I'm sorry if this has been asked before - the search function won't work for me, even if I search for "Spy in the midst" I'll get a hundred hits that do not contain this line.

Am I correct that I can NOT play Spy in the midst after loosing an Intrigue challenge with claim value 1 when the last card in my hand is spy in the midst?
(because it is an any phase event and not a response?)

FloLeBlanc said:

We may not be looking at the same card here. Spy in Your Midst is a promotional card (that isn't normally legal for organized/tournament play). What's more, it is an attachment, not an event. You would have had to play it in Marshaling, then use the effect as an Any Phase action. If it is the only card in your hand during the Challenge phase, you can't do anything with it anyway - whether you lose an intrigue challenge or not. Attachments in your hand can't normally do anything in the Challenge phase (there are, of course, effects that will put them into play outside of the Marshaling phase, but that's a whole other discussion).

However, if you have only one card in your hand and you lose an intrigue challenge, it really doesn't matter what the card is. When you lose an intrigue challenge (or any challenge), you have to settle claim before you can do anything else - even Responses. So if you get all the way to losing the challenge before playing the card, the claim effect of the challenge will discard that card from your hand before you can do anything with it - even if it is a Response to losing the challenge.

i believe he was talking about Spy in The Midst, the reins event .

Ah. I never remember the names of those things. I've been using tzu's site as a crutch for card text for too long.

If that's the card, then see the second part of the Response above. Claim first. Even before Responses. Always. Doesn't matter if that last card is the Reinf. event or a Response to losing the challenge like "A Lannister Pays His Debts." Claim will take the card out of your hand before you can play it.

So the reason I CAN use "a lannister pays his debts" (AFTER claim it seems) is, that the card is moribund, a state that can only exist for cards that are in play?

FloLeBlanc said:

No. You CANNOT use "A Lannister Pays His Debts" AT ALL if it has been discarded from your hand as part of intrigue claim. The answers above say that you cannot use the card that has been discarded from your hand for claim, even if it is a Response to losing the intrigue challenge. I'm not sure who told you that you could use a copy of "A Lannister Pays His Debts" when it is discarded from your hand by an intrigue challenge, but the above answers are supposed to say you are NOT able to do that. Ever.

As you say, "moribund" is a transitional state that only applies to cards that start in play and are somehow removed from play. There is no moribund state for cards that are discarded from your hand. They go to the discard pile immediately. (Now, if you lose a military challenge, if the character you kill for claim is a Lannister and standing, you could kneel it to play "A Lannister Pays His Debts" in Response to losing the military challenge because it is Moribund and thus still physically on the table when you are able to play Responses. But this does not work for an intrigue challenge. If you lose "A Lannister Pays His Debts" from your hand for an intrigue challenge, it is physically in the discard pile when you are able to play Responses. You can't play events that are in your discard pile - unless some other effect specifically says you can.)

You can never trigger a card that is discarded from your hand "on the way out" in this game.

So to repeat, if you lose an intrigue challenge, claim is always settled FIRST before you have a chance to do anything. The card(s) you lose for intrigue claim go straight to the discard pile. So unless they say you can trigger them from the discard pile, you cannot use the cards you lose to intrigue claim for ANYTHING.

Sorry I misformulated my statement:

I meant of course that I CAN use a lannister pays his debts by kneeling a character that has been "chosen as claim" for a military challenge.

Sorry. My mistake. I thought you were still referring to intrigue challenges.

Thank you very much for the replies