This is going to break the internet but, I don't think the original trilogy is all that much better compared to the new ones(not that they aren't better). There are a lot of good things but a lot of truly dreadful stuff as well with a good mix of bad acting in parts.Are they great movies YES but the prequel never stood a chance with the huge expectations on them and I think if you could show someone the OT after removing the exact memory of what happened in them from their mind and told them they were a prequel they would have said they weren't as good as the original.people need to remember as well that for the Jedi and their allies it was a dark age, many of them would have abandoned everything that it was to be a Jedi just to survive. Technology takes a step back in dark ages generally as well and I think they are well within their rights to do what they did.Take JJ Abrahams star trek reboot, what was star trek doing before he came along....... Star Trek Online........... awkward silenceWhat is ACTUALLY wrong with the prequels? Mostly your fragile misconceptions of what Star Wars is or isn't people get far to dogmatic with these kinds of things and I believe the star wars story was very much all in Lucas' head in the main and it was his story to change and determine I mean the first movie was called Episode IV.......

Star trek online came out after the jar jar trek movie, the quests trying to explain away the nonsensical explosion that destroyed the romulon home world were part of the levelling process not added later.

As a result you clearly don't no what your on about and I declare your arguments invalid.

This is going to break the internet but, I don't think the original trilogy is all that much better compared to the new ones(not that they aren't better). There are a lot of good things but a lot of truly dreadful stuff as well with a good mix of bad acting in parts.Are they great movies YES but the prequel never stood a chance with the huge expectations on them and I think if you could show someone the OT after removing the exact memory of what happened in them from their mind and told them they were a prequel they would have said they weren't as good as the original.people need to remember as well that for the Jedi and their allies it was a dark age, many of them would have abandoned everything that it was to be a Jedi just to survive. Technology takes a step back in dark ages generally as well and I think they are well within their rights to do what they did.Take JJ Abrahams star trek reboot, what was star trek doing before he came along....... Star Trek Online........... awkward silenceWhat is ACTUALLY wrong with the prequels? Mostly your fragile misconceptions of what Star Wars is or isn't people get far to dogmatic with these kinds of things and I believe the star wars story was very much all in Lucas' head in the main and it was his story to change and determine I mean the first movie was called Episode IV.......

Star trek online came out after the jar jar trek movie, the quests trying to explain away the nonsensical explosion that destroyed the romulon home world were part of the levelling process not added later.

As a result you clearly don't no what your on about and I declare your arguments invalid.

You improved my point Star Trek IP was doing NOTHING before JJ Abraham saved it.

keep applying the cream

We're also all massively overlooking the ludicrous 'immaculate conception' that midichlorians can produce.

scmi skywalker (sp?) claims annakin had no father... hes a virgin birth... essentially that makes Luke and Leia quite non human too but leia has nothing like Lukes power.

Anakin is the product of sith alchemy by Darth Plagueis, more or less. Trying to create the perfect force user. Then the force was like, "Whoooooooooooooooa son", and Anakin didn't go as planned.

Yeah it's f*cking stupid.

This is going to break the internet but, I don't think the original trilogy is all that much better compared to the new ones(not that they aren't better). There are a lot of good things but a lot of truly dreadful stuff as well with a good mix of bad acting in parts.

Are they great movies YES but the prequel never stood a chance with the huge expectations on them and I think if you could show someone the OT after removing the exact memory of what happened in them from their mind and told them they were a prequel they would have said they weren't as good as the original.

You must be trolling right?

You seriously believe that any ADULT watching The Empire Strikes Back for the first time would not rate it higher than any of the PT films.... you must be trolling, or to young to understand what good story telling is about.

Here is a fun fact for you: George Lucas did NOT direct or write Empire, nor did he direct Jedi but he did write it hence the silly Ewoks.

What is ACTUALLY wrong with the prequels? Mostly your fragile misconceptions of what Star Wars is or isn't people get far to dogmatic with these kinds of things and I believe the star wars story was very much all in Lucas' head in the main and it was his story to change and determine I mean the first movie was called Episode IV.......

The list of "What is ACTUALLY wrong with the prequels?" is huge, I don't want to be here all night writing out that list!

AND NO the first film was NOT called Episode IV, you really are showing your age (or your trolling) with that comment, the first film was called STAR WARS

That's it, there was no number attached to it, that was added later and then was called Star Wars CHAPTER IV: A new hope.

Take JJ Abrahams star trek reboot, what was star trek doing before he came along....... Star Trek Online........... awkward silence

Star Trek, I will admit sadly, killed itself. And mostly killed TV Sci-Fi.

When the Creator of Trek (Gene Roddenberry) died the studio put Rick Berman in charge who was pretty much an accountant, someone with no creativeness.

At a time when reality TV was becoming big due to being VERY cheap to make (not having to pay actors/writers) you need someone to take some risks, Berman did not and just made the same thing over and over, it got boring and died taking most TV Sci-fi with it.

Star Trek IP was doing NOTHING before JJ Abraham saved it.

keep applying the cream

JJ did not save Trek,

JJ-Trek is NOT Star Trek.

At best it is a parallel universe.

What JJ did do with his Sci-Fi film is bring Sci-Fi back to the mainstream market. So that is a good thing, just a shame he had to insult us Trekkies to do it.

I truly hate the prequels. I think they are incompetent on just a pure film making level. The shoddy incoherent script, the lazy unimaginative directing, and the flat and uninteresting characters are all technical reasons why I hate them. I feel I have objective reasons why they are just bad films. But people will like what they like, and no amount of arguing will change that, so I feel debating the subject, while fun, easily turns into a mud slinging contest.

If someone finds enjoyment from something, why do people who don't like the prequels take offense to that and feel they need to put them down for it? On the flip side people who like the prequels shouldn't put down those who have objective reasons for doing so.

This pretty much sums it up.

If you enjoy the PT then good for you, but I will be damned if I'm going to accept the PT as apart of the saga!

To me it's just a side show freak created to sell toys.

Though I do like toys......

I loved the prequels!

They seemed awfully short, and it was odd that they were on the Auralnauts' Youtube channel, instead of disney or lucasfilm, but they were so funny!

Midichlorians spoiler

They're heroin

If only the PT was as enjoyable as that...

SAUSAGE hahaha

I said ALMOST please read my post

just a couple of low points in IV - VI

Luke Whinewalker moaning through all three movies........

Crappy effects......

your dig at me for the story line is hilarious because none of the movies have a remotely interesting story it's a very basic and predictable story. (that's not what Star Wars was ever about)

The characters are as interesting in I-III as they are in IV-VI

You have simultaneously forgotten everything that is crap about IV - VI because you watched it while you were a kid rather than truly rating it against the new ones.

you love them because they are classics rather than because they are independently good and star wars was always good because it fired up the imagination you prove my point in your own.

It's like comparing Baldur's gate to Skyrim for me I still love Baldurs Gate more than Skyrim, there are many things much better in BG than Skyrim but there are many other thinks Skyrim just lassie slaps down out of existence. Do I love it more NO BG will always be my best game ever but I can admit that games like Skyrim have a hell of a lot to offer in their own right and are just as good if not better.

your dig at me for the story line is hilarious because none of the movies have a remotely interesting story it's a very basic and predictable story. (that's not what Star Wars was ever about)

The characters are as interesting in I-III as they are in IV-VI

i'll give you the plot in the OT is more simple and very 'good versus evil'... david vs goliath

but *really* you think the prequels had good characters.... which ones? which ones that were not set up by the OT anyway.

Jango is a carbon copy of boba fett (23 lines in the OT but third most popular character for years) and yeah i know hes a copy for a reason....

Kenobi is interesting

Yoda is still yoda

No one else i gave a rats posteriror about.

Anakin in whiny, amidala is just 'leia light', the various 'darths' dont last long enough for you to actually buy into them, maul looked cool then had the staying power of a candle in hurricane. Bail could have been interesting but wasnt.

3p0 and R2 are pretty much the same as they were in the OT.

I'm struggling to find a character i cared about having just watched EP1 and EP2 again over the last weekend or so.

I thought it was interesting that Mr. Lucas made a comment that he had not seen the trailer, after all he could have just as easily not made a comment.

Pretty sure that article says he was straight up asked.

just a couple of low points in IV - VI

Luke Whinewalker moaning through all three movies........

Crappy effects......

your dig at me for the story line is hilarious because none of the movies have a remotely interesting story it's a very basic and predictable story. (that's not what Star Wars was ever about)

The characters are as interesting in I-III as they are in IV-VI

You have simultaneously forgotten everything that is crap about IV - VI because you watched it while you were a kid rather than truly rating it against the new ones.

you love them because they are classics rather than because they are independently good and star wars was always good because it fired up the imagination you prove my point in your own.

Crappy effects?! The effects in the original trilogy were groundbreaking in ways that any sci-fi director would give their right hand to match today. Of course 20 years+ is going to mean that everything is a lot better-looking by the time you make it to the prequels, but Episode IV was an effects tour de force for sci fi. It is head and shoulders above any of its contemporaries - could you make the same claim about any prequel?

Predictable story?

That was a huge twist and has been ranked among the most unexpected twists in cinema. Point me to the unexpected plot twists in the prequel.

There are plenty of silly things with the original trilogy, including a certain race of furry, short bipeds, and a certain battle station that shows up and gets destroyed in two films in pretty much the same way. Maybe we still like them because they're classics. But the reason they're sci-fi classics is because they were good in the first place, when they hit theaters.

yeah the effects made with models in the OT blow away all the prequel CGI stuff to me... it just looks more real.

because it was more real....

yeah the effects made with models in the OT blow away all the prequel CGI stuff to me... it just looks more real.

because it was more real....

This, this, absolutely this, 100000x times this.

The special effects in the original Star Wars film (released 1977, budget $11 million) ABSOLUTELY BLEW AWAY the special effects in The Phantom Menace (released 1999, budget $115 million).

And WHY did they blow them away? Because overuse of CGI is totally and utterly immersion-breaking and false when compared to live action effects, actual physical models, make up, backgrounds and costumes.

The CGI effects in The Phantom Menace may well have been groundbreaking in their own right, but the overuse of and reliance on them (amongst other ill-conceived ideas) made The Phantom Menace and it's sequels little more than a parody of the Original Trilogy.

And Lucas' constant tinkering has tarnished that as well.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again - I would like nothing more than to see Disney release the Original Theatrical Cut of the Star Wars Trilogy. Forget the "enhancements", I just want to see the films as they originally were, before Lucas decided it would be a good idea to improve on cinematic perfection.

I'd like an orginal cinematic version DVD release. with an add on DVD of all the out cuts... even if its hours

I cant agree with you more Gecko

I'd like an orginal cinematic version DVD release. with an add on DVD of all the out cuts... even if its hours

I cant agree with you more Gecko

I think alot of us would, the special edition just looks terrible now in high def and that's a newer film that Jurassic park which still looks great.

And i get so sad at the end of RotJ when the jub nub song is replaced by gungan and darth vader light.

We're also all massively overlooking the ludicrous 'immaculate conception' that midichlorians can produce.

scmi skywalker (sp?) claims annakin had no father... hes a virgin birth... essentially that makes Luke and Leia quite non human too but leia has nothing like Lukes power.

Leia doesn't have Luke's power because she didn't develop it until a lot later. Luke was a little "late" to be developing his Force powers, and Leia didn't develop them until years after Episode 6 (mainly because she was either helping Mon Mothma as a diplomat, afterwards, was the Chief of State)

I also got annoyed when they replaced 'ghost annikin' with 'ghost young anikin'

If they do that they should have made kenobi ewan mcgregors version and yoda should be in his prime!

Just mucking with things for no sense.

it was fine as it was

We're also all massively overlooking the ludicrous 'immaculate conception' that midichlorians can produce.

scmi skywalker (sp?) claims annakin had no father... hes a virgin birth... essentially that makes Luke and Leia quite non human too but leia has nothing like Lukes power.

Leia doesn't have Luke's power because she didn't develop it until a lot later. Luke was a little "late" to be developing his Force powers, and Leia didn't develop them until years after Episode 6 (mainly because she was either helping Mon Mothma as a diplomat, afterwards, was the Chief of State)

Doesnt wash with me.

Leia has like *zero* natural force power in comparison (other than sensing luke at bespin) but luke has had 'seeing things before the happen' reactons since he was a kid racing his t16

Its just sloppy retconning, we have to accept Lucas made it all up on the fly so stuff doesnt make sense.

if luke is the product of a midiclorian 'virgin birth' 2nd gen and has high levels of force skill naturally without training, leia should have it to.

give she is resitant to mind probes and hits more stormtroopers in ANH than luke and han put together but i think thats coincidental, in fact i KNOW it is because at that point Lucas had not deicded they were related OR vader/annikins offspriing.

if luke is the product of a midiclorian 'virgin birth' 2nd gen and has high levels of force skill naturally without training, leia should have it to.

Not necessarily; it really depends on how force sensitivity is inherited. They're fraternal twins, so their genomes are going to be different, so no guarantees of equal powers there. Unless Anakin is homozygous force-sensitive and got nothing from his mom...

Assuming force powers come from midichlorians, which I assume are space-microbes, then Leia and Luke could have inherited different amounts from their parents, leading to different levels. Something similar happens in mitochondrial inheritance.

In conclusion, I feel dirty now.

The characters are about as black and white as the OT was my point.

The graphics by TODAY'S standards are poor is my point with that

I don't hate them I am just saying they aren't perfect and nor are the Prequel.

I'd like an orginal cinematic version DVD release. with an add on DVD of all the out cuts... even if its hours

I cant agree with you more Gecko

This already exists. They released a DVD set of the OT a while back that had a DVD of the Special Edition paired with a DVD of the Theatrical version for all 3 films. I own it, and watch the theatrical versions almost exclusively. If I can find a link I'll share. I'd bet it is hard to find now.

EDIT: This is the one I have. Only on eBay these days and pretty pricey. But worth it.

I'd like an orginal cinematic version DVD release. with an add on DVD of all the out cuts... even if its hours

I cant agree with you more Gecko

I think alot of us would, the special edition just looks terrible now in high def and that's a newer film that Jurassic park which still looks great.

And i get so sad at the end of RotJ when the jub nub song is replaced by gungan and darth vader light.

I got the origionals on dvd, but no cut outs. But you can find a few on youtube.

I said ALMOST please read my postjust a couple of low points in IV - VILuke Whinewalker moaning through all three movies........Crappy effects......your dig at me for the story line is hilarious because none of the movies have a remotely interesting story it's a very basic and predictable story. (that's not what Star Wars was ever about)The characters are as interesting in I-III as they are in IV-VIYou have simultaneously forgotten everything that is crap about IV - VI because you watched it while you were a kid rather than truly rating it against the new ones.you love them because they are classics rather than because they are independently good and star wars was always good because it fired up the imagination you prove my point in your own.It's like comparing Baldur's gate to Skyrim for me I still love Baldurs Gate more than Skyrim, there are many things much better in BG than Skyrim but there are many other thinks Skyrim just lassie slaps down out of existence. Do I love it more NO BG will always be my best game ever but I can admit that games like Skyrim have a hell of a lot to offer in their own right and are just as good if not better.

You have me convinced that your just trolling.

Your seriously trying to compare the mostly fluid and natural character interactions of Luke, leia, Han, Chewi, 3PO and R2 with who from the PT??

Liam Neison is a great actor but is character is so flat and hardly does anything. A very badly missed opportunity.

Same can be said for Ewan Mcgregor, not until the third film does he get to actually act.

As far as effects go models trump CGI.

Just look at Alien/Aliens, Event Horizon, Return of the jedi, 80's Trek, just look at when the enterprise D crashes on the planet in generations, so much cooler and real looking than CGI

Can you people ever have a civil discussion involving Neroverse Trek or the prequels without hating everything you possibly could?

Can we just have some civil damned discussion about it? Christ almighty, folks.

Civil discussion involving the prequels...

Yeah no. Not likely to happen.

It's like bringing up Beast Wars on a G1 Transformers forum. Sparks are gonna fly!