"Also, wtf is with you guys saying Calming the Mind protects you from Spinta? It protects you...FOR THAT TURN. Calming the Mind adds any cards that would be added to the momentum during the combat phase to the end phase instead. Point? Foundations are still removed, just later on, is all."

BZZT WRONG AGAIN

CtM prevents your opponent from successfully paying the cost of Spinta's Enhance, which prevents it from resolving, meaning the Spinta player gets to pick nothing .

but you wouldn't know that because you have no clue about anything related to this game, it seems

edit: and uh, how is it more likely the order player will have multiple Chinese Boxing and Program Malfunction down - both of which are 3 difficulty - versus the Evil deck having multiple Red Lotus and Oral Dead down - both of which are 2 difficulty?

Hey, when you're right you're right.

It's too bad Calming the Mind has **** for symbols, huh? =/

MarcoPulleaux said:

If it has **** for symbols, and you're all bawwing and QQing all over the forum about how broken Order is, why is it so awful that those symbols have all the answers to the broken? I mean, seriously, do you think for more than 30 seconds before any of your posts? Not singling you out, Shinji, though it applies to you, too.

I mean, it really is true. People have stopped ******* trying to win games and prefer crying their pitiful little eyes out on the forum instead. Baww why can't I win without trying

Well, B-Rad's point is that Ira-Spinta is only slightly hindered from losing Makai. Your point, on the other hand, is that you're just being a **** for the sake of being a ****.

Do YOU, sir, even read for 30 seconds before posting? Because if you did, you'd understand that what B-Rad was talking about (and which I pretty much took his side on) was that Order has a giant number of commit effects that outspeed Evil's singular Red Lotus, and perhaps Oral Deads (which, again, only stop Malfunction, not the rest of Order's major commit cards). As such, saying, "***** please, Red Lotus KILLS Spinta" is not just retarded, but it's inaccurate. I sincerely doubt a Spinta player would just throw out a Spinta with a ready Lotus, unless his intention is to trigger it for something more strategic. Obviously a Spinta player (likely using Order, but might be using fire's Manifest Destiny or Air's Perfect Sense of Balance) will wait til any Lotuses or Seals are out of the way before bulldozing the staging area.

That's the whole point dude. Nobody asked for you to give us a list of cards, and just as every other idiot who does the same thing, your whole point is mentioning to us THAT the cards exist (as if we didn't know?). Your point SHOULD be trying to persuade us that the cards are any good.

The problem that you people fail to understand is that you can't use your words to persuade us. No, you're going to need tournament-worthy proof. By saying inadvertantly that Charismatic shares symbols with Oral Dead and Balance, and Balance shares symbols with Torn Hero, and Hero shares symbols with Lotus, all you're doing is pointing out the obvious, ignoring the fact that solo-Dead and solo-Life have not done well at any regionals I can remember (and let's keep in mind, I'm the same guy who compiled a list of all regionals since Set 12, so let's not say I don't do my research pal, k? k), and Good has only done well when fronted by J. Talbain, or Goo's illustrious Kyo Mill (and as Good has been, and always will be my favorite symbol, I can tell you that, yes, it is a tourney-viable symbol, but it currently lacks some key tools, namely, a badass character).

What you're also failing to grasp is that we are losers? I can't speak for B-Rad, but I've always been top dog of my SA playgroup, and for a half-ass hackjob of Seong Mi-Na, I did pretty alright for my first regionals. I'm not a guy who can't win, nor am I a guy who doesn't think about the opposition. I'm a concerned player with REALISTIC views of the game.

Also, dude, try reading the threads before you go and voice your extremely loud voice? Let's stick to the whole Ira-Spinta Order > Evil discussion, and keep your personal agenda out.

...whatever, lol. Think what you want, I've had enough of this ****. This community has flat out gone to hell as far as I'm concerned.

Tagrineth said:

If that's the case then set a precedent by acting civil as the rest of have done and refrain from insulting everyone. We are having a discussion arguing points and counter points and you enter in with profanity and laughing at how stupid you think everyone is. From there you begin to single out people and start the insults. Granted a few of us have gotten heated over the issue (myself included) but passion shouldn't override decency. If there's anyone who has proven the 'community has flat out gone to hell' it seems to be you.

Now I respect your opinion in the matter and I may disagree with your points but I do so respectfully and I hope that you do the same.

MarcoPulleaux said:

Most people ran only one copy of Charismatic because it was unique so Olcadan could effectively destroy any other foundation without replacing it if there was a charismatic in the staging area and another in the discard. With Olcadan gone, this is not an issue, and actually without Olcadan charismatic is an alternative way to remove certain foundations from the opponent's staging area (even with the action side). Evil can use it instead of chester to control some foundations, and actually chester's was one of the ways to negate charismatic with just a commit.

So most likely Charismatic wil see more play, but maybe only 2-3 copies as it is still unique, but since it destroys itself after used it's not that big of a deal.

About Ira Spinta vs Calming the Mind, it is clear it doesn't allow the ira spinta player to pay the cost so the effect doesn't resolve, but what does exactly happen at the end of the turn? Nothing, or does the opponent do as the cost says? Sorry I can't search the rules forum.

--------

I'm quite happy with the bannings, it seems to make the game more playable, although there still are certain cards that are very annoying around. At least with Olcadan's gone we automatically have 4-12 slots open in all our decks to replace olcadan itself and whatever was used to deal with them, we don't lose 10 minutes a game to search the discard pile, are not punished for running certain foundations, etc.

^- about ira spinta vs calming the mind.

I believe (and someone can correct me if I'm wrong) that if someone is silly enough to play Ira-Spinta's E while Calming the Mind is active, at the end of the turn, I choose a card in their staging area and add it to their momentum.

Tagrineth said:

" AHH OHHH AHHH MY NIPPLES THEY.... THEY HURT WHEN I TWIST THEM! AHAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!"

Ya know Tag, ya shouldn't give up so easily. Yer arguments were... Compelling?

Anyways can we have a forum moderator (if we have any) at least give this guy a warning for outright insulting folks on the boards?

All you can really do is report his post to a moderator. Tag has become infamous these days for basically becoming an online Bill O'Reilly. As soon as somebody is incorrect, or he disagrees with somebody, it's basically his job to not only state why they're wrong/why he disagrees, but to throw in some personal insults and profanity, and to be loud and obnoxious all the while there.

I put my best effort to be civil to people, but seeing as how I've pretty much always been the most hated user of the forums, it doesn't always work in my favor =/

Just ignore it. He's pretty much done here, as are most of us.

It's clear most people approve of the bannings, and most people are mentioning that the absence of Olcadan's is giving life to some decks.

MarcoPulleaux said:

Saddly this is true

Not really sad. I think by now we've all read the state of the game now. No more reason to bump this thread.

The threads we SHOULD be seeing more of are deck building threads to accomodate the bans.

Tagrineth said:

Tagrineth said:

SO SERIOUS.

Man if ever there was a state of the game so derailed it is this one. Seriously you crackpots made me forget that this was a thread that was originally about the state of the game til i looked up and seen that I was replying to "June 2009 SOTG".

OP: I really really really hate chesters and owlface, so I am estatic that they are banned, especially since I won't be at nationals . Although I am definetly in the camp of "these bans make order stronger". However since I play order I really don't care, hell mabye I will be able to get past top 4 this year. Although set 13 might change that, besides order has an oposite in the good symbol.

As far as the only one set per release-good idea-although it really does need to be bumped up to 6 characters a release to make a diverse playfield.

tannerface said:

Maybe even the return of vanilla cards. I loved those when they weren't broken.

MarcoPulleaux said:

A reasonable compromise for the one set at a time senario would be giving the neglected franchises for that block a Battle Box. For example:

-Rotation hits in February (just using this as a reference point, not saying that it'll actually be in Feb.), the base set comes out with starter decks.

-The second set hits the streets months later, along side a Battle Box of a different franchise.

-The third set hits with no other releases.

-The fourth set hits and is paired up with another Battle Box of the remaining franchise that didn't see a release this year.

With Battle Boxes, it gives fans of any franchise something to work with, it shows the owners of the franchise that FFG is constantly doing something with said franchise, and it's another easy jumping-in point for new players (as getting any power cards printed in said Battle Box will only run US$40ish, not to mention the other cards and charaters printed for it).

I can understand why they skipped it this year, as I was having trouble keeping up with everything, but with how they're slimming down the yearly line-up, it'd be a good way to fill out some of the void.

tannerface said:

We are men of the sea.

MarcoPulleaux said:

Ha ha ha. Nice, because I haven't used profanity on this board till now.

But OK. Again, think what you will.

Just wanted to throw out some more ideas to combat order that I have used in the past that will be going in the maindeck. With the loss of Of owlface and and chesters I think these are great substitutes. Past shrouded in mystery can blow up china box, as well as an extra benefit of destroying bitter rivals, and defender among other things. Total Global Domination is great at taking out Program malfunction. If isnt in the staging area you can untap the tapped card normally. And finally memories that stain it's armor can destroy anything.

Tagrineth said:

'sides it's not what's against the TOS.

Nubian_God said:

Excellent suggestion.

Nubian_God said:

I think Steve said to us once that the last SF battle box didn't go over too well . But I hope there is another battle box int he future.