Great job OP. The cannons are what I expected but I like their costs.

It will be easy to pair ywings with ion and m3a's with flechette cannons to totally lock down opponents.

My prediction i's an average dial (ie similar to an xwing, better than a z95 but worse than a Tie/ln.)... Potentially with segnor-loops instead of KTurns to make them more interesting and mobile.

These cannons aren't stellar on Defenders. Didn't think they would be. I'd rather run an Ion cannon over a fletchette. The Mangler is a bit interesting, if you can't fit an HLC then it could be useful. 3 delta's, 2 With ions and 1 with a Mangler could be fun. But competitively the Tempest with ATC does what a Delta With a Mangler does and for way way cheaper.

I wonder how well Mangler works with Tactician.

Where are people getting the idea that the Mangler just adds Etahn's ability? It also grants Wedge's ability when attacking targets at Range 3, as it's a secondary weapon that ignores range modifiers.

And can be Jonused.

Triple Lambda-mangler with Jonus? Add Vader to one shuttle for the extra crit.

I wonder how well Mangler works with Tactician.

Where are people getting the idea that the Mangler just adds Etahn's ability? It also grants Wedge's ability when attacking targets at Range 3, as it's a secondary weapon that ignores range modifiers.

And can be Jonused.

Triple Lambda-mangler with Jonus? Add Vader to one shuttle for the extra crit.

Nah, man. A Fleet Officer's better, but I think I'd go with Prox mines on Jonus instead.

It protects your herd from getting flanked, after all.

As far as the heavy scyk is concerned, every cannon/torpedo/missile is going to be cost inefficient in the vacuum because of the title cost.

It has that extra cost because it also pushes you from 2 dice to 3 dice (or 4 for HLC) whereas for all other ships barring Outrider (which is a special case) you've got a 3 dice primary anyway. Likewise, there's only one ship in the game where Proton Rockets are worth it and cost 3 points (TIE advanced) on the cheaper ships that can run more of them they cost 5.

Extra dice Isn't the only reason for using a cannon, denying range three bonus die is very useful against two agility or even one agility ships.

You want to ruin a yt`s day putting stress on it turn after turn will certainly help.

Let's not forget that Flechette Cannons only give stress to ships with no stress. PTL interceptors/Dashband every build that effectively uses/mitigates stress don't mind at all.

Mangler cannons sound like the could be well worth the price. I realize that HLC going to continue to be king but honestly 3 points in savings could really add up quickly.

Let's not forget that Flechette Cannons only give stress to ships with no stress. PTL interceptors/Dashband every build that effectively uses/mitigates stress don't mind at all.

Mangler cannons sound like the could be well worth the price. I realize that HLC going to continue to be king but honestly 3 points in savings could really add up quickly.

Unless you shoot before the PTL interceptor uses it (Albeit Turr Phenir is the only one this would apply to I believe) and/or it is still nice for beating Phantoms (granted it means VI on Rexlar/Boba/Kath/Serissu, or Decoy/Swarm Tactics)

Let's not forget that Flechette Cannons only give stress to ships with no stress. PTL interceptors/Dashband every build that effectively uses/mitigates stress don't mind at all.

It doesn't do much against Interceptors, true. However, if you run into a B-Wing or two, I think denying them the K-turn can be extremely powerful. Really, any low agility ship without a turret will be susceptible to it; B-Wings, title Y-Wings, Lambdas and to a certain extent X-Wings and Headhunters. If they do a green and shed stress, hit them again. If they don't, and try to white-turn, switch to lasers, follow them, and then hit them again.

I think the Flechette Cannon has a place, even on Defenders and Firesprays, but like an Ion Cannon it is a secondary weapon, in the truest sense of the word.

Let's not forget that Flechette Cannons only give stress to ships with no stress. PTL interceptors/Dashband every build that effectively uses/mitigates stress don't mind at all.

It doesn't do much against Interceptors, true. However, if you run into a B-Wing or two, I think denying them the K-turn can be extremely powerful. Really, any low agility ship without a turret will be susceptible to it; B-Wings, title Y-Wings, Lambdas and to a certain extent X-Wings and Headhunters. If they do a green and shed stress, hit them again. If they don't, and try to white-turn, switch to lasers, follow them, and then hit them again.

I think the Flechette Cannon has a place, even on Defenders and Firesprays, but like an Ion Cannon it is a secondary weapon, in the truest sense of the word.

You take a lambda shuttle, then remove the firepower, and you're effectively flying in a table with 7 asteroids.

For scum one scyk doling out stress on large ships is worth it, outrider with HLC isnt nearly as scary when it cant TL or focus.

If Kyle is onboard it'll still have focus, but having to stick to green turns if it wants to target lock makes it susceptible to blocking and donut hole shenanigans.

i'm really disappointed in these cannons, i was hoping for something worthwhile to put of the Tie Defender and these aren't it.

There is a significant advantage if you use Manglers on your Defenders: No range 3 extra green and a good chance to score a crit. But you cannot have 3 Defenders with Mangler cannons. After all, Tie Defenders are meant to carry Ion Cannons.

Hopefully we'll get an awing level dial and the ps bump.

This will be as annoying as all get out for a casual game:

Serrisu+PTL+mangler+hull!

Laetin+stealth+MANGLER!

N'Dru+ lone wolf + hull

Leech+ bodyguard

Not competetive but will be great fun against my friend's 9 year old.

Lol so spineless ... playing games you can't lose ... destroying the dreams and hopes of 9 year old kiddies....

You are my hero.

I've lost a few games to him already. I mistakenly showed him how to play EU Vader with outmanuever. Add the new ATC and I might be losing more games to him soon. He's also a great Chewie falcon flyer. Annoying!

But let's look at the defender. The defender is already over costed by 3 points and does not dish out enough damage to give it any role or be a better choice than 2 and a half ties. Putting an additional cannon cost makes it even worse as you lose your main attack. Flèchette only does a max of 1 damage.

Mangler really isn't worth it. You lose your fourth die (you wouldn't use mangler at all) at R1.

Who's losing their main attack? That's only how cannons work with the Outrider.

Other ships can switch between their main or cannon as they see fit...

But let's look at the defender. The defender is already over costed by 3 points and does not dish out enough damage to give it any role or be a better choice than 2 and a half ties. Putting an additional cannon cost makes it even worse as you lose your main attack. Flèchette only does a max of 1 damage.

Mangler really isn't worth it. You lose your fourth die (you wouldn't use mangler at all) at R1.

Who's losing their main attack? That's only how cannons work with the Outrider.

Other ships can switch between their main or cannon as they see fit...

Oh I see what you mean now. I meant that you don't get to attack with both primary and secondary and implied that the loss of damage from taking a cannon outweighed its benefits especially considering that they cost extra

But let's look at the defender. The defender is already over costed by 3 points and does not dish out enough damage to give it any role or be a better choice than 2 and a half ties. Putting an additional cannon cost makes it even worse as you lose your main attack. Flèchette only does a max of 1 damage.

Mangler really isn't worth it. You lose your fourth die (you wouldn't use mangler at all) at R1.

Who's losing their main attack? That's only how cannons work with the Outrider.

Other ships can switch between their main or cannon as they see fit...

Oh I see what you mean now. I meant that you don't get to attack with both primary and secondary and implied that the loss of damage from taking a cannon outweighed its benefits especially considering that they cost extra

The Mangler is far and away better than your primaries at Range 2 and 3. So, at Range 1, use your primaries, and 2&3, use the Mangler. You already do this with the HLC, and the Mangler is cheaper. Even if HLC worked at Range 1, your primary weapon would be better on any 3 attack ship because HLC cancels crits at first. Therefore, the Mangler is al more than worth it off you think HLC I'd worth it. Guaranteed crit I'd a big deal, as is the range bonus denial.

Maybe they should errata away the "no range-1 bonus dice for secondary weapons" thing.

Hmm. Hmm. The range non restricted is good. But I don't know about these.... Gonna have to try it myself.

Lots of crit stuff now.

For the mangler cannon it is way underpriced for the range. It should be at least 5 or 4 but range 2-3.

Mangler Dash is going to give HLC outrider some tough spots.

As for the flechette cannon it is sort of like ion but only gives stress instead. I guess hearing thousands of deadly shards bouncing off the cockpit can be stressful.

The Mangler is far and away better than your primaries at Range 2 and 3. So, at Range 1, use your primaries, and 2&3, use the Mangler. You already do this with the HLC, and the Mangler is cheaper. Even if HLC worked at Range 1, your primary weapon would be better on any 3 attack ship because HLC cancels crits at first. Therefore, the Mangler is al more than worth it off you think HLC I'd worth it. Guaranteed crit I'd a big deal, as is the range bonus denial.

If the shields are up that crit isn't doing much though. If you're running dual Defenders, or have a Lambda in there, it might be worth it giving the higher PS one a Heavy Laser Cannon to strip some off before the other one fires off a mango.

Captain Jonus (22)

- Flechette Torpedo (2)

- Flechette Torpedo (2)

- Predator (3)

Delta Squadron Pilot (30)

- Heavy Laser Cannon (7)

Delta Squadron Pilot (30)

- Mangler Cannon (4)

or

Captain Jonus (22)

- Flechette Torpedo (2)

- Flechette Torpedo (2)

- Munitions Failsafe (1)

- Determination (1)

Rexler Brath (37)

- Heavy Laser Cannon (7)

- Predator (3)

Omicron Group Pilot (21)

- Mangler Cannon (4)

So Laetin is a swarm counter then? I can see that being very frustrating to damage with lots of 2 dice ships.

Can also work as a gunner counter. Often against gunner you never spend an evade or focus token if it cancels all the hits because they will just attack you again and you would have spent your token. This way you can keep getting evade tokens.

Defiantly an agility build. Stealth Device would be good here.

I wonder if the flechette cannon projectiles are tipped with smiley faces.

For scum one scyk doling out stress on large ships is worth it, outrider with HLC isnt nearly as scary when it cant TL or focus.

That is the one advantage of the cannon weapon over the torpedo weapon.

Still what do you think is better dealing Ion Tokens or Dealing Stress Tokens.

Ion of course as the cannon cost more points for almost the same effect.

However I would like to try a bunch of stress Ion Builds.

So Laetin is a swarm counter then? I can see that being very frustrating to damage with lots of 2 dice ships.

Can also work as a gunner counter. Often against gunner you never spend an evade or focus token if it cancels all the hits because they will just attack you again and you would have spent your token. This way you can keep getting evade tokens.

Defiantly an agility build. Stealth Device would be good here.

He's also conveniently PS6, so the glut of PS5 EPT pilots that Scum have could run Bodyguard beside him.

Maybe they should errata away the "no range-1 bonus dice for secondary weapons" thing.

I agree for cannons, but Cluster Missiles, Proton Rockets, and APTs probably don't need the help (okay APTs might)

Oh I see what you mean now.

And now I see what you meant - thanks for the clarification and sorry for the misunderstanding!