Outmaneuver... maybe. There are a lot of strong candidates for the Aggressor's EPT.

Point was that they affect Han when you're out of his arc. So between Autothrusters and Outmaneuver you there is a fairly large effect if you arc dodge Han. Especially on something that has that many HP's.

I wonder if this is finally the ship for Elusiveness, the stress-clearing is fantastic.

9 greens to the A-wing's 8, EAT YOUR HEART OUT

Yeah, but notice that none of it's sharp turns are green. That could be a major liability for a ship that is trying to outmaneuver everything.

I think the most important thing to note about the Aggressors is the combination of 3 defense dice, 10 hp, the evade action and 3 attack dice or a cannon. This is the most durable ship we've ever seen with 3 agility. Han is notorious for being able to ignore high agility due to his ability, predator and gunner, guaranteeing at least 1 damage per attack against even the most slippery of targets. But when you have 10 hp instead of 3 or 4, 1 damage per turn is not very scary.

However, Fat Han has already been on his way out since Wave 5. Why choose between a fat turret and a Phantom when you can play both? Chrianeau + Whisper is starting to prove itself as the strongest list in the game, easily beating Outriders, other Phantoms and swarms, with about a 50/50 against Fat Han lists.

So the question really is, how do double Agressors do against Chiraneau+Whisper? I think if the Aggressors wide arc proves to be enough to catch the Phantom enough turns to nail it with that pseudo-gunner ability, then the match up will favor the Aggressors. I think if it comes down to an Aggressor with Autothrusters against a Decimator, it's 50/50, due to the Decimator moving second and either keeping the Aggressor in arc every other turn with Engine or negating autothrusters half the time with Expose. But there's no way a full health Decimator is beating 1 and a half Aggressors with autothrusters. So it all depends on whether 2 Aggressors can kill Whisper before getting too badly damaged.

Why wouldn't they just wax the Decimator first? Bag some points and force Whisper to come after them.

I wonder if this is finally the ship for Elusiveness, the stress-clearing is fantastic.

9 greens to the A-wing's 8, EAT YOUR HEART OUT

Yeah, but notice that none of it's sharp turns are green. That could be a major liability for a ship that is trying to outmaneuver everything.

To make Elusiveness work you're by necessity pulling greens to clear stress.

This means your action is free.

Built-in boost.

I wonder if this is finally the ship for Elusiveness, the stress-clearing is fantastic.

9 greens to the A-wing's 8, EAT YOUR HEART OUT

Yeah, but notice that none of it's sharp turns are green. That could be a major liability for a ship that is trying to outmaneuver everything.

A bank with a boost is the same as a hard turn and you'll come out of it with an evade token...............no liability here, move on

It's not the same as doing a 2 hard turn with a small base. Doing a 1 bank green + 1 boost with a large base moves a lot faster and farther away.

Also, to address the main part of this topic, I still think Fat Han is where its at for the meta, even after this ship's reveal. Large-based turreted ships with a high PS and Engine upgrade will always have the ability to react to your movement and arc dodge you. And, because of their turrets, still manage to get shots off at you.

IG-2000 is super exciting, but I do not see it overthrowing the king just yet.

Arc dodge with only a boost? It's possible but barrel rolls are usually the key to that. Ig88 has a leg up with his segnor loops and the hard turn segnor option. Definitely better for arc dodging than a simple boost imo.

I think the most important thing to note about the Aggressors is the combination of 3 defense dice, 10 hp, the evade action and 3 attack dice or a cannon. This is the most durable ship we've ever seen with 3 agility. Han is notorious for being able to ignore high agility due to his ability, predator and gunner, guaranteeing at least 1 damage per attack against even the most slippery of targets. But when you have 10 hp instead of 3 or 4, 1 damage per turn is not very scary.

However, Fat Han has already been on his way out since Wave 5. Why choose between a fat turret and a Phantom when you can play both? Chrianeau + Whisper is starting to prove itself as the strongest list in the game, easily beating Outriders, other Phantoms and swarms, with about a 50/50 against Fat Han lists.

So the question really is, how do double Agressors do against Chiraneau+Whisper? I think if the Aggressors wide arc proves to be enough to catch the Phantom enough turns to nail it with that pseudo-gunner ability, then the match up will favor the Aggressors. I think if it comes down to an Aggressor with Autothrusters against a Decimator, it's 50/50, due to the Decimator moving second and either keeping the Aggressor in arc every other turn with Engine or negating autothrusters half the time with Expose. But there's no way a full health Decimator is beating 1 and a half Aggressors with autothrusters. So it all depends on whether 2 Aggressors can kill Whisper before getting too badly damaged.

really this. decimator and phnatom is what the new meta is right now. since i run double yt1300 im still trying to find a list to have the advantage over it

Also, to address the main part of this topic, I still think Fat Han is where its at for the meta, even after this ship's reveal. Large-based turreted ships with a high PS and Engine upgrade will always have the ability to react to your movement and arc dodge you. And, because of their turrets, still manage to get shots off at you.

IG-2000 is super exciting, but I do not see it overthrowing the king just yet.

Arc dodge with only a boost? It's possible but barrel rolls are usually the key to that. Ig88 has a leg up with his segnor loops and the hard turn segnor option. Definitely better for arc dodging than a simple boost imo.

Barrel Rolling the key to arc-dodging with a turretless ship because it keeps you facing the enemy. Turrets don't have to face the enemy, they just need to be in range, so they want to overshoot, which Boost is perfect for. The Aggressor's fancy K-turns will definitely be key to keeping pace with the Hyper-mobile Turret ships.

I think the most important thing to note about the Aggressors is the combination of 3 defense dice, 10 hp, the evade action and 3 attack dice or a cannon. This is the most durable ship we've ever seen with 3 agility. Han is notorious for being able to ignore high agility due to his ability, predator and gunner, guaranteeing at least 1 damage per attack against even the most slippery of targets. But when you have 10 hp instead of 3 or 4, 1 damage per turn is not very scary.

However, Fat Han has already been on his way out since Wave 5. Why choose between a fat turret and a Phantom when you can play both? Chrianeau + Whisper is starting to prove itself as the strongest list in the game, easily beating Outriders, other Phantoms and swarms, with about a 50/50 against Fat Han lists.

So the question really is, how do double Agressors do against Chiraneau+Whisper? I think if the Aggressors wide arc proves to be enough to catch the Phantom enough turns to nail it with that pseudo-gunner ability, then the match up will favor the Aggressors. I think if it comes down to an Aggressor with Autothrusters against a Decimator, it's 50/50, due to the Decimator moving second and either keeping the Aggressor in arc every other turn with Engine or negating autothrusters half the time with Expose. But there's no way a full health Decimator is beating 1 and a half Aggressors with autothrusters. So it all depends on whether 2 Aggressors can kill Whisper before getting too badly damaged.

Why wouldn't they just wax the Decimator first? Bag some points and force Whisper to come after them.

Because it's easier to cut the opponent's offense in half by going after the 4hp/4agi ship instead of the 16 hp ship with a free evade, one that, with Engine, is likely to make a break for the other side of the board and deny you a kill once you get it down to about 4 Hull. Sure you can chase it, but it won't be very easy in a ship that can only go 3-straight, and you'll have to use your boost action to keep up, which will make it that much harder to break through Ysanne, all the while getting shot up from the back by the Phantom you've been ignoring.

Wrong. Torkil Mux will be the end of both Fat Han and Veteran Whisper.

And an A-Wing with Proton Rockets will be the end of Torkil.

And an A-Wing with Proton Rockets will be the end of Torkil.

2pts for Autoblaster turret figures otherwise.

And an A-Wing with Proton Rockets will be the end of Torkil.

2pts for Autoblaster turret figures otherwise.

Yes well [urinating contest ensues], a GSP shoots first! Hah! Outmaneuver, Deadeye, Proton Rocket and Autothrusters! Become hot plasma you pirate!

---edit---

Okay, TWO A-wings with prot rockets will be the end of Torkil.

Hah, yeah, you'd have to double up or one would just get PS-ganked.

Too bad there's no way to chain his ability like Roark can.

Hah, yeah, you'd have to double up or one would just get PS-ganked.

Too bad there's no way to chain his ability like Roark can.

But you can chain bust though if someone was relying on Roark/SwarmTactics/Decoy for something.

I believe when two effects like this interact they resolve in initiative order even though they all happen "at the beginning of the combat phase..." So against Roark, Torkail would want to go last to counter Roark's Choice, however against a Swarm Tactics I think he would want to go first to lower the Swarm Tactics person's PS (I am actually not sure if based on the wording it may be irrelevant for Swarm Tactics timing anyways)

Hah, yeah, you'd have to double up or one would just get PS-ganked.

Too bad there's no way to chain his ability like Roark can.

But you can chain bust though if someone was relying on Roark/SwarmTactics/Decoy for something.

I believe when two effects like this interact they resolve in initiative order even though they all happen "at the beginning of the combat phase..." So against Roark, Torkail would want to go last to counter Roark's Choice, however against a Swarm Tactics I think he would want to go first to lower the Swarm Tactics person's PS (I am actually not sure if based on the wording it may be irrelevant for Swarm Tactics timing anyways)

Torkil actually has a different timing, he goes at end of activation, so Roark will always override.

Even with 2 HLC 8 red dice have never been considered a lot of atk dice. Fat Han will kill at least one ig88 before you can burn him and his support ships down; by that point the ig88 starts to fall apart and fat Han excels on 1 vs 1 battles. It's awell priced ship but to many counters for a two ship build to reliably win major tournaments.

I'd be keen to put System Jammer on the Iggy.

3 Agility, and Autothrusters makes that thing really tanky.

I agree. I don't foresee double Aggressors winning any major tournaments.

Even with 2 HLC 8 red dice have never been considered a lot of atk dice. Fat Han will kill at least one ig88 before you can burn him and his support ships down; by that point the ig88 starts to fall apart and fat Han excels on 1 vs 1 battles. It's awell priced ship but to many counters for a two ship build to reliably win major tournaments.

I'm not sure how well Fat Han will do against two ships with HLCs and a gunner effect. If they are really gunning for Fat Han they'll have Sensor Jammers and Autothrusters. Unless Han is taking a focus instead of an Evade the IG-2000s will not be taking much damage at all from Han.

I don't know that IG-2000s will be dominating the tournament scene but I do think they've got the tools to handle Fat Han.

Arc-dodging does nothing against the Falcon.

Autothrusters and Outmanuever would disagree with you on that. Two IG's each with those upgrades would make it so Han loses a lot of defense while improving their defense against him as long as they stay outside his arc.

That's basically what I was thinking. What can they do against Phantoms, though? I don't know off the top of my head.

Pretty much nothing.

If you build conservatively you can maybe squeeze that new HWK into a double-IG list? Might help. Might not.

IG-88C — Aggressor36Fire-Control System2 IG-20000

IG-88A — Aggressor36Fire-Control System2 IG-20000

Palob Godalhi — HWK-29020Blaster Turret4

That's 100 Points, Could mess around with upgrades but that seems to be the best han shut down