Hi Guys,

I've searched the site for rules for Starship Combat and the best explanation I found was this (thanks to Serif Marak ):

- Speed 1+ : move to another location within close range.

- Speed 2+ : move between close and short range.

- Speed 5+ : move between close and medium range.

- Speed 1+ : move between close and short range.

- Speed 2+ : move between close and medium range.

- Speed 5+ : move between close and long range.

I sat down and did a hex-grid and something worked remarkably well, but I need some people to poke holes in it.

This is the hex grid I used:

Could this work?

I think the following could be added:

• In this chart, a standard "Move" is half the vehicle's current speed (rounding down)
• A ship can "coast" as a 1/3 of its movement rounding down as an incidental meaning that ships with 4-6 move one "hex".
• For weapons, the following would apply
  - Close: Must be in the same hex
  - Short: 1 hex
  - Medium: 2-3 hexes
  - Long: 4-6 hexes
  - Extreme: 7-10 hexes
• Facing doesn't matter.
• You can chose to not move at all (i.e. doing rolls, spins around the same area).
• A hex is an "area of space" with no defined distance.

I only thought about using this as I am having trouble working out where things are. I don't want to turn this into the next X-Wing board game, I just want to make it easier on the players and me to visualise the combat..

Thoughts?

So, you'll move each ship relative to the center which contains the player's ship to show the relative positioning? Just remember that if you can get to Short, you can get to ANYWHERE in Short, not just the hex on your side of the fight as fights are 3D and dynamic. The 3D aspect is the big problem with trying to reduce the narrative down to something like this 2D grid.

That's not what I was going for. I wanted to represent that if you have two ships at Close Range, and one goes at full speed (lets say they have a Speed of 4) in one direction, and one (of the same type/speed.etc) goes at full speed in the opposite direction, they are not in the same range band. They would be somewhere akin to long or extreme range from each other.

I guess you could also split the diagram into quarters (to marry up with facings for ships with Silhouette 5 or more) and use it as a template.

I don't want this system to slow down or limit imagination. I'm just wanting it to help players visualise the combat just that little easier.

Why not just treat space combat in the same manner as personal scale combat? I tend to find things like the above to be an exceedingly boring way to handle space combat. Especially when space combat is essentially the same a personal scale combat with small differences.

Because as has been said hundreds of times here and elsewhere - you can still use maps...just don't be regimented with regards to scale (i.e. don't get bogged down with precise measurements).

Because as has been said hundreds of times here and elsewhere - you can still use maps...just don't be regimented with regards to scale (i.e. don't get bogged down with precise measurements).

I dont belive the above poster was saying you shouldn't use a map, I think you're making this a bit more complex than it needs to be. If I understood correctly, what you're trying to accomplish it's really how at least my table do it in personal combat (we have barely touched spaceship combat yet), but since we usually have a painted map it's easy to eyeball ranges. If PJ1 and PJ2 are together in a huge cantina and PJ1 charges against an ewok that dances in the stage at medium range, the PJ1 marker moves to the ewok now it's obvious that both PJs are medium range from each other (it's there in the map). If now pj2 charges against a wookie that's at medium range in oposite direction, outside the cantina by the door lets say, now you can just look at the map and see that pj1 and pj2 are further appart, maybe long range.

If you dont want to eyeball so much, your table is picky about this kind of stuff or you like to keep a bit better track of things (as do I tbh, having a hard time with EotE for some stuff) you could make a ruler with the range bands painted and use it to keep track of ranges.

For example, say you have a capital ship, long range of the PCs ship and a wing of TIE fighters at engaged range of the capital ship. If the PCs ship approachs to say, medium range of the ties, then you use the ruler from the TIEs, see where their medium range is, move them there, and they're considered at medium range of anything the ruler says is medium range(in this case the capital ship).

If next round they tried to get away from the TIE, they could choose the direction affecting their distance with the capital ship, staying at the same distance, moving away or getting closer while putting distance with the TIE.

This should work just giving a hex value for each range band too.

EDIT: typos everywhere

That's not what I was going for. I wanted to represent that if you have two ships at Close Range, and one goes at full speed (lets say they have a Speed of 4) in one direction, and one (of the same type/speed.etc) goes at full speed in the opposite direction, they are not in the same range band. They would be somewhere akin to long or extreme range from each other.

The problem is the system doesn't work like that at all. Are you proposing this as a house rule, or are you having trouble wrapping you head around the system?

What happens when the players are in two different ships? Two of these charts? Then, how do the two charts relate to each other?

If you dont want to eyeball so much, your table is picky about this kind of stuff or you like to keep a bit better track of things (as do I tbh, having a hard time with EotE for some stuff) you could make a ruler with the range bands painted and use it to keep track of ranges.

I agree Hooly. If you want this kind of detail, convert your grid above into a straight ruler* (first inch is Close, next inch Short, next 2 inches Medium, etc). Then, just use a black mat on your table without any hexes or squares upon it. You can use the ruler to get a quick guess of the range between various objects/ships placed on the mat.

*After 2nd thought, I would make the length of the ruler (use different colored string tied together?) more like 3' depending on your play area with 2 inches per hex on your chart to give more room to move things around?

The problem is the system doesn't work like that at all. Are you proposing this as a house rule, or are you having trouble wrapping you head around the system?

For a start - I haven't even started playing yet, and secondly - yes I'm having a hard time getting my head round it.

What happens when the players are in two different ships? Two of these charts? Then, how do the two charts relate to each other?

They would have their own template is how I see it in my head.

What happens when the players are in two different ships? Two of these charts? Then, how do the two charts relate to each other?

They would have their own template is how I see it in my head.

Seriusly, you don't need that much hassle. Have you played any session of EotE at all?. I see from your signature that you've played d20. Just imagine that you played without a square mat and instead of counting the squares you allowed the players to eyeball distances. It's really just like that for personal combat. If you extend it to spacecraft combat it'll work like a charm with a map.

No I haven't played at all - its a crime, I know

But I have read and listened to it enough that I think I have it in my head but I'm not clear and although I will have a couple of experienced players, most have either never played in the system or are new to Role Playing.

For my Edge of the Empire game, I don't expect starship combat to play a huge part, but I don't want players to actively avoid it because it's a bit too hard.

For a Starfighter Campaign though, it needs to be a solid system as every session will involve some element of it I guess.

No I haven't played at all - its a crime, I know

But I have read and listened to it enough that I think I have it in my head but I'm not clear and although I will have a couple of experienced players, most have either never played in the system or are new to Role Playing.

For my Edge of the Empire game, I don't expect starship combat to play a huge part, but I don't want players to actively avoid it because it's a bit too hard.

For a Starfighter Campaign though, it needs to be a solid system as every session will involve some element of it I guess.

Just start with personal combat then. Use if you can a map or drawings with whiteboard marker and some markers or miniatures for the characters. You'll see how it's quite easy to figure distances. There are good explanations in the book about each range band for personal combat.Two guys siting at the same table are engaged, guy a few tables away is at short range etc.

Once you have that down and the time for spaceship combat comes, just do exactly the same, cept with an empty map if it's just empty space . Make the ruler I mentioned if you want some consistency in the ranges, since in space it's harder as there is no "everyday objects" to keep a sense of scale. You will have no trouble at all with ranges. Some other rules might give you a headache later on

The problem is the system doesn't work like that at all. Are you proposing this as a house rule, or are you having trouble wrapping you head around the system?

For a start - I haven't even started playing yet, and secondly - yes I'm having a hard time getting my head round it.

Ok, first up: I'll be free later this week (I would be on tonight, but I'm playing in Serif's game), if you want a formal demo I can give you one on Roll20. The system FFG went with is good, but it is different then what most people expect so if you want a walkthrough I'll be happy to give you one. PM me if you're interested.

Now on to what you've got...

Forget the speed numbers and only think of movement maneuvers. If you aren't doing a fly/drive you aren't moving* as far as the gameboard is concerned. So the whole "This moving speed 6 this way, and that moving speed 3 that way, so there should be 9 between them" isn't a thing.

*On Moving:

If the players are all in a single ship, you want a radar scope type view like you see on the right:

In this view the player's ship stays in the middle and you move the other markers around it.

If you want lots of craft with different players in each, then something more like this will work too.

Notice there's plenty of space in each hex so you can really get a decent furball going. I labeled ranges in relation to the YT-1300, but it can also work in relation to the others. In the same hex is Close, next one over is Short, and so on.

Depending on the encounter something like this might work too:

Nice summary, Ghost. I just have one question: The Flaming Loin?

Nice summary, Ghost. I just have one question: The Flaming Loin?

That's Lion!

It's just from a "game" I have loaded on Roll20 for demoing stuff.

That's not what I was going for. I wanted to represent that if you have two ships at Close Range, and one goes at full speed (lets say they have a Speed of 4) in one direction, and one (of the same type/speed.etc) goes at full speed in the opposite direction, they are not in the same range band. They would be somewhere akin to long or extreme range from each other.

I guess you could also split the diagram into quarters (to marry up with facings for ships with Silhouette 5 or more) and use it as a template.

I don't want this system to slow down or limit imagination. I'm just wanting it to help players visualise the combat just that little easier.

Then put them on a star map. this map will not make things easier it will make things more boring and more limited. Instead whip out a space map and do things like you would do for personal scale on a map. Just like using a map in personal scale makes it easier to keep track of what is going on it is the same here. Everytime I see people do things the way you are doing it makes me want to scream. That is the most boring and limiting way to do it. At least on a space map players can do things like duck behind things on the map to make things more difficult. etc.

Nice summary, Ghost. I just have one question: The Flaming Loin?

That's Lion!

It's just from a "game" I have loaded on Roll20 for demoing stuff.

You might want to "Grill" the person who spelled it like that...

When I ran a starfighter ggame, I wrote out a 3x5 card with each vehical's stats and crew rolls, and used each vehica's card as an eyeballed location marker.

The Speed 2 Lancer got the Jaws theme when it limped toward the furball the players were in- My players are savvy enough to know that they would NOT survive if it reached range, so it sserved to fore the combat to move.

The battle took place on the edge of an asteroid field- moving in started adding Dangerous terrain tests, with more black dice the deeper you go...

If you intend a fighter game to last awhile, I would suggest some kind of Vehical Scale fix- I would declare "Vehcal scale" to be all ships and vehicals silluettette 4 or less (so, everything with 2 shield facings, while Starship Scale would have the 4 facings craft), double all their wounds and System Strain, but declare that their damage is halved against starships and only x5 vs personal scale. (this also pertially fixes the "glass starfighter" problem in dogfights, as well as making a swoop-mounted Autoblaster an Eweb instead of a GAU 8.)

Nice summary, Ghost. I just have one question: The Flaming Loin?

That's Lion!

Whew, I thought somebody had the SpaceClap...

Also, where did you get that funky targeting computer graphic??

Also, where did you get that funky targeting computer graphic??

someone over on D20 Radio made it IIRC. I'll see about getting it to you.

Much appreciated.

I guess the only concern that I have is how it works with multiple "points of view" when the players are on separate ships.

Much appreciated.

I guess the only concern that I have is how it works with multiple "points of view" when the players are on separate ships.

Don't use that method. Put the ships on a starmap and move them around on that. Much more fun than these radar screen methods. Which are boring.

In a word...someone needs to do a YouTube Video...

For those that want to know:

LINK : http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8377/8442890881_7c6dcdc88e_b.jpg