock in you action bar you cannot equip this in the sensor slot. That would have limited to the Tie Advanced with Tie 1x title, B-wings, E-wings and Lambda Shuttles. But the B-wings and E-wings don't need that much help.

It'd essentially be a better version of taking Expose and Mercenary Copilot.

Why would you not use advanced targeting computer. Here is an easy reason why.

You are not fielding a Tie Advanced.

Now to be honest I wished it would have been like the auto thrusters so that unless you have a Target Lock in you action bar you cannot equip this in the sensor slot. That would have limited to the Tie Advanced with Tie 1x title, B-wings, E-wings and Lambda Shuttles. But the B-wings and E-wings don't need that much help.

Are you saying you wish those other ships could possibly use ATC?

In defense of the other System upgrades:

Fire-Control System, Accuracy Corrector, and Advanced Targeting Computer live in the same area: Damage.

To that end, FCS < AC, and AC vs ATC is conditional on whether you can acquire the target lock. However, the other three are incomparable.

Enhanced Scopes lets you move as a level 0 pilot. That means:

You have full knowledge of the board-state when you plan your maneuver

You will not be blocked, unless you wish to be

Your action economy is guaranteed, unless you are stressed

You become a substantially better blocker

You activate at the same time as other allied ships with Enhanced Scopes.

This is powerful, but not against this high PS metagame. Still, it's worth considering once the metagame shifts.

Advanced Sensors lets you perform your action before executing your maneuver.

You will not lose action economy to collisions or to red maneuvers.

You can perform a Barrel Roll (or Boost with an upgrade) before executing a maneuver.

You become substantially better at arc-dodging, as any chosen maneuver has 7 (or more with upgrades) different flightpaths. Even Koiograns.

This is what made B-Wings deadly, and now the TIE/A can have it too. We won't use it to quite the same extent, as we deal less damage, but hypermobility would allow us to usually get the Range 1 shot we so desperately need.

Also, it would make for an interesting Stall game. Get the 12 point advantage as swiftly as possible, then spend the rest of the game not getting shot at. It works!

Sensor Jammer turns one enemy [{Boom}] result into an [{Eye}] result. They cannot re-roll the result.

If they have no Focus token, or other ability that uses [{Eye}]s, we have simply reduced their damage.

If they have a Focus token, they are now forced to choose whether to use it offensively, or lose damage to defend later.

In the current metagame, I see a lot of people relying on non-action offense, so they can stack up on defense. Sensor Jammer punishes this.

In the current metagame, I see a lot of high PS ships. Sensor Jammer + Opportunist turns this into extra damage for us.

Moreover, the TIE/A has 3 agility, which means that extra damage mitigation turns us into incredible tanks. Our native 2 attack may be piddly, but we'll deal more damage to you than you deal to us!

I'd agree with DraconPyrothayan.

Fire Control System is only really useful in specific situations - The one that springs to mind is an Advanced carrying Cluster Missiles, with Commander Alozen and Marksmanship. At the same time, it's only really relevant when using the Advanced as a missile boat.

Advanced Targeting Computer is out-and-out the best for the primary weapons. The weakness is, as with everything target lock related, getting the target lock.

You may not have an action.

Lower PS pilots may not be able to get the target lock at all.

Some pilots have the ability to break said target lock (expert handling), to draw off a lock (Kagi) or to force you to shoot at someone other than the guy you locked onto (Biggs).

Lower PS pilots may find Vader, Stele or Alozen have vapourized their target with their shot before they get to fire.

Essentially, all the problems people complain about with ordnance. The Advanced Targeting Computer is massively cheaper and re-useable, but it still has the same weaknesses.

I suspect that for a lower PS pilot, Sensor Jammer is probably a good call. In my head, my current three TIE advanced list of Vader, Stele and a Tempest squadron, the Tempest is going up the centre and his main job is to be shot at. A sensor jammer and hull upgrade provides excellent toughness, and proton rockets means you can't afford to ignore him.

Advanced Sensors/Engine Upgrade is always a good pairing, and makes the Advanced a real dogfighter. A good possible for Vader - yes, you'll lose your second action when you use advanced sensors. But if you're using the Dark Lord of the Sith as a super-mobile dogfighter, it's good to have the option, especially since it's free. Depending on her pilot ability, it might be good for the PS8 Juno Eclipse, too. It's good to ensure you're not getting blocked, but at the same time, reactive manouvring is best for good pilots - I probably wouldn't put it on the generic pilots.

Advanced Targeting Computer is just so made for Maarek Stele I can't imagine giving him anything else.