I completely agree with Ken here, pushing out a new fixes is difficult. However I think you have to look at them a bit differently. Most of the fixes we have seen recently have been to make older ships viable however I don't think we have seen any ship become overpowered due to their specific upgrades. I think Ken said it best that "Some things should be situational," and I agree with him there. That's why I think Thrusters are so interesting, They only work in two possible situations. Auto-Thrusters are going to be awesome for Interceptors but they don't remove the biggest barrier to effectively using squints in a list, they are still difficult to fly and they can easily be one-shotted if the dice aren't on your side.

The other point that has been made a number of times in this discussion is that only 4 ships can take Auto- Thrusters. Those 4 ships aren't really what you might call "tanky" anyway. Frankly, I REALLY don't think you are going to see every list run interceptors and A-Wings suddenly. Hopefully they see more competitive play, but my money is on people continuing to play with builds that are a little more forgiving than Squints and A's.

Fortunately, Jedi Master Paul Heaver foresaw autothrusters and gave the world a counter to the counter...

Dodge my arc, you little pipsqueak? I think not!

All praise to Paul "Thinking Waves Ahead of the Opposition" Heaver.

If that's your plan, aren't you wasting an awful lot of points taking a turret to start with?

Not really. Turrets are still pretty great in general.

Plus, I could see Stay On Target deployed to all manner of ships to help them keep the new interceptor hotness in arc.

I'm not sure that's such a bad thing for Interceptors - lowering the average pilot skill of the meta (by not taking VI) could actually make more elite Interceptor pilots viable. Also, using up your EPT slot is a huge opportunity cost. Don't get me wrong, I rather like the sound of Stay on Target, but I'm not convinced it's the ultimate Autoceptor* killer.

*Interthruster? I think I prefer Autocepter.

Fortunately, Jedi Master Paul Heaver foresaw autothrusters and gave the world a counter to the counter...

Dodge my arc, you little pipsqueak? I think not!

All praise to Paul "Thinking Waves Ahead of the Opposition" Heaver.

If that's your plan, aren't you wasting an awful lot of points taking a turret to start with?

Not really. Turrets are still pretty great in general.

Plus, I could see Stay On Target deployed to all manner of ships to help them keep the new interceptor hotness in arc.

I'm not sure that's such a bad thing for Interceptors - lowering the average pilot skill of the meta (by not taking VI) could actually make more elite Interceptor pilots viable. Also, using up your EPT slot is a huge opportunity cost. Don't get me wrong, I rather like the sound of Stay on Target, but I'm not convinced it's the ultimate Autoceptor* killer.

*Interthruster? I think I prefer Autocepter.

Oh you're absolutely right. This is going to be of most use on Han and even then it won't be a solid counter to Fel. But certainly for all other interceptors it will be a threat (though Turr could still arc-dodge because of his ability).

As for the EPT opportunity cost, I agree. It will require not taking predator or VI. But I think that's okay from a balance perspective. Falcons are good enough without giving them predator on top of amazing crew.

The other opportunity cost is the loss of the ability to boost inherent in the use of stay on target because the maneuver is red (unless you have wingman or something nearby to take the stress). A good player will have to weigh carefully the options of using stay on target vs sticking with the existing maneuver and relying on a boost to get into arc (or using the action to simply going full defense, which will be important as well if you're in arc of 3 squints).

For the record my vote is for Autoceptors. Interthrusters sounds.... wrong.

Stay on Target would be a nice chance of pace

No predator, no V.I, no post maneuver action...

The other opportunity cost is the loss of the ability to boost inherent in the use of stay on target because the maneuver is red (unless you have wingman or something nearby to take the stress). A good player will have to weigh carefully the options of using stay on target vs sticking with the existing maneuver and relying on a boost to get into arc (or using the action to simply going full defense, which will be important as well if you're in arc of 3 squints).

For the record my vote is for Autoceptors. Interthrusters sounds.... wrong.

Ooh, good point regarding no boost (or, indeed offensive action). Stay on Target could be great on B-Wings, who are probably doing a red manoeuvre anyway (and who may already have done their action)!

Ah a vote - good idea! I'll start one!

I just keep playing squads around Autothrusters and contiune to be amazed at how efficent the out come is in defense. The Math is holding up true and yes there is always a chance the dice betray you but for the most part the skies are clear for the return of the Interceptors.

To me Rebels are the losers of Wave 6 because they:

Rely on turrets a lot and they will have difficulties. Nearly all their competitive lists include Han or Dash after all.

Get only the A-Wing to use Autothrusters and it's arguably the worst ship of the 4 being able to take them.

The only upgrade for them that is forseeably interesting will probably be Mangler cannon on Dash, but that's not much!

I agree on the turrets, but I very much disagree on A-Wings being the worst of the 4 ships. They have gotten a lot better in the last year. I can't reliably compare them to the Scum ships, but compared to the Interceptor they give up an attack die for a price drop and a significant survivability boost.

Side note: Ten-Numb + Mangler Cannon.

The only upgrade for them that is forseeably interesting will probably be Mangler cannon on Dash, but that's not much!

I think that BTL upgrade card thing for the Ywing will be good for them as well. Get enough ways to pass a focus token and you might be able to utilize blaster turret...barring that you will ion after every shot. And who knows...maybe we will see a flechette turret come out sometime in the future that would shine w this upgrade too.

Don't forget bombs. Scum gives Rebels the ability to use bombs on Y-Wings.

The only upgrade for them that is forseeably interesting will probably be Mangler cannon on Dash, but that's not much!

I think that BTL upgrade card thing for the Ywing will be good for them as well. Get enough ways to pass a focus token and you might be able to utilize blaster turret...barring that you will ion after every shot. And who knows...maybe we will see a flechette turret come out sometime in the future that would shine w this upgrade too.

Don't forget bombs. Scum gives Rebels the ability to use bombs on Y-Wings.

Yeah...but I don't think that is going to be too consequential with.the.bombs we have available.

The only upgrade for them that is forseeably interesting will probably be Mangler cannon on Dash, but that's not much!

I think that BTL upgrade card thing for the Ywing will be good for them as well. Get enough ways to pass a focus token and you might be able to utilize blaster turret...barring that you will ion after every shot. And who knows...maybe we will see a flechette turret come out sometime in the future that would shine w this upgrade too.

Don't forget bombs. Scum gives Rebels the ability to use bombs on Y-Wings.

Yeah...but I don't think that is going to be too consequential with.the.bombs we have available.

Prox mines are a fairly legit phantom counter

In the ideal case that you can drop it, they cannot outmaneuver it (happens when the y-wing moves) and they cannot dodge it (straight damage)

It's generally a more effective imperial strategy because bombers are cheaper (19 w/mine versus the y's 21), but on the upside Y-wings are actually useful as something rather than a prox mine platform.

For the braver among use, it might be fun to combo ion turrets with bombs since you'll know exactly where the opponent will end up

Bombers are useful as more than bomb platforms as well though...and a single prox mine isn't going to stop.a phantom.

I see what you are trying to say..I just don't think the bomb upgrade is in any way sea changing or even worth putting much stock unit at this point in time...

Bombers are useful as more than bomb platforms as well though...and a single prox mine isn't going to stop.a phantom.

I see what you are trying to say..I just don't think the bomb upgrade is in any way sea changing or even worth putting much stock unit at this point in time...

Roll correctly, and draw the right card, it very well could.

But, I think the most important fact is that the Proxy mines will limit where the Phantom can go. Because there is no way a Phantom is going to willingly take a proxy mine when they Decloak.

Bombers are useful as more than bomb platforms as well though...and a single prox mine isn't going to stop.a phantom.

I see what you are trying to say..I just don't think the bomb upgrade is in any way sea changing or even worth putting much stock unit at this point in time...

Roll correctly, and draw the right card, it very well could.

But, I think the most important fact is that the Proxy mines will limit where the Phantom can go. Because there is no way a Phantom is going to willingly take a proxy mine when they Decloak.

Roll correctly and draw the right card and anything can work. I had a hawk nail a phantom at r3 through an asteroid with it's primary and kill it once (it was down to one health but you get my point.)

You make a point on the mine...but I just don't see this as a major consideration...I could be wrong though...I have been before...

Wait so people don't always loose their phantom through a astroid on a r3 shot with just 1 attack die? I thought that was the norm.

To me Rebels are the losers of Wave 6 because they:

Rely on turrets a lot and they will have difficulties. Nearly all their competitive lists include Han or Dash after all.

Get only the A-Wing to use Autothrusters and it's arguably the worst ship of the 4 being able to take them.

The only upgrade for them that is forseeably interesting will probably be Mangler cannon on Dash, but that's not much!

I agree on the turrets, but I very much disagree on A-Wings being the worst of the 4 ships. They have gotten a lot better in the last year. I can't reliably compare them to the Scum ships, but compared to the Interceptor they give up an attack die for a price drop and a significant survivability boost.

Side note: Ten-Numb + Mangler Cannon.

Ten Numb+Mangler is one assured crit per round for 35 points. We are in Phantom territory there and he is overpriced a bit.

Well i do think the A-Wing is the worst ship for Autothrusters. All in all the 2 AD can't be overcome. You will just not cause enough damage

The Interceptor is a lot more dangerous, as is the Viper and the Aggressor.

In this meta we have a lot of Ships with good damage mitigation or a lot of green dice. So with 2 reds you will not win anything!

Ten numb is too expensive and far too easy to kill.

You'd at best get two shots from that cannon.

How about Autothrusters plus Expose (and Outmanoeuvre)? Only trouble is it doesn't really compliment any of the high PS A-Wing pilots, and you kinda want high PS when trying to outmanoeuvre people.

Slightly off topic - you know Turr's free boost/barrel roll? Is the "no repetition of the same action" rule still applicable here, or has that been FAQed to only apply within a given phase?

Same rule applies to Turr, no boost/boost or barrel/barrel.

On the subject of Bombs, Proton Bombs are actually value at 5 points especially against Phantoms as that crit under it's shields is a death sentence and they are fairly easy to stick one.

How about Autothrusters plus Expose (and Outmanoeuvre)? Only trouble is it doesn't really compliment any of the high PS A-Wing pilots, and you kinda want high PS when trying to outmanoeuvre people.

Farrel is the only real option i see, and he is good, no doubt. But even on him to consistently outmaneuver people i Want PTL/VI. Leave VI away and Phantoms will eat you. Leave PTL away and you don't get Boost/Barrel goodness!

On thise two i could see Outmaneuver, but you need to nake sacrifices and you pay a steep price!

And then if you look at Interceptors they already have 3AD and Barrel Roll, so no need for all this stuff!