Edited ***** topic should not have been posted *******

This is an apology

It probably is againts forum rules, but you've got over a 1000 posts, a little leeway should be given I think.

You... you cant leave us.... *cry*

We will be nice again i swear...

Ah - parenting.

Bummer cubanboy-these are just surplus right? You aren't "getting out" are you...? Who'll post our "happy Friday" threads now...?

First and foremost,

As a community member, I don't want to abuse rules, I just did not see them.

Also I need money for raider and 2 YT2400s and 2nd VT-49. These are just extra ships as I did not see a need to have 8 Intercepters or 7 x-wings.

Bummer cubanboy-these are just surplus right? You aren't "getting out" are you...? Who'll post our "happy Friday" threads now...?

Thanks for the concern, totally not leaving x-wing

*phew*

Now i can spend the rest of my work day without worrying that you leave us...

ps your listing says 2 B-wings and there's only 1

The hypocrisy demostrated in this thread is disheartening. Not too long ago Zom4d placed a similar listing to sell a may and he was immediately blasted to all hell. Scolded for breaking rules and essentially told that what he was doing was wrong...how date he use this site to advertise and make some money off something he didn't need any more. I am certain if I places a thread similar to this I too would be derided and scolded. The number of posts a person has should have no effect on weather or not rules should be followed...nice to see the community places the threshold seems to be at 1k posts to do things like this and have it be accepted. Truly disheartening...I don't feel that any of you have any place to scold anyone for doing this in the future...

That being said...I hope you get a fair amount for what you are selling and I hope you are able to move them. Congrats on the kid by the way...fatherhood is both a blessing and a pain. I have a 2 yearbooks myself. Also glad to see you are sticking around. I don't post to or with you much..but you are a ray of sunshine in this occasionally dark place.

Oh man, I was considering it, but it's too rich for my blood.

At this point, I'm just buying ships for collectible value, I don't really need them for the game.

Forum rules can be found in the index of useful links or in the last post of the last page of forum posts.

The hypocrisy demostrated in this thread is disheartening. Not too long ago Zom4d placed a similar listing to sell a may and he was immediately blasted to all hell. Scolded for breaking rules and essentially told that what he was doing was wrong...how date he use this site to advertise and make some money off something he didn't need any more. I am certain if I places a thread similar to this I too would be derided and scolded. The number of posts a person has should have no effect on weather or not rules should be followed...nice to see the community places the threshold seems to be at 1k posts to do things like this and have it be accepted. Truly disheartening...I don't feel that any of you have any place to scold anyone for doing this in the future...

That being said...I hope you get a fair amount for what you are selling and I hope you are able to move them. Congrats on the kid by the way...fatherhood is both a blessing and a pain. I have a 2 yearbooks myself. Also glad to see you are sticking around. I don't post to or with you much..but you are a ray of sunshine in this occasionally dark place.

I agree on the face of it that this thread, and the responses to it, are showing a definite double standard considering the thread you refer to, and yes (without having read it personally) I have no reason to doubt that selling threads are against the forum rules. However I do think it's worth mentioning something;

The previous thread about selling mats, for me, got out of hand pretty quickly. I was pretty disheartened by the way in which that thread went (from both the responding posters and the OPs responses to them-it felt like a persecution thread in the end).

For me, If you are against the content of a thread (for a proper reason obviously, like going against forum rules etc) respond if you must, report it and move on if you feel it's needed but be respectful-Ganging up/being aggressive isn't cool.

In this respect I'm THANKFULL this thread IS showing a double standard and hasn't gone that way (not least because having read enough of Cubanboy's posts he's a decent guy and absolutely would not deserve a crappy time of it).

Shake, you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder? I placed no limits at 1K, just that a significant number of posts indicate an involve,ent in the community and I've always found that rules can be bent for people like that.

The rules are there to safeguard againt a huge amount of posts or people just registering to spam their sales. But people who've had hundreds of posts occaissionaly opening a topic? Why not? I've not seen Z4's topic but on principle do not agree with negative sentiments there.

Double standard indeed, I'm joking around about wanting bitcoins in the trade thread and get jumped on. Relax people.

I'm not seeing double standards though, are people saying one thing in one topic and another in this? Or are different people saying different things?

The hypocrisy demostrated in this thread is disheartening.

Is it actually the same people? Or is it just "the community" that's frustrating you?

so the new minivan wont be holding as many minis..lol to bad you didn't have an extra Falcon you could make a killing right now!!

Double standard? Hypocrisy? These forums are not some sort of hive-mind. It is entirely possible for one person to blast someone for posting a "sale" thread and another person to say something like "a little leeway can be given for someone with 1000 posts". They are different opinions of different people, so no hypocrisy or double standard exists.

If you don't believe this to be the case, then I submit to you that we are all on these forums and therefore you must agree with me and the hive-mind or risk being a hypocrite.

Post count got nothin' to do with it. It's more that people can't bring themselves to be nasty to someone who's such a joy to have around.

I have been busy all day so this is the first I am coming back to this threat.

First it looks like I was in the wrong so let me say sorry.

Second the opinions stated above I don't take as slams or negitve, I simply see as I did something wrong and will not be repeated.

Third I am honored that I am viewed in a good light so I don't want to destroy that as I really hope to make the forum and community a better place to be.

So I welcome the comments and will never again break the forum rules. I offer no excuse just an apology.

Here is the thread in question (Z4) if anyone wants to review it to see what I am talking about. The reaction to his thread and the reaction to this one were pretty different from the get go and the way the community responded from there on compared to how they are responding here highlight the issue that is bothering me...

http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/130520-selling-50x60-felt-mat/?hl=z0m4d#entry1390640

My personal opinion on it...it was handled more or less properly...Z4 shouldnt hock his stuff here...no one should. He got a little smartarsey and got it in kind. But the tone of the thread was much more stern and firm from the beginning...the community wasnt going to let him get away with it without knowing it was the wrong thing to do...something I dont think anyone would have discussed if I hadnt said what I said...and I stand by what I said.

agree on the face of it that this thread, and the responses to it, are showing a definite double standard considering the thread you refer to, and yes (without having read it personally) I have no reason to doubt that selling threads are against the forum rules. However I do think it's worth mentioning something;
The previous thread about selling mats, for me, got out of hand pretty quickly. I was pretty disheartened by the way in which that thread went (from both the responding posters and the OPs responses to them-it felt like a persecution thread in the end).
For me, If you are against the content of a thread (for a proper reason obviously, like going against forum rules etc) respond if you must, report it and move on if you feel it's needed but be respectful-Ganging up/being aggressive isn't cool.
In this respect I'm THANKFULL this thread IS showing a double standard and hasn't gone that way (not least because having read enough of Cubanboy's posts he's a decent guy and absolutely would not deserve a crappy time of it).

Bikeanimal, You have the correct outlook...I am glad you at least recognize the double standard that a few others in this thread appear to blind (willfully or otherwise, I have no idea) to. Though it has kind of gone that way since your post you have the right idea. I have no intention of reporting him nor did it ever cross my mind. His post was a simple mistake due to a lack of information, we all make them. No one should act crappy toward him but they should let him know its not allowed, I would even argue in the gentlest form due to his reputation, but what I have been seeing here (not from you but from some of the others) is tacit acceptance...simply because it is him. And thats neither fair nor right. And I am inclined to think he would agree.

Shake, you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder? I placed no limits at 1K, just that a significant number of posts indicate an involve,ent in the community and I've always found that rules can be bent for people like that.

The rules are there to safeguard againt a huge amount of posts or people just registering to spam their sales. But people who've had hundreds of posts occaissionaly opening a topic? Why not? I've not seen Z4's topic but on principle do not agree with negative sentiments there.

Why would I have a chip on my shoulder from a conversation I took absolutely no meaningful part in? You may not have intended to place a limit...but your post did list a number. If you weren't posting that as a limit my apologies for taking it that way...thats how it looked to me...not a solid threshold...but you presented the idea that once you hit certain number of posts certain rules should not apply. The rules are there and they should be followed by everyone, regardless of how well liked they are around here. If you were posting it simply as an indicator of community involvement I will give you that and back off on that point...though there are a number of people here with high post counts (I wont name names) who havent really contributed much at all.

One can note the thread I linked to above...as well as a few others they were always shut down real quick. Usually nicely and sometimes not so nicely but it was always made clear by the tone of those posting (as I interpreted it) that breaking this rule was unnacceptable. The tone of this thread was quite different and your first post set that stage. The tone, again as I read it, was this isnt something we do...but because we (ie the community I would gather) like you you can do it. That sir is a double standard and not right. There are many forum rules that can be interpreted subjectively...this one isnt one of them...its pretty black and white.

EDIT TO ADD: Its good to see that you would disagree w the negative sentiment there. You should check out the thread. I gave my opinion on it above. The tones are quite different.

The hypocrisy demostrated in this thread is disheartening.

Is it actually the same people? Or is it just "the community" that's frustrating you?

I am not in the slightest way frustrated. If I were truly frustrated or angry about this you would have seen words like "disgusted" or "outraged" or some other hyperbolic word...I chose my word very carefully and deliberately. Thanks for your question though...Ill answer it for you. Weather or not it was the same people is completely irrelevant.. .it is the community. Take one look at the change in tone from this thread and the thread i posted above. Look at how it starts and then how it develops from there. I noticed you rarely post for the amount of time you have on this site...glad you felt strongly enough about my post to tag up another one (and I sincerely mean that...I must have touched something off.) Please feel free to post again when you disagree with me. I love debating those who disagree with me...especially when they post no more than a single line of text.

Double standard? Hypocrisy? These forums are not some sort of hive-mind. It is entirely possible for one person to blast someone for posting a "sale" thread and another person to say something like "a little leeway can be given for someone with 1000 posts". They are different opinions of different people, so no hypocrisy or double standard exists.

If you don't believe this to be the case, then I submit to you that we are all on these forums and therefore you must agree with me and the hive-mind or risk being a hypocrite.

So what are you trying to say through all the snark here? That weather or not someone should follow the rules (especially the black and white ones) should be down to community opinion? The only poster from the Z4 thread here is TopHatGorrilla and he posted pretty much what he posted in the last thread...his consistency is appreciated.

This post goes right into the line of thinking I am getting at. I am being derided and mocked because I dare ask people to treat all forum members the same? As i have described several times above please note the tone of these two threads...how they began and how they developed. My stance here is the same stance that was getting pushed so hard in the last thread on this topic and it was widely supported. The rules simply need to be followed and those who break them need to know what they have done. But now that CB is involved all of a sudden I am worthy of ridicule and mockery and its "just everyones opinion?" There is a double standard here...as is made evident both by the attitude of those posting...and the fact that those who derided the last "salesman" so hard and fast havent stepped up to say anything or support their stance in this case. Consistency people. It appears to be a community double standard..."You cannot sell stuff here! Unless we like you then we will probably let it go!" I hope I am wrong and just over thinking this. But the response I have gotten from some of you in this thread doesnt bode well.

I have been busy all day so this is the first I am coming back to this threat.

First it looks like I was in the wrong so let me say sorry.
Second the opinions stated above I don't take as slams or negitve, I simply see as I did something wrong and will not be repeated.
Third I am honored that I am viewed in a good light so I don't want to destroy that as I really hope to make the forum and community a better place to be.

So I welcome the comments and will never again break the forum rules. I offer no excuse just an apology.

You sir are a gentleman and a scholar and none of my comments are leveled at you. You need no excuse nor apology. You didnt really know any better and the forum rules are a bit difficult to find. My issue was the way your post was received in relation to so many others I have seen. Again no Ill will or criticism directed at you. Hope your little Ace is growing big and strong...my little stormtrooper is. Hoping next halloween hell get his first suit of white armor and E-11 blaster rifle and use it to smite the enemies of the Empire!!

In closing I think alot of you need to step back and imagine it wasnt CB that posted this. Imagine it was me (I know I dont have the rep around here he does) or Z4 again, WW, some newbie, or even the much maligned Ribann. How would you all react then? If you sincerely think someone would have posted "It probably is againts forum rules but a little leeway should be given I think " I would think you are wrong. You would have said something along the lines of "You cannot sell on this forum. Please read the forum rules." or, in the case of RIbann, perhaps something worse. And it would have gone from there...more than likely ending up with what I am arguing now prevailing. And that my good people is a double standard and is hypocritical on the communitys part. Weather or not you recognize that is up to you. I hope I dont see those of you deriding me in one of these threads chastising people for selling as some of you seem to be of the "opinion" that nothing is wrong here. That would make you individually hypocritical.

Why would I have a chip on my shoulder from a conversation I took absolutely no meaningful part in? You may not have intended to place a limit...but your post did list a number. If you weren't posting that as a limit my apologies for taking it that way...thats how it looked to me...not a solid threshold...but you presented the idea that once you hit certain number of posts certain rules should not apply. The rules are there and they should be followed by everyone, regardless of how well liked they are around here. If you were posting it simply as an indicator of community involvement I will give you that and back off on that point...though there are a number of people here with high post counts (I wont name names) who havent really contributed much at all.

One can note the thread I linked to above...as well as a few others they were always shut down real quick. Usually nicely and sometimes not so nicely but it was always made clear by the tone of those posting (as I interpreted it) that breaking this rule was unnacceptable. The tone of this thread was quite different and your first post set that stage. The tone, again as I read it, was this isnt something we do...but because we (ie the community I would gather) like you you can do it. That sir is a double standard and not right. There are many forum rules that can be interpreted subjectively...this one isnt one of them...its pretty black and white.

EDIT TO ADD: Its good to see that you would disagree w the negative sentiment there. You should check out the thread. I gave my opinion on it above. The tones are quite different.

I'm not saying rules should not apply, I'm saying leeway could be given. There's a difference in that you then judge each case on an individual basis. Not all rules should be applied with the same strictness and not all users are equal. Nor should they be.

I've read the Z4 thread you linked (I can never remember how to spell his name ) and there are a few differences. First the approach by the two topicstarters, where in tone at least, cubanboy comes across much less... commercial? But more importantly is indeed the tone set by the first responses. The first response is crucial to many topics as that somehow is a guideline to other people responding. I don't think that topic deserved the responses it got.

Is it a double standard if you allow it for a person who's posted hundreds of times here and disallow it for george9943844 who has just registered in order to sell? Maybe, but it's a double standard I applaud. In my experience of running a forum, as both moderator and administrator, I've learned that that is part of the best way to actually create a community. Another part is active participation as crew in being part of the community instead of just coming down like the fist of god and then departing behind a cloud again, but there's that.

Let's say this topic was reported, in my opinion, as crew you would then read the topic and have to make a decision:

This topic is technically against the rules.

This topic was started by someone who a) has spent considerable time here, b) is not generally known as a troublemaker, c) is not posting the link for profit

Do you a) close the topic, rules are rules, no deviation or b) wait and see how it plays out, how does the community respond or c) post that it is technically against the rules but for now, because you're a nice guy, you'll let it slide because of who started the topic?

To me, the correct response would be C, possibly B if you're not quite sure. If this results in a large influx of like topics, then you pick up the rule and close the topics as they are impacting the forum negatively. This can be done without people crying foul, easily, because people understand that kind of reasoning.

The more rules you make, the less freedom to act as crew. The biggest and basically only rule on that forum I've led (about 35K posts per day)?

Behave.

That is it, that is all you need as crew. Everything else is fluff. Main advice given to people complaining there? If you don't like a topic, don't post in it. Ignore it, it'll be out of sight in a day. Let the judging and moderating to the people who've volunteered to do so. Go post and have fun.

I do realize that you do need involved crew for that, you need people who are part of the community in order for them to moderate properly. The thread that was locked yesterday? Who is that guy? How does he feel about this game? Why did he not show up sooner to calm people down and get the thread back on topic instead of arriving with a big lock when tempers have flared and then disappearing again without actually solving anything?

Ok for me it looks like this thread has run it's course, from a constructive point of view at least. The fact that CubanBoy's edited his original post he clearly wants to put this one to bed (and if the OP does that's good enough for me).

I personally had no issue with the topic (my response was disappointment over possibly losing a great forum member nothing else-the rules "violation" had been pointed out and needed no further emphasis for me).

I'm probably risking stoking the fires by saying this, (especially as I intend this to be my final post on this topic) but, I do see the validity to the various points of view (that; a) rules are rules, b) a person's contributions should count for something, c) sensible leeway in technical contraventions to certain rules is only a good thing, d), mutual respect is absolutely essential, e) etc, f), etc, g) etc...) however my overriding thoughts and hopes remain that the forum remains a hospitable friendly place to be where all the discussions are held in the correct spirit. They inevitably won't always, and it is down to us all to acknowledge when it doesn't and determine to mitigate such instances when they do occur.

I'm a UK player and this is a US site, yet I choose this over more local ones. Why? It's a great place and is, as-near-as-****-it, always friendly and hospitable with a ton of interesting, helpful and funny stuff happening, and long may this be....

(and I sincerely hope Lord Vader does not get wind of this post-showing such tree-hugging-free-love sentiments will probably not be well received... Is it me or is my collar getting a little tight...)

The hypocrisy demostrated in this thread is disheartening.

Is it actually the same people? Or is it just "the community" that's frustrating you?

I am not in the slightest way frustrated. If I were truly frustrated or angry about this you would have seen words like "disgusted" or "outraged" or some other hyperbolic word...I chose my word very carefully and deliberately. Thanks for your question though...Ill answer it for you. Weather or not it was the same people is completely irrelevant.. .it is the community. Take one look at the change in tone from this thread and the thread i posted above. Look at how it starts and then how it develops from there. I noticed you rarely post for the amount of time you have on this site...glad you felt strongly enough about my post to tag up another one (and I sincerely mean that...I must have touched something off.) Please feel free to post again when you disagree with me. I love debating those who disagree with me...especially when they post no more than a single line of text.

First off, not that my post count is any of your business, but I registered several years ago when I was playing lots of the 40k RPGs, and I recently started logging in and poking around the forums again because I got some X-Wing and some Star Wars RPGs for Christmas. I'm sorry that I post so rarely you felt it was worth comment, but I also think you're reading a little too much into my question and looking for a fight.

I was sincerely asking -- since I didn't know what thread you were referring to, and didn't read that other thread, and don't have a dog in the fight -- if it was the same people or not. I didn't know if it was a thread from a day ago, a week ago, six months ago, a year ago, or what. When you respond like this to someone asking for clarification because they want to know what's going on so they can make up their own mind, you're pretty likely to help steer them to the other side of a conversation.

Relax.

I understand that your hackles are raised and, in part because you're calling out "the community" you likely feel that "the community" is here to disagree with you right now, but I think that's gonna be a little bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy if you keep at it like this. When someone asks a polite question and you jump down their throat and try to throw their low post count in their face, you're pretty likely to get the internet fight you seem to be clamoring for. I don't particularly feel like doing that today, so I'm not, but I'd just suggest you ease up a little, okay?