Well, I've had my decimator and my yt2400 for a week, and I can't stop figuring out new builds on a daily basis. Yesterday, during a conversation with a friend, we agreed that (at least in our meta) almost every list is a phantom list, or a counter-phantom list.

Pretty normal until this point, the thing is: How about taking Whisper, ignoring the initiative bid, and going for something like: Lone wolf, Advanced Sensors, Recon Specialist, and Advanced Cloaking device.

We both agreed that was at least interesting, and even evaluated the Stygium Particle Accelerator. Solid against PS 6 or less, defensive enough vs higher PS, and cannot be blocked out of actions due to ADVS.

What do you think?

More than that, I want to take the Expose Phantom out for a spin first.

More than that, I want to take the Expose Phantom out for a spin first.

"Whisper" (32)

Expose (4)

Advanced Sensors (3)

Experimental Interface (3)

Use decloaking essentially for a speed boost rather than evasive maneuver. Use the interface to pop both Focus + Expose before revealing your dial, then take a green move to clear the stress. Five dice every turn, lots of movement options with decloaking/barrel rolling. Try to stick at Range 3 for that essential bonus defensive dice. Recon Specialist could help.

Feel like you're either screwed when you play against a higher PS list or you choose not to use Expose most turns and have wasted 7 pts...

Well, I've had my decimator and my yt2400 for a week, and I can't stop figuring out new builds on a daily basis. Yesterday, during a conversation with a friend, we agreed that (at least in our meta) almost every list is a phantom list, or a counter-phantom list.

Pretty normal until this point, the thing is: How about taking Whisper, ignoring the initiative bid, and going for something like: Lone wolf, Advanced Sensors, Recon Specialist, and Advanced Cloaking device.

We both agreed that was at least interesting, and even evaluated the Stygium Particle Accelerator. Solid against PS 6 or less, defensive enough vs higher PS, and cannot be blocked out of actions due to ADVS.

What do you think?

Could work, you'd want to be very careful and stay at range 3 and away from the rest of your list though when playing against higher PS, which will reduce your movement options... which is bad for a phantom. I think if I was ignoring the PS bid and needed extra movement options I'd rather have Echo, though I guess then you're matching PS with Chewy and Leebo, and now lower than Kenkirk which are also bad.

ACD phantoms make VI something of an autoinclude unless you're really confident in your dodging ability.

I've suggested a phantom/vt49 team up similar to your original post idea a while back i think i called it a 'hammer and anvil' list.

the vt49 is tanky and just has to try to hold together as the anvil while the hyper elusive falcon 'hammers' away at things between the two.

You'd be much better off with a Captive on your Phantom and an initiative bid, if you want to hard-counter Phantoms with Phantoms.

Imho.

Phantoms are expensive. It needs to last at least as long and do at least as much or more damage than any other 40 point ship. They are also quite fragile. I'd like to see other builds work on phantoms, just as I'd like to see other builds work on interceptors besides push the Limit. The issue is, they NEED the maneuvering advantage to be worth it, and 4 dice with a focus affords much higher durability than two with a conditional reroll.

If not equipped with stygium, the main problem for my original build would be enemy maneuverable fighters with 8+ PS (Assuming Whisper) or turreted ships that manageto keep me in range. Solo or a Ps8+ decimator being the most annoying pairings by far.

The rest of pairings, you have a 4 dice defense with a focus for offense and 1 or 2 for defense, and decent defense to deliver damage with 4 dice + 1 reroll + focus. MAYBE to counter solo, a tactical jammer would do, forcing the focus. That wouldn't help against Rear Admiral Chiraneau unless he rolls two eyes instead of one.

You'd be much better off with a Captive on your Phantom and an initiative bid, if you want to hard-counter Phantoms with Phantoms.

Imho.

Sorry I didn't mention it, but in my build I would be pairing my phantom with an antiphantom decimator, a PS 10 Chiraneau, which is also carrying a good old rebel prisioner. That way I can protect it, even if I lose one or two turns my lone wolf. In my Lone Wolf phantom, swarms will probably be cake, if I manage to move Chiraneu around carefully (Thinking about engine upgrade for maximum trolling).

Last weekend I had a tournament and used a naked whisper (Naked is ACD and VI only.) Having VI didn't affect any of the three games, which I won, by a fair margin in two of them. Having lone wolf in Kenkirk helped me a lot, but I think could do with a VI Chiraneau. I ended up second, but with three wins.

3 modifiable green dice might be better than 4 straight green dice, but 2 modifiable dice are not, especially when you can only modify one. Nothing has changed for how to build the best Phantom in Wave 5.

More than that, I want to take the Expose Phantom out for a spin first.

"Whisper" (32)

Expose (4)

Advanced Sensors (3)

Experimental Interface (3)

Use decloaking essentially for a speed boost rather than evasive maneuver. Use the interface to pop both Focus + Expose before revealing your dial, then take a green move to clear the stress. Five dice every turn, lots of movement options with decloaking/barrel rolling. Try to stick at Range 3 for that essential bonus defensive dice. Recon Specialist could help.

4 dice + TL + Focus is 3.75 expected hits

5 dice + Focus is 3.75 expected hits

(both calculations ignore the effects of crits) But the math is clear if you are going to spend two actions on an attack it doesn't help you for one of them to be expose. It does hurt your agility, and for a ship that can take one more hit than a TIE Fighter yet costs nearly half your points

However I think what I would really want to avoid is the stress from EI

I know you didn't put on the advanced cloak, but I think it is a no brainer, and then having a stress means you don't get your free re-cloak.

Had a crazy friend take this to a local tournie:

Echo

*Lone Wolf

*Sensor Jammer

*Flight Instructor

*ADC

basically invincible to Z-95 fire, but Dash shot her down just fine

still, he managed to take 2nd with that Echo and a really strange Kath Scarlet build

Had a crazy friend take this to a local tournie:

Echo

*Lone Wolf

*Sensor Jammer

*Flight Instructor

*ADC

basically invincible to Z-95 fire, but Dash shot her down just fine

still, he managed to take 2nd with that Echo and a really strange Kath Scarlet build

Maybe JUST because of Dash, is better to choose Whisper over Echo when picking Lone Wolf.

Whisper can do fine against HLC outrider Dash either shooting first or moving last.

PS: Just curiosity, how did he build Kath?

Well if you don't go ACD plus VI it would probably be on Echo as he can maneuver out of arcs and even out of range when needed much easier. It would look like this approximately:

"Echo” (38)

TIE Phantom (30), Intelligence Agent (1), Advanced Sensors (3), Lone Wolf (2), Stygium Particle Accelerator (2)

Best paired with a Decimator perhaps, because people need to deal with that as well, and strategies workingn against phantons don't necessarily work against Decimators.