Since I started playing X-Wing I have played the vast majority of my games as an Imperial. I have one very regular opponent who much more prefers to play rebels and I have come to truly appreciate the mix of ships that the empire has so I am happy to play them. The one thing I have been jealous of since the start are the astro-mechs. Those things can change the entire way a ship plays and R2-D2 has been a thorn in my side in more games then I can count (he is nuts in an E-Wing). The X-wing boasts IMO four of the best pilot skills in the game with Wedge, Luke, Garven and Biggs. The E-Wing can be a very dangerous ship especially if left on the table too long and Corran Horn can wreck your night if used well. Why do people feel like these two ships need any more help? The A-Wing and Tie Advanced were in serious need of attention but now that we have been blessed with fixes I think every ship is viable. I am very pleased with the current state of the game.

I find myself wanting to agree with you. I love the x-wing. The complaint comes from (IMO) the generics less than the named pilots.

How many times have we seen "why spend 21 points on a Rookie Pilot when you could have a Blue Squadron for 22?"

The e-wing complaints are also centered on the generics. Most would agree they are overcosted.

I feel ya. Once the new stuff comes out, I really hope we see the diversity these ships are supposed to have

Just the usual forum gloomNdoom.

The whining about the E-ing in particular is totally without any basis in reality.

I remember a time when everyone was complaining that the game was all about pushing as many generics as you could fit into a list around. Much adoo was made about high pilot skill not being worth it and people never using the iconic named pilots. So the devs instituted changed that benefited those high PS pilots over their generic counterparts...now we have people whining that their generics are passed over.

And now the circle is complete.

IMHO I preferred the mostly generic games...heroes aren't going to be in every battle. But the player base got exactly what they asked for...and the grass is always greener on the other side.

Less than a year ago, most of what you'd see used were the Rookie Pilots and Biggs, and occasionally Luke or Wedge would be used but it was much rarer to see. Now that Rookie pilots aren't dominating the meta people see to have forgotten how ever present they were. Right now we're in the midst of the Wave 4 & 5 shift to small, elite squads, but when Wave 6 hits you'll see everything start to even out.

E-Wings are awesome. This is especially true for Corran with his two attacks in the same turn, which is very valuable as it could take out an enemy ship early in the game and reduce the opponent's overall attacking dice for subsequent turns.

I don't get it either. Don't worry. Next week they'll all be complaining about a different ship.

The E-wings I think are mostly fine. Yes, the generics are overcosted, but even if they were a few points less, you probably still wouldn't ever take more than 2.

Xs, just don't really offer anything noteworthy.

-their dial is very straightforward and easy to predict.

-they are slightly tougher than a headhunter for close to double the cost

-they have a respectable 3 attack dice, but this is not hard to find in a rebel list.

-they have very limited actions: focus if you're not sure, TL if you know you're not getting shot (yawn).

-they have limited upgrades. Yes, astromechs are great, but they cost appropriately. Torpedoes are bad and do not cost appropriately. That's it. And due to being an earlier release, they only get EPTs on PS 7+, whereas 5s with EPTs are common enough these days.

In short, they're easily outmaneuvered, easily destroyed, and don't offer enough damage to compensate.

its just generics. They're overcosted. The named pilots are quite good! (Except Porkins. What, how is that supposed to be good? can someone explain???)

(Except Porkins. What, how is that supposed to be good? can someone explain???)

White Kturn with actions. Basically for 26pts you have a PS6 TIE defender

(Except Porkins. What, how is that supposed to be good? can someone explain???)

White Kturn with actions. Basically for 26pts you have a PS6 TIE defender

For chance of two damage?????? Something tells me this isn't cost efficient.

The E-wings I think are mostly fine. Yes, the generics are overcosted, but even if they were a few points less, you probably still wouldn't ever take more than 2.

Xs, just don't really offer anything noteworthy.

-their dial is very straightforward and easy to predict.

-they are slightly tougher than a headhunter for close to double the cost

-they have a respectable 3 attack dice, but this is not hard to find in a rebel list.

-they have very limited actions: focus if you're not sure, TL if you know you're not getting shot (yawn).

-they have limited upgrades. Yes, astromechs are great, but they cost appropriately. Torpedoes are bad and do not cost appropriately. That's it. And due to being an earlier release, they only get EPTs on PS 7+, whereas 5s with EPTs are common enough these days.

In short, they're easily outmaneuvered, easily destroyed, and don't offer enough damage to compensate.

Well said

I flew an old favourite list tonight, and I was quite impressed with just how bad X wings are. No doubt, they have some amazing pilot skills and they hit pretty hard with 3 attack, but their dial and lack of actions is extremely limiting.

They just can't get out of the way when they need to, and they can't pull off any shrewd shenanigans to cut off an enemy they are chasing. They are plodding and predictable and the 2 shields and 3 hull melts away all too quickly.

E wing generics are just a tad too expensive for shoring up the above-mentioned weaknesses of the X wings - the bad dial and the weak defence (1 more agility and switching 3 hull 2 shields for 2 hull 3 shields). Corran can be made to be a real killer, but etahn is not that amazing in my experience. He is arguably the best pilot in the game when there's more than 100 points on the board, but otherwise his buff ability comes at too high of a point cost to surround him with a squad that can actually make use of it. Every time I go up against him in a list, I focus him down first and then my opponent is down at least a third of their total points plus the one pilot ability the whole squad was built around - and thats fairly easily done against 3 agility over 5 hit points. It's like killing 2 tie fighers, really. Not that hard.

I agree the E wings are only minorly over-costed, but I think it's an important few points they are over-costed by. If they were just a few points cheaper, you could afford to have a generic E wing with R2D6 and Lone wolf do its thing on a flank and still have enough points left over for a substantial main force.

In my experience 80% of the complaints are just forum noise, and it is not worth the getting upset.

For chance of two damage??????

One facedown hull card.

Porkins is a gamble, but you pair him with his trusty astromech and he can regen the damage when his gamble fails. That astromech then gambles to restore his hull. When he pays off, he's anything from a white K turner to a white K-turner with Vader's ability. When it doesn't, all his actions get eaten up and he blows himself up.

Thing is, by the time you've given him PTL, Engine Upgrade and his astromech you've spent so many points that even Wedge and Keyan are cheaper and you might as well push up to Corran. Porkins tends to be flown for a laugh more than anything else.

yeah I think its the generics that folks are on about.. I used "Fat Corran" last night and he is awesome!! Corran+R2-D2+ sensor jammer and stealth device and Lone wolf!!!!! divide up your moves every-other turn by going "Offensive double tap" and then "Defensive shield recovering" the following turn... if he is not getting focus fired on he is nearly indestructible!!! Just don't fly into the back of a ship with anti-pursuit lasers like i did AND I rolled a "Hit".. which means i lost my stealth device but he still kicked but however i did have to get out of action and spend more time recovering shields!!

(Except Porkins. What, how is that supposed to be good? can someone explain???)

1. Assuming one point per point of PS, his pilot ability does not cost any points. If you never use his ability, you are fine. He is the cheapest X-Wing with EPT.
2. Porkins with R5-D8, PTL and hull upgrade is very good.

Ive only played ewings a few times as i never really like EU stuff til recently.

But i've found them fun.

Xwings... yeah i dont get the downer either. I think they are really versatile and granted i'm not playing hyper optimised lists at organised play and im playing narrative games and scenarios among friends but.... yeah they work fine for me.

Shiled upgrade, r2d2 and either luke or wedge is still a strong unit IMO

even a red squadron pilot with the same upgrades is fun to play.

The E-wings I think are mostly fine. Yes, the generics are overcosted, but even if they were a few points less, you probably still wouldn't ever take more than 2.

Xs, just don't really offer anything noteworthy.

-their dial is very straightforward and easy to predict.

-they are slightly tougher than a headhunter for close to double the cost

-they have a respectable 3 attack dice, but this is not hard to find in a rebel list.

-they have very limited actions: focus if you're not sure, TL if you know you're not getting shot (yawn).

-they have limited upgrades. Yes, astromechs are great, but they cost appropriately. Torpedoes are bad and do not cost appropriately. That's it. And due to being an earlier release, they only get EPTs on PS 7+, whereas 5s with EPTs are common enough these days.

In short, they're easily outmaneuvered, easily destroyed, and don't offer enough damage to compensate.

Well said

I flew an old favourite list tonight, and I was quite impressed with just how bad X wings are. No doubt, they have some amazing pilot skills and they hit pretty hard with 3 attack, but their dial and lack of actions is extremely limiting.

They just can't get out of the way when they need to, and they can't pull off any shrewd shenanigans to cut off an enemy they are chasing. They are plodding and predictable and the 2 shields and 3 hull melts away all too quickly.

E wing generics are just a tad too expensive for shoring up the above-mentioned weaknesses of the X wings - the bad dial and the weak defence (1 more agility and switching 3 hull 2 shields for 2 hull 3 shields). Corran can be made to be a real killer, but etahn is not that amazing in my experience. He is arguably the best pilot in the game when there's more than 100 points on the board, but otherwise his buff ability comes at too high of a point cost to surround him with a squad that can actually make use of it. Every time I go up against him in a list, I focus him down first and then my opponent is down at least a third of their total points plus the one pilot ability the whole squad was built around - and thats fairly easily done against 3 agility over 5 hit points. It's like killing 2 tie fighers, really. Not that hard.

I agree the E wings are only minorly over-costed, but I think it's an important few points they are over-costed by. If they were just a few points cheaper, you could afford to have a generic E wing with R2D6 and Lone wolf do its thing on a flank and still have enough points left over for a substantial main force.

Add to that that we can't separate a pilot from his platform and we have Wedge, Biggs, Wes sitting in a ship that can't last long enough, nor dodge fire by any means, no matter what you give them as an upgrade.

Yes the X-Wings named Pilots are overcosted, even Biggs. They range from 1/4 to more than 1/3 of your force and don't pay off nowadays. The Rookies, well just compare them to other ships and you just can't justify the 21 points anymore.

The E-Wing is also overcosted. The generics are for sure when compared, and Ethan probably too on 100 points. Otherwise Corran can reach the critical mass of upgrades where he is worth the nearly 50 points you spend on him. But it would do no harm to the game if even he cost 2 less points.

I'm starting to get the impression that the only ships that aren't overcosted/underpowered are the Falcon, The Phantom and the Fighter.

I'm starting to get the impression that the only ships that aren't overcosted/underpowered are the Falcon, The Phantom and the Fighter.

YT2400

Firespray

Corran

Decimator

Lambda

Interceptors

Awings

Generic Bwings

Ywings (in near future)

Tie advanced (near future)

The problem with ships like the Xwing is that they don't fulfill other role than backbone. A backbone ship needs to be cost effective when jousting, and Xwing's aren't. Of course, this comparison doesn't come from a vacuum, but other ships that fulfill that role. For example, an interceptor shouldn't be compared to a Xwing, they are different ships that perform totally different roles, an upgraded Soontir has a lot more potential of play than an upgraded Wedge, for example.

I don't think people want to suddenly play Xwings as top arc dodgers, but, atleast in my case, i want Xwings to be efficient that way. I would either make Xwing 19 points, or give'em them an upgrade option with 1 point cost on their torpedos for +1 hull points. With their straightforward dial, they should be badass to find them face to face and harder to two shot them with the current pool of dominant ships.

That way the choice between a Xwing and Bwing would be purely on dial and upgrade slots differences, instead of just how better the Bwing is at fullfilling that role. And between Z's and Xwings would be more on what kind of firepower you want to bring.

Well, I'm not sure about the X-Wing, seems fine to me so maybe it's only a problem when you play competitively and really notice all the minor differences, but even playing casual surely you always rule out flying a generic E-Wing cos it's just so clearly not worth the points?

I think if you play a list with two or more X-wings against a competent Whisper or Echo list you'll see the problem pretty quick. They really don't have the tools to have a shot in an even match.

And generic E's are pretty bad in general.

*snip* "why spend 21 points on a Rookie Pilot when you could have a Blue Squadron for 22?"

Because you want one more agility and a more varied dial? I was under the impression that strength of dial was factored into a ships cost, and while I enjoy b-wings, especially with crew I find them limiting without beefing them up with upgrades. My experience is limited though as I am mostly an Imperial player.

-Cal

I'm starting to get the impression that the only ships that aren't overcosted/underpowered are the Falcon, The Phantom and the Fighter.

YT2400

Firespray

Corran

Decimator

Lambda

Interceptors

Awings

Generic Bwings

Ywings (in near future)

Tie advanced (near future)

The problem with ships like the Xwing is that they don't fulfill other role than backbone. A backbone ship needs to be cost effective when jousting, and Xwing's aren't. Of course, this comparison doesn't come from a vacuum, but other ships that fulfill that role. For example, an interceptor shouldn't be compared to a Xwing, they are different ships that perform totally different roles, an upgraded Soontir has a lot more potential of play than an upgraded Wedge, for example.

I don't think people want to suddenly play Xwings as top arc dodgers, but, atleast in my case, i want Xwings to be efficient that way. I would either make Xwing 19 points, or give'em them an upgrade option with 1 point cost on their torpedos for +1 hull points. With their straightforward dial, they should be badass to find them face to face and harder to two shot them with the current pool of dominant ships.

That way the choice between a Xwing and Bwing would be purely on dial and upgrade slots differences, instead of just how better the Bwing is at fullfilling that role. And between Z's and Xwings would be more on what kind of firepower you want to bring.

You forgot Z-95s.