Another munitions thread...

By StarWarsDad1138, in X-Wing

Enhanced Tracking Computer

Cost: 3

"When you perform a secondary attack that instructs you to discard it, During the attack you may spend a Focus token to reroll any blank results then turn your Focus Results into Hits."

Makes F/TL when using Ordnance more powerful.

Another idea would be giving all Missiles and Torpedos Outmaneuver. Which doesn't help with Alpha-Strikes but it turns them into "Finishers" and if a pilot has Outmaneuver already it would be -2 Agility when attacking.

I think my friend came up with the best idea yet.

Option Rule 1: New Ordinance Firing Phase

All ordinance(Missiles and Torps) fire first before primary weapons, in descending PS order.

So a PS 1 can fire first before a pilot skill 9, if using ordinance.

This way you change no cards, just add a rule for firing ordinance. Which makes it better.

Or

Here is another rule that we have.

Option Rule 2:

You can fire both Ordinance, and primary weapons in the same turn in any order.

The first one is the one we favor!

Edited by eagletsi111

In my view the main problems with ordinance are twofold:

1. High point cost for a single use weapon

2. Insufficient damage increase over primary weapon attack.

There are two ways to solve this, and I think that either would work.

1. Decrease the point cost for munitions by 3. This would make it easier to take munitions, even if you never fire them. Yes, it is extreme, but you are already paying part of the cost in having the slot. This is extremely unlikely, as it would require reprinting the cards. They could print a title/mod that decreases the cost, but this seems unlikely also, as they don't want auto-include cards.

2. When firing munitions (missiles/torpedoes), you roll the attack/agility dice as normal, but if the attack hits, it does damage equal to the attack value. This makes sense to me, as if you don't evade the missile or torpedo, it does a ton of damage to your ship. It would make munitions quite powerful, as getting a hit from a torpedo or missile would take out most craft.

"Sorry we failed to balance ordnance properly tubes"

Torpedo slot

0 Points

Limit 1 equipped copy of this card per ship

Reduce the cost of any equipped Torpedo by 4 points.

Gain a Torpedo slot

When performing a secondary weapon attack with a Torpedo, immediately after you roll attack dice, you may assign a focus token to your ship.

"Sorry we failed to balance ordnance properly racks"

Missile slot

0 Points

Limit 1 equipped copy of this card per ship

Reduce the cost of any equipped Missile by 3 points.

Gain a Missile slot

When performing a secondary weapon attack with a Missile, immediately after you roll attack dice, you may assign a focus token to your ship.

"We seriously didn't know what we were doing with bombs bays"

Bomb slot

0 Points

Limit 1 equipped copy of this card per ship

Just kidding, bombs are dumb. You can drop them at any point on your maneuver template if you don't bump. Proton bombs deal 2 faceup damage cards.

Gain a bomb slot

Edited by MikeMcSomething

The solution is to make munitions cheaper *and* to stop making ships pay for their munitions slots. And this is the direction FFG is moving towards with ships like the Z-95 and Proton Rockets. The early designers of the game followed a flawed system where ships had to pay for their munition slots even if they didn't benefit from them, but that just makes those ships worse than ships that can't take munitions and aren't paying extra points for something they're not using. You can see how badly this system hurt ships like the X-Wing, Y-Wing, A-Wing, TIE Advanced and TIE Bomber, while the Lambda, Firespray and B-Wing did better because instead of paying extra for that cannon slot, they just made cannon's cost extra.

I think the designers have to be cautious with munitiions, because if they make munitions too efficient, you get lists where every ship is better than Corran Horn for the first 2 exchanges, and it can lead to games that are over by the 2nd turn.

The solution is to make munitions cheaper *and* to stop making ships pay for their munitions slots. And this is the direction FFG is moving towards with ships like the Z-95 and Proton Rockets. The early designers of the game followed a flawed system where ships had to pay for their munition slots even if they didn't benefit from them, but that just makes those ships worse than ships that can't take munitions and aren't paying extra points for something they're not using. You can see how badly this system hurt ships like the X-Wing, Y-Wing, A-Wing, TIE Advanced and TIE Bomber, while the Lambda, Firespray and B-Wing did better because instead of paying extra for that cannon slot, they just made cannon's cost extra.

I think the designers have to be cautious with munitiions, because if they make munitions too efficient, you get lists where every ship is better than Corran Horn for the first 2 exchanges, and it can lead to games that are over by the 2nd turn.

If you take a look at the Heavy Skyk Interceptor it makes perfect sense to have ships pay for its upgrade slot and also if you take a look at Chardan Refit you see that the single missile slot is worth 2 points.However munitions slots don generally across the board cost 2 points. Take a look at the Tie Bomber it has 4 secondary upgrades plus a bomb slot but cost less than a Y-wing. Most of those points you spend is for having twice as much hull over an academy pilot and the Target Lock action.

2. When firing munitions (missiles/torpedoes), you roll the attack/agility dice as normal, but if the attack hits, it does damage equal to the attack value. This makes sense to me, as if you don't evade the missile or torpedo, it does a ton of damage to your ship. It would make munitions quite powerful, as getting a hit from a torpedo or missile would take out most craft.

This. Does it make any sense to anyone that if you knick 1 pt on a phantom with adv protons that it still only does 1 point?

Another solution that would be a big change without having to errata cards is to create a 're-arming' action that allows you to 'un-discard' a missile or torpedo on your ship.

This would allow for multiple shots even if a torpedo or missile hits.

Auto-loading mechanism (0 points)

Modification

Action: You may re-equip a 'Missile' or 'Torpedo' upgrade that was previously discarded from this ship.

This could even be used in conjunction with my idea above.

That's actually not too far off from Star Trek Attack Wing's handling of torpedos

I think ordinance could use one of two things:

1) if a ship with duplicate ordnance slots (Y-Wing, B-Wing, TIE bomber) buys ordnance, it gets as many uses as it has slots. This would greatly reduce the cost of ordnance on ships that use it most. It doesn't fix it across the board but it encourages the bombers to be used like bombers.

2) All hits become crits with ordnance (not flechettes or ions). If you are gonna pay for a one-hit wonder, it had better be wonderful!

With shields being ignored you would keep the single use.

Large and epic ships, or really any low agility ship, will be higly susceptible to ordnance, making them need to have an escort.

So many astromechs would get more use - the ones that remove damage, r4-d6 will save a ship from being a one shot kill.

Expert handling will see more use, as will deadeye to counter.

Elusiveness and draw their fire become really helpful.

High agility ships have a better chance to outfly/dodge the missiles - something thematic to many fighter ace characters in different media.

Players have to be prepared for a shakeup in threat assessment - attack fat Han or the b-wing with torpedoes?

Ships vulnerable to being blown out of the sky by a torpedo may consider the hull upgrade in lieu of another modification. This means fear of ordnance will lower the potential offense of an enemy.

Lower skilled generic pilots find great use - if a named pilot with a torpedo is a prime target, field generic pilots with ordnance, especially in an epic game.

As per the lore, the deathstar exhaust was ray shielded, so if fighters are similarly equipped, it leads to another modification being created:

particle shields - your shields are not bypassed by ordnance (I would put it that you can't fire ordnance with this upgrade equipped). This is to protect your heavy laser/mangler cannon attack ships, or any ship susceptible to ordnance.

Once again, if low agility/large ships take this upgrade over more offensive options, it can be a tactic for the attacking player. Fear of the what if situation will shake up the much touted meta.