Zombie thread!!!

Well, I don't know about any official ruling, but I still yes, Adversary will count for all combat checks. I don't use them for other checks, like Scathing Tirade, as it is against a set difficulty, not the individual. With combat, you are still targeting either that person or ship piloted by that person. If the Baddie was a gunner or passenger I wouldn't use Adversary though. It doesn't matter if the base difficulty is due to range in personal combat or Silhouette Size for vehicle combat. A good pilot can also change their Silhouette Size. I think the Adversary represents a lot of those talents that players can have, but NPCs may not have. Adversary is a way to build the Big baddie quickly, without going through a ton of Talents and picking out the ones you want. You still can, but I think in a way that defeats the purpose of Adversary, unless you are building a Super Villain like Vader. Vader could be Adversary 3, and still have a ton of those great talents that many characters have, making him even tougher than the "average" Adversary 3 baddie.

Oh, and welcome to the forum, and thank you for using the search function!!!!

I don't use them for other checks, like Scathing Tirade, as it is against a set difficulty, not the individual.

Alright, thanks everyone! I appreciate the help.

This is a great question, all though, I never read the part about the talent as anything but ALL checks.

This seems like a trivial case of a player who has played too much D&D/Pathfinder where they think the goal of the game is to "beat" the GM, not tell a story. I like it when players like to quote the book, but they always seem to neglect the early chapters of the book, specifically ECRB Pages 8-9.

"The Game Master is the player who sets the scenes..."

"The GM is not the PCs' adversary or playing 'against' the other players."

"Remember, since Edge of the Empire relies on narrative and interpretive play, all the players work together to evaluate results and describe how the story unfolds. The GM just has the additional responsibilities of managing the NPCs, helping resolve disputes, and establishing how the game rules will be applied. Ultimately, the GM's word is final. If the GM makes a ruling, the other players should accept it and keep the story moving."

Most people (players) always seem to forget that last part.

A couple of sessions ago, we too had a question come up about the Adversary Talent, so I thought this would be a good place to ask the question instead of creating a new thread.

i am the GM, just for clarification.

We were in space combat, and I had a TIE fighter jump in from hyperspace, and attack the Group's ship. They fired back, The difficulty was two purple, I said to upgrade the check to 2 red and two purple. They asked why, and I explained he had Adversary 4, so the attacks were upgraded 4 times. They of course did not like that, and tried to call BS on me. I took the moment to look up the Talent in the book, and read to them the above quote in the OP. "Upgrade any combat check..." they countered with the fact they they are not targeting the character, but the ship, I said I see your point, but I am the GM, and my word is upgrade the check by 4. They complied without further argument. My Group trusts me though, and we do not play the "Me versus You" type of game. They were trying to blow up a super baddie in a hyperspace capable TIE, but I would have none of that. The baddie got off one shot before they made the jump to hyperspace. But it left me wondering, did I make the right call.

I have no problem when my players "call" or "check" me on rules. Sometimes we can have a little discussion about them, but in the end, after I say, this is my final answer on it, they respect me enough to move on with it.

Thoughts? Should/does Adversary Talent also take effect in space combat?

We do try to play the game RAW as much as we can.

Logang, welcome to our group, and good luck with that player. He seems like he might be a handful for you...

Side note: All Talents that have a limited use is stated in the descriptions clearly with things like "Once per Encounter..."

I may be wrong, but wouldn't Adversary 4 turn two purple into three red? Since its not adding a skill rank or a characteristic, and it's upgrading, the first two points of it changes the two purple dice into reds, the third point adds another purple, and the fourth point changes that last purple to a third red.

Or have i just read the "upgrade vs increase" section incorrectly? I don't mean to nit pick, it just stood out to me.

You're correct here. Three red.

pg 21 - Upgrading more dice than available

(Necro'd thread coz I'm reading CRB and clarifying rules)

On the subject of Adversary... does anyone here allow it to apply to checks other than combat checks, or is it only used for direct attacks against the enemy in question?

On the subject of Adversary... does anyone here allow it to apply to checks other than combat checks, or is it only used for direct attacks against the enemy in question?

I keep it to combat checks only, otherwise it starts getting messy when you delve into opposed checks. It's a lot easier to give an NPC ranks in whatever skill is necessary to make an opposed check a challenge for the PCs than it generally is for PCs to get high ranks in skills.

It is situational, but mostly yes I do.

is it to charm, bribe, or intimidate the BBG then yes.

is it to find him in a crowd, or just sneak past him, or listen to the thinks he whispers to the other BBG next to him. Then no.

In other Words everything that is directly pointet at him will activate the advasery talent, anything passiv won´t

On the subject of Adversary... does anyone here allow it to apply to checks other than combat checks, or is it only used for direct attacks against the enemy in question?

I only allow it to affect combat checks, but with a somewhat liberal interpretation of what constitutes a combat check. I only allow it in combat with "adversarial" rolls, but I do extend it to stuff like using Scathing Tirade against an NPC with Adversary. But only in combat, and only with rolls that target or include the NPC in question.

What about opposed Force power checks? Would it apply then?

If he the BBG is an Force user - yes everytime

If he is not - in Battle yes - out of battle...well depending what the PC tries to accomplish, but mostly if it is active against him, most likely.

Adversary is meant to be that cinematic inexpiable ability of the evildoer being able to survive or avoid devastating attacks. It's not meant to be some rigidly interpreted mechanical 'one size fits all and there is no way to deviate from this rule under pain of death' feature. GMs should feel free to apply it as they see fit.

What about opposed Force power checks? Would it apply then?

By RAW, only if the Force power describes it as being a combat check.

So ranks in Adversary would apply if you were to throw something at the NPC using Move, or to attack them outright with Unleash, as both of those effect are described as combat checks. Using Influence to affect the target's mode would not, since by RAW it's an opposed check but not a combat check.

Gotcha. Thanks!

In my book "social combat" (verbal attacks) or "mental combat" (trying to FORCE-ably alter their mental state) is still "combat"

What about opposed Force power checks? Would it apply then?

By RAW, only if the Force power describes it as being a combat check.

So ranks in Adversary would apply if you were to throw something at the NPC using Move, or to attack them outright with Unleash, as both of those effect are described as combat checks. Using Influence to affect the target's mode would not, since by RAW it's an opposed check but not a combat check.

Gotcha. Thanks!

Ranks of Nobody's Fool for your social defense Talent.

What about opposed Force power checks? Would it apply then?

By RAW, only if the Force power describes it as being a combat check.

So ranks in Adversary would apply if you were to throw something at the NPC using Move, or to attack them outright with Unleash, as both of those effect are described as combat checks. Using Influence to affect the target's mode would not, since by RAW it's an opposed check but not a combat check.

Gotcha. Thanks!

Ranks of Nobody's Fool for your social defense Talent.

I was going to say, the talent you are looking for is Nobody's Fool.