The inciter should have been talked to as well.

What kind of community are you promoting where the people who call out others for racism/sexism deserve to be punished? I doubt fgdsfg was banned for arguing. It seems likely it was due to either him being reported for racism/sexism or due to linking to an 8chan board associated with currently active harassment. CPS didn't engage in racism/sexism and fgdsfg did. It's as simple as that.

Why do people think cps should be banned/talked to by the moderators?

Well, too bad about Fgdsfg, it's a harsh call but understandable. I know it's more of a touchy subject over there in the US, I don't believe his actual intentions were bad or racist in nature.

He was doing the equivalent of a child holding his finger an inch from your face and shouting "I'm not touching you!" And he followed that up by getting indignant when people said his behavior wasn't acceptable.

The inciter should have been talked to as well.

What kind of community are you promoting where the people who call out others for racism/sexism deserve to be punished? I doubt fgdsfg was banned for arguing. It seems likely it was due to either him being reported for racism/sexism or due to linking to an 8chan board associated with currently active harassment. CPS didn't engage in racism/sexism and fgdsfg did. It's as simple as that.

Why do people think cps should be banned/talked to by the moderators?

Well, too bad about Fgdsfg, it's a harsh call but understandable. I know it's more of a touchy subject over there in the US, I don't believe his actual intentions were bad or racist in nature.

He was doing the equivalent of a child holding his finger an inch from your face and shouting "I'm not touching you!" And he followed that up by getting indignant when people said his behavior wasn't acceptable.

I guess while we're on the topic, I'll say I have been talked to by the moderators. I got a warning post from FFGEvan about 2 weeks ago. This is what he said:

Hello cps,

Numerous members have reported you for trolling the forums. Our forums exist to form a friendly and welcoming environment for all members. Please refrain from picking fights or making personal attacks.

Future punishment will be more severe.

Weirdly, this was the post I received the warning on. You'd think if they've had so many complaints they'd be able to cite something more specific/trolly (now there's an ugly word).

I responded to the email that was in, but now that I think about it that's probably a noreply address, so I just sent the same message to FFGEvan.

Also, this:

What kind of community are you promoting where the people who call out others for racism/sexism deserve to be punished?

What kind of community are you promoting where the people who call out others for racism/sexism deserve to be punished? I doubt fgdsfg was banned for arguing. It seems likely it was due to either him being reported for racism/sexism or due to linking to an 8chan board associated with currently active harassment. CPS didn't engage in racism/sexism and fgdsfg did. It's as simple as that.

Why do people think cps should be banned/talked to by the moderators?

Whoa you're jumping pretty far with accusations there. I never mentioned banned, because I don't think CPS should be banned. He brought up a comment, Fdfsg is the one who talked himself into a ban.

I'm not promoting people who call others out being punished, I'm proposing that whoever made the obviously leading comment in the first place have been talked to about it.

But before we go down a road with that one I'll say that's the final word I have on that particular matter.

Weirdly, this was the post I received the warning on. You'd think if they've had so many complaints they'd be able to cite something more specific/trolly (now there's an ugly word).

Maybe they just found the nearest thing? Or was it cited specifically. I have to agree on that being benign.

Well, too bad about Fgdsfg, it's a harsh call but understandable. I know it's more of a touchy subject over there in the US, I don't believe his actual intentions were bad or racist in nature.

He was doing the equivalent of a child holding his finger an inch from your face and shouting "I'm not touching you!" And he followed that up by getting indignant when people said his behavior wasn't acceptable.

I just meant that what he said could have been in jest, there doesn't necessary have to be any actual racial hatred behind it. It's easy to blow things out of proportion here with a subject like this. Even mentioning a specific racial color is technically differentiating between races and therefor racism.

What's much more likely to be really happening here is the art of getting rid of a person who you personally dislike and the rest was just the means to achieve it. Cps led it on, and Fgdsfg didn't know any better. A misplaced joke. That's it.

Drop the holier-than-thou act already, both of you.

I'm with Gridash on this! Reading down the aforementioned thread It seems pretty obvious why the warning was issued. fdgsfg's comment taken out of context could be considered racist. Especially by someone predisposed to do so! However, if one were to bother reading through the conversation they would realise that he was in fact speaking out against racial stereotypes that have been seen in the Star wars movies. Further, they would recognise that he (fdgsfg) was baited further into that conversation.

I feel it important to mention that IMO CPS has toned down some his more vitriolic comments lately (Credit where it's due!). For which I am immensely thankful. That does not excuse an organized campaign to get a poster banned simply because of personal dislike. I do know that having witnessed said campaign, I will no longer simply ignore personal attacks when I see them. I will ALWAYS call them out for what they are and I will ALWAYS report them!

Those that enjoy that sort of thing should consider themselves notified.

I feel that fdgsfg was unfairly banned. If one party in this feud was warned then that's what the other deserved!

What kind of community are you promoting where the people who call out others for racism/sexism deserve to be punished? I doubt fgdsfg was banned for arguing. It seems likely it was due to either him being reported for racism/sexism or due to linking to an 8chan board associated with currently active harassment. CPS didn't engage in racism/sexism and fgdsfg did. It's as simple as that.

Why do people think cps should be banned/talked to by the moderators?

Whoa you're jumping pretty far with accusations there. I never mentioned banned, because I don't think CPS should be banned. He brought up a comment, Fdfsg is the one who talked himself into a ban.

I'm not promoting people who call others out being punished, I'm proposing that whoever made the obviously leading comment in the first place have been talked to about it.

But before we go down a road with that one I'll say that's the final word I have on that particular matter.

I used your quote for context, but I was attempting to generally address comments which had included the insinuation that cps be banned/punished as well. Generally the only times that cps has started angry an argument with fgdfsg have been when he's seen fgdfsg saying heinous ****. I assume you're referring to cps asking him what he thought of the black storm trooper, which I'll admit was him basically saying "hey, here's a great chance to stick your foot in your mouth!" Fgdfsg is a grown adult, though, and it was his choice to say something racist rather than taking the bait. I think it's important to consider whether this is a discussion about arguing, or about saying racist and sexist things. If it's about civility, then yeah, cps is an ******* (and I often am one too). But that doesn't seem to be what was the issue here. Being acerbic on a message board is a bit different than spreading racism and sexism.

Well, too bad about Fgdsfg, it's a harsh call but understandable. I know it's more of a touchy subject over there in the US, I don't believe his actual intentions were bad or racist in nature.

He was doing the equivalent of a child holding his finger an inch from your face and shouting "I'm not touching you!" And he followed that up by getting indignant when people said his behavior wasn't acceptable.

I just meant that what he said could have been in jest, there doesn't necessary have to be any actual racial hatred behind it. It's easy to blow things out of proportion here with a subject like this. Even mentioning a specific racial color is technically differentiating between races and therefor racism.

What's much more likely to be really happening here is the art of getting rid of a person who you personally dislike and the rest was just the means to achieve it. Cps led it on, and Fgdsfg didn't know any better. A misplaced joke. That's it.

Drop the holier-than-thou act already, both of you.

You're not from the US, as you've said, so maybe you don't realize that making a joke like fgdfsg did is very offensive in the US. That's not the kind of joke that an informed person makes without the knowledge that it's racist and inappropriate. Also, sorry, but racism does not include noticing that there are differences between white and black people. I really don't want to offend you, but that statement makes me think that you are woefully ignorant of racial matters in the US or any of the actual research or literature on racism. Take a look at this guy's website and read a bit about things; he's a decent starting point for introducing uninformed people to race issues in the US. http://www.timwise.org/f-a-q-s/

Also, joke or not, when told that what he said was inappropriate, fgdfsg just doubled down on it and started accusing other people of being racist. That's either an astounding level of ignorance (something that I have enough respect for the guy to know he doesn't have) or intentional trolling. And it doesn't matter if he was intending racial hatred behind his joke, because the joke is still inappropriate. As it stands, cultural context outweighs individual context, particularly given the fact that he was making said joke with an awareness of the culture. If he knows enough to write out minstrel dialogue, he knows enough to know that it's inappropriate.

I'm with Gridash on this! Reading down the aforementioned thread It seems pretty obvious why the warning was issued. fdgsfg's comment taken out of context could be considered racist. Especially by someone predisposed to do so! However, if one were to bother reading through the conversation they would realise that he was in fact speaking out against racial stereotypes that have been seen in the Star wars movies. Further, they would recognise that he (fdgsfg) was baited further into that conversation.

I feel it important to mention that IMO CPS has toned down some his more vitriolic comments lately (Credit where it's due!). For which I am immensely thankful. That does not excuse an organized campaign to get a poster banned simply because of personal dislike. I do know that having witnessed said campaign, I will no longer simply ignore personal attacks when I see them. I will ALWAYS call them out for what they are and I will ALWAYS report them!

Those that enjoy that sort of thing should consider themselves notified.

I feel that fdgsfg was unfairly banned. If one party in this feud was warned then that's what the other deserved!

The only baiting going on in the thread was cps starting the conversation with what was obviously a rhetorical question. Fgdfsg decided to push the envelope by giving a troll response. He was told that he shouldn't say blatantly racist things, and rather than apologizing, he just doubled down and started lying about his intentions. I'll say it; fgdfsg is smart enough to know better than to make a joke like that if he was actually railing against negative stereotypes. People generally don't talk about how much they dislike a negative stereotype by writing it out and following it with a smiley face. He was either lying about his intentions or had deluded himself after the fact.

That's also not an organized campaign against him. I doubt cps was trying to fool him into getting banned. More likely, he just wanted to make a snide remark about fgdfsg being racist which was then met with...fgdfsg being racist. I know a lot of people on this forum aren't Americans, but the way the guy responded was grossly inappropriate.

So yeah, it's a shame that a contributing member of the community got banned, but it's his own fault. It's his responsibility for what he said. If I get banned for being acerbic, it's my fault for doing so. Don't be mad at cps for this; be mad at fsgfdg for causing it.

"Organised campaign"..?

Let's be real here - both Fdgsfg and cps have been going at it for ages. Like I said earlier, they were like water and oil. You could have a perfectly normal talk with them individually, though both have a capacity to inspire rage in other readers depending on your own preferences and opinions. I'm quite certain I am the same to some posters.

Things only started to get real messy when you had both of them in the same thread, though, as then things would often turn into a mud-slinging war. This has been going on for over a year or so, and frankly, I've actually become used to it by now.

In this particular case, Fdgsfg just wasn't clever enough to stop when he had the chance, or at least avoid to make remarks that are this ... controversial. I mean, come on - mentioning the Stormtrooper Corps opening up for "all kinds of lesser species", as a reply on how he feels about black troopers? That's just ... well, "foot in mouth" is an accurate description, I suppose. Yes, I'm quite sure this is not what he indended to convey as a message, but that doesn't make the message itself any better, and it makes you still question the speaker's beliefs if they do not recognise how this must come across.

I still feel a permanent ban out of the blue is silly, though. Perhaps if they would spend more time moderating, FFG could have diffused both posters' behaviour long ago by handing out penalty points and perhaps temporary bans. Just showing up once a year and kicking people out entirely isn't what I'd call "moderating".

It won't be up for discussion, of course, but that's my feelings on the subject.

More likely, he just wanted to make a snide remark about fgdfsg being racist which was then met with...fgdfsg being racist. I know a lot of people on this forum aren't Americans, but the way the guy responded was grossly inappropriate.

Americans are grossly retardat when it comes to political correctness, sexism and 'racism'. Sorry Nimsim, but look up the Fergusan Shooting. That's blatant racism. Fgdfsg is far from an exemplar of racism for having spoken vividly against movie cliches after responding to CPS' obviously snide comment that snowballed that conversation.

And sorry, any one who gives credit to Gamergate as a legimate social issue is just absolutely pathetic. If your an american, here's a pro-tip: Go enlist, go to the middle east, develop a sense of what's is worth being passionate about, and then remember that all the social issues worth fighting for or against are on the governmental level, not some minor game genre crap.

To FFG: Please remove the ban from Fgdfsg. Blatantly poor moderation and a poor show of investment in the forum community. Take some responsibility and address issues long before they become some piss-poor example of what passes for important issues around here.

More likely, he just wanted to make a snide remark about fgdfsg being racist which was then met with...fgdfsg being racist. I know a lot of people on this forum aren't Americans, but the way the guy responded was grossly inappropriate.

Americans are grossly retardat when it comes to political correctness, sexism and 'racism'. Sorry Nimsim, but look up the Fergusan Shooting. That's blatant racism. Fgdfsg is far from an exemplar of racism for having spoken vividly against movie cliches after responding to CPS' obviously snide comment that snowballed that conversation.

And sorry, any one who gives credit to Gamergate as a legimate social issue is just absolutely pathetic. If your an american, here's a pro-tip: Go enlist, go to the middle east, develop a sense of what's is worth being passionate about, and then remember that all the social issues worth fighting for or against are on the governmental level, not some minor game genre crap.

To FFG: Please remove the ban from Fgdfsg. Blatantly poor moderation and a poor show of investment in the forum community. Take some responsibility and address issues long before they become some piss-poor example of what passes for important issues around here.

Please don't use the word retarded as an insult. This goes double if you can't even spell it correctly.

Also, are you European? Because I know some other Europeans who had these great ideas about how only people who enlist in the army deserve to have a voice in things...

No Nimsim, I am an American veteran of the 101st Airborne, who spent entering his adulthood years overseas in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Kuwait. I'm a soldier whose actually been shot protecting American freedom. I really could give a **** about grammer.

Edit: And no, I'm not angry or anything towards you Nimsim. I am just really, passionately in disagreeance with FFG's decision to ban someone I hold in high esteem. Especially with the follow up flow that is just saturated with stupidity.

Given certain worrying trends within the military, it is rather ironic to ignore the obvious link to certain sociocultural issues in media which, for better or worse, play a role in shaping people's perception, just as much as they are a mirror of contemporary society.

And without wanting to disrespect the service of those who fought honourably - some of whom I've made friends with - I wouldn't necessarily rubberstamp every military operation as being primarily in the interests of "American freedom". Not when the cause had been muddled by attempted misdirection, or when the result has been stained by economical exploitation, inefficient governance or flat out incompetence by the civilian administration, and cover-ups of war crimes conducted by occupation forces and/or their allies. Being a soldier doesn't mean you have to surrender your conscience, after all. Indeed, one could say that this would be unpatriotic, as it means closing your eyes to others besmirching the ideal.

No Nimsim, I am an American veteran of the 101st Airborne, who spent entering his adulthood years overseas in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Kuwait. I'm a soldier whose actually been shot protecting American freedom. I really could give a **** about grammer.

Edit: And no, I'm not angry or anything towards you Nimsim. I am just really, passionately in disagreeance with FFG's decision to ban someone I hold in high esteem. Especially with the follow up flow that is just saturated with stupidity.

Well, I appreciate that you've been through rough ****, but that doesn't really give you a pass on deciding what social issues matter or not for everyone else. Like, I'm sure that some of these things seem silly compared to life threatening experiences you've been through. However, most people's lives consist entirely or mostly of the mundane and silly things. It's for that reason that focusing on them is important, because they end up having a big impact due to frequency. Think of this not as "oh my god fdgfsf said one thing and it's as bad as a hate crime," but rather "fdgfsg is throwing one more straw that might break the camels back."

Given certain worrying trends within the military, it is rather ironic to ignore the obvious link to certain sociocultural issues in media which, for better or worse, play a role in shaping people's perception, just as much as they are a mirror of contemporary society.

And without wanting to disrespect the service of those who fought honourably - some of whom I've made friends with - I wouldn't necessarily rubberstamp every military operation as being primarily in the interests of "American freedom". Not when the cause had been muddled by attempted misdirection, or when the result has been stained by economical exploitation, inefficient governance or flat out incompetence by the civilian administration, and cover-ups of war crimes conducted by occupation forces and/or their allies. Being a soldier doesn't mean you have to surrender your conscience, after all. Indeed, one could say that this would be unpatriotic, as it means closing your eyes to others besmirching the ideal.

Even I think you may be stirring the **** a bit too much with this one.

Please don't use the word retarded as an insult. This goes double if you can't even spell it correctly.

Also, are you European? Because I know some other Europeans who had these great ideas about how only people who enlist in the army deserve to have a voice in things...

Could you please explain why making belittling generalization based on skin color, gender, and mental development is bad but it's perfectly ok to make belittling generalizations based on continent of birth?

Please don't use the word retarded as an insult. This goes double if you can't even spell it correctly.

Also, are you European? Because I know some other Europeans who had these great ideas about how only people who enlist in the army deserve to have a voice in things...

Could you please explain why making belittling generalization based on skin color, gender, and mental development is bad but it's perfectly ok to make belittling generalizations based on continent of birth?

Because there isn't a systematic discrimination of Europeans that negatively impacts the lives of millions. Same reason I didn't ask him to not poke fun of Americans, because it's a fair enough (though easy) target for criticism. I'm happy to be corrected on this, though.

Ok we seriously need to chill out guys. This has gotten impressively off track. It's no longer about the main topic nor even the side topic of just what happened to Fdfsg and why we feel we should know what really happened. There's no need to devolve into this. Not that this isn't important in it's own respect, but that it does not belong on the main forum, take it to messages.

Because there isn't a systematic discrimination of Europeans that negatively impacts the lives of millions. Same reason I didn't ask him to not poke fun of Americans, because it's a fair enough (though easy) target for criticism. I'm happy to be corrected on this, though.

Ah, yes. The good old "punching up / punching down" excuse. Don't know why, but I was hoping for more.

Because there isn't a systematic discrimination of Europeans that negatively impacts the lives of millions. Same reason I didn't ask him to not poke fun of Americans, because it's a fair enough (though easy) target for criticism. I'm happy to be corrected on this, though.

Ah, yes. The good old "punching up / punching down" excuse. Don't know why, but I was hoping for more.

Well, I was hoping people could understand things like "context," but here we are.

Ok we seriously need to chill out guys. This has gotten impressively off track. It's no longer about the main topic nor even the side topic of just what happened to Fdfsg and why we feel we should know what really happened. There's no need to devolve into this. Not that this isn't important in it's own respect, but that it does not belong on the main forum, take it to messages.

http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/130741-the-off-topic-garbage-thread/

Don't say I never did anything for you, ThenDoctor

Ok we seriously need to chill out guys. This has gotten impressively off track. It's no longer about the main topic nor even the side topic of just what happened to Fdfsg and why we feel we should know what really happened. There's no need to devolve into this. Not that this isn't important in it's own respect, but that it does not belong on the main forum, take it to messages.

Yeah this thread bottomed out so fast I find myself agreeing with thendoctor. This is why we can't have nice things.

Sooooooooo, how about that new supplement in the works?

Don't say I never did anything for you, ThenDoctor

I won't because you didn't. You literally made the problem worse. Messages aren't the same thing as threads Nim and you know it.

Sooooooooo, how about that new supplement in the works?

Still excited. I hope the next article is about how the Soritas will work.

Don't say I never did anything for you, ThenDoctor

I won't because you didn't. You literally made the problem worse. Messages aren't the same thing as threads Nim and you know it.

Please take your off-topic conversations to this thread: http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/130741-the-off-topic-garbage-thread/

Sooooooooo, how about that new supplement in the works?

Still excited. I hope the next article is about how the Soritas will work.

Yeah should be pretty cool. I am also interested to see what they bring to the table regarding the penitent mutants, considering I have always been of a radical (or should that be heretical?) bent.

Especially if you reach a high influence, it would be interesting to see how normal imperial citizens deal with having a mutant having the power to decide whether or not they are heretics and should die as such, there's a bit of irony right there. Having a mutant get all the way to inquisitor would be fun too, though probably a little bit unrealistic unless he's backed by a very, very radical inquisitor.

Even a very very Radical Inquisitor couldn't name a mutant Inquisitor, because his own power depends on the perception of his allies and peers. Unless there is so much "radicalism" in a local inquisitorial group that this could get on.

I'm curious to see what they'll do with faith power.