Fluff questions

By felismachina, in Only War

So i was wondering about few things today, i need to make sure that i get things right and after reading lots of fluff related stuff in web i decided that maybe someone here can answer a few questions.

1.What happens to veterans when most of regiment is wiped out? In codex it's stated that sometimes two wrecked regiments are combined but what if only one or two squad remains from few regiments? Will they be combined into some kind of veteran regiment?

2. Does Kasrkin recruit soldiers only from Cadia or sometimes from other planets? Do they act like commando unit or are frontline grenadiers like in HoTE. They are lately absent from fluff sadly.

3. Can a normal soldier became stormtrooper or is it exclusively for schola progenium orphans?

4. If two regiments are mixed together from different homeworlds do they have unified equipment or they use same stuff from their home unit?

5. Are there other elite units like karskin in regiments of catachan, tallarn etc?

6. Does normal units beside stormtroopers and high ranking officers wear carapace armor?

7. Does M36 Lasgun have a full auto mode? I know that rules state they can fire semi auto only but from what i read looks like they can go full auto.

8. Does Cadian Tri-dome helmet are issued only to kasrkin?

9. While looking at IG Codex weapon list i don't see autogun. So does IG ever use autoguns?

10. What is imperial policy regarding equipment? In some sources it's said that troopers (mostly veterans) use weapons taken from enemy and other non standard stuff while other sources say that nobody will allow guardsman to keep equipment outside regulations.

Kasrkin are exclusively from Cadia and are primarily frontline grenadiers and shock troops.

Stormtroopers are exclusively Schola Progenium "products". Veteran Guardsmen may be designated as Grenadiers, which are equipped exactly the same, but function in shock assault formations rather than as commandos.

The Harakoni Warhawks are an example of an elite drop troopers regiment. They wear Carapace Armour, and use a Lascarbine, as memory serves.

The "Kasrkin Helmet" can be used by regular infantry, yes.

The guard don't tend to use autoguns, but such isn't unheard of. The Lasgun is more reliable and generally regarded as better in every way. Autoguns would be less well equipped regiments.

Hi!

1) They would either be assigned as specialists to regiments, sent to Inquisition, Rogue Trader etc if they're wanted by those forces or disbanded, I think.

2) I'm pretty sure they're Cadians only, and that they do both roles at various points in their usage.

3)Unsure, but I think that only Progena Orphans can become stormtoopers.

4) I would think just the gear they had before to avoid time retraining them for the new gear and combat style that goes with it.

5) I believe there are. Things like 'Mukali riders' in the Tallarns. There would probably be unnamed elites within individual regiments anyway, products of their environment.

6) Yes, they do. Either assigned it due to value, find it or units like the Terrax Guard or Harakoni Warhawks use it as standard.

7) Most novels and codexes etc seem to suggest that it does fire full auto.

8) Only issued to, but can be used by regular infantry, I think. (Unsure.)

9)Yes, less well equipped or advanced regiments do use Autoguns. They're just less efficient, reliable etc than the lasgun. Codex just uses a base line to avoid complications, I think.

10) Depends on the regiment. Strict regiments wouldn't let you use such tainted or stolen gear, others would. As is often the case, IG law and practicality are two very different things. If the guy finds a bolt pistol and uses it well, is it practical to say 'no, you can't fight better, you stupid little man' and take it away?




Autoguns get used by PDFs semi-regularly, and only rarely by the Guard - the Munitorum will generally issue out lasguns so that the troops all use the same ammo as much as possible.

The Munitorum likes things to be standardized ... and autoguns - and their ammo - come in a lot of varieties, which also has the side effect of massively complicating an already complicated supply network. Lasgun power packs can be recharged easily, even in the field if necessary, whereas making ammo for autoguns requires a manufacturing infrastructure and the necessary raw materials.

As a result, autoguns are usually only used by local forces or those with robust yet short supply lines.

Thanks. So munitorium would not issue autoguns to whole regiment and it's unlikely to find veterans using autoguns. My players have become a veteran squad so now i have to deal with whole new level of "i want this stuff". Right new most of things they want is carapace armor, autoguns (because lazers suck :D ) and want to be more elite than elite :)

Veterans might actually use autoguns - sometimes - but they're still going to have their standard issue lasguns at all times, and use the autoguns as a situational weapon, and will probably have upgraded the autoguns with silencers/etc. After all, if you're going to requisition an autogun, it's a whole lot easier to silence than a lasgun.

However ... by RAW, the weapon personalization(?) can only be done with standard issue equipment, so they're not going to be able to tweak them quite as much.

Don't want to make another thread so a few more questions.

1. Does imperium have any other form of communication beside astropath's? I read in few novels they were using some kind of hololith communication device and nospoheric communication between planets.

2. Since my players don't get to own equipment beside standard kit (they need to return all item after every mission) i upgrade their stuff on every XP treshold. What weapons and armor should have 5k and 7,5k characters that will be proper for veterans?

Light Carapace at 5k. Stormtrooper Carapace at 7.5k. Hotshot lasguns or equivalent at 5k. Plasma guns or equivalent at 7.5k

The imperium does assuredly make use of more common tech for communications. Astropaths are generally the best means for rapid and accurate intergalactic communications, but the there is the inherent danger as found in all Psykers. The omnipresent vox (radio) is still available for generic day to day back and forth chatter. I dare say that although the Astropath's communiques reach farther, Imperial command prefers the old fashioned vox and hololith for local traffic. Less likely to incur the perils of the warp with a handset. Just not helpful shooting your com-set in the middle of a battle , whereas it may be prudent to do so if the brain-job's nose starts to bleed inexplicablyor the temperature suddenly drops drastically...

I realised that there was short range vox that works just like radio but how far can it reach? Can it work between planets? How does hololith works?

Assuming the Vox really is like radio, it can totally work on an interplanetary level, it's how we control space ships like Rosetta. However, just as with Rosetta, there is a delay in the transmission. So you can send messages easily, but not hold a conversation in realtime, unless the planets are really close. If their orbits aren't synchronized, then the delay will even depend on how far apart they are and if anything ever completely blocks LoS, it also blocks transmission. We can (literally) get around that though with satellites who might also boost the signal a bit, to make sure that signal quality doesn't degrade too much.

Technically, you can even do that over lightyears of distance, but the delay is as big as the distance, you don't know if anyone is listening and you'd need a lot of power for the signal to be still decipherable. Could be done, though.

Also, in at least a couple of places of (really) old fluff, there's details suggesting that the AdMech has a non-astropathic interstellar communications system linked to the Altars.

Hololith is basically video chats for 40k. It, and vox communications, are lightspeed communications, so, assuming a constellation of relay satellites in orbit or a sufficiently dense network of dirtside relay stations, effectively instantaneous anywhere on planet or in near orbit, with a noticeable although workable delay out to around lunar orbit.

Given that a Void Unit is nominally 10,000km, hololithic and vox communications are functionally realtime, or near enough to make no meaningful difference, at most practical non-narrative ranges.

3. Can a normal soldier became stormtrooper or is it exclusively for schola progenium orphans?

Yes a normal soldier can become a stormtrooper but he needs the backing of someone like an inquisitor to due it. He then is sent to a schola progenium and has to graduate just like the schola progenium orphans and is treated just like them no matter what his rank was before he was dropped into their training.

Dark Heresy Ascension pg. 43

Dark Heresy - Ascension and the Games Workshop Militarum Tempestus codex contradict one another.

Dark Heresy (and the other RPGs) contradicts a lot of stuff published by GW. As Aaron Dembski-Bowden said: there is no canon .

Most writers I've talked with about this - including one of the freelancers who created material for FFG - consider this a feature of the IP as it gives them the freedom to pursue their own ideas. For what it's worth, Games Workshop encourages players of the tabletop to similarly make the game "their own", both in terms of background as well as rules.

So I suppose if there are any questions, it would help if we could specify what sources should be discussed. Should we assume that FFG's books take priority, because this is FFG's forum, for talking about an FFG game?

Alternatively, I guess we could provide a "list" of different answers, tagged with where it's from?

1.What happens to veterans when most of regiment is wiped out? In codex it's stated that sometimes two wrecked regiments are combined but what if only one or two squad remains from few regiments? Will they be combined into some kind of veteran regiment?

Depends on the war zone conditions and the powers that may be. Depending on the regiment, these survivors can be caroled into a mix regiment (if in a hellish warzone where many regiments drop to such low levels simultaenously), taken by the Inquisition for their skill sets and survivability, absorbed into special operations, disbanded and abandoned on a world on the route towards a new warzone or encampment.

The variables are too high to give any more than a concrete answer. This doesn't even get into the question whether or not such a squad remains loyal to the beauracratic hell or decide to go absent or freelance (If they can escape the warzone reasonably)

2. Does Kasrkin recruit soldiers only from Cadia or sometimes from other planets? Do they act like commando unit or are frontline grenadiers like in HoTE. They are lately absent from fluff sadly.

Kasrkin recruit exclusively from Cadia. They form a front-line grenadier role and stalwart bastion defender role as well.

3. Can a normal soldier became stormtrooper or is it exclusively for schola progenium orphans?

Various answers on this, due to the scope of the narrative and the length of the canon background material.

1. Inquisitional Stormtroopers: These are recruited from the Schola Progenium as well as certain families with a tradition of service to the Inquisition. This is most-likely line of service from the Ascension material. (Yes, a normal soldier could become a stormtrooper).

2. The Ordo Tempestus: The Ordo's ranks are primarily composed of Tempestus Scions and Commissars, but also include specialists from a variety of Imperial organisations. (Yes, a normal soldier could become a stormtrooper).

3. Tempestus Scions: By virtue of its members having been recruited from the Progena of the Schola Progenium, the regiment is made up of soldiers from worlds throughout the Imperium. With up to ten thousand men under arms at any one time, the regiment is also larger than most other regiments. (No. Tempestus Scions regiments serving in the Militarum Tempestus are composed completely of Progena)

4. If two regiments are mixed together from different homeworlds do they have unified equipment or they use same stuff from their home unit?

Imperial Guard mixed regiments are typically run down until they are destroyed. Unlikely they'd receive any new stuff other than ammunition or similar supplies. If they manage to not get themselves annihilated (poor coordination between regiments, etc), after some time a homogenized unit would be produced due to the rare successfulness of the mixed regiment. Not exactly sure - i'd toss it up to the warzone command to figure that out.

5. Are there other elite units like karskin in regiments of catachan, tallarn etc?

Imperial Guard Regiments known to utilize Tempestus Scions or equivilents include:

Several regiments commonly employing Scions (or Storm Trooper equivalents) are:
- Cadian Shock Troops
- Armageddon Steel Legion
- Terrax Guard
- Harakoni Warhawks
- Death Korps of Krieg

Thanks. So munitorium would not issue autoguns to whole regiment and it's unlikely to find veterans using autoguns. My players have become a veteran squad so now i have to deal with whole new level of "i want this stuff". Right new most of things they want is carapace armor, autoguns (because lazers suck :D ) and want to be more elite than elite :)

First let me point out that Lasguns don't suck! At least not as compared to Autoguns! Lasguns have the same damage, Twice the magazine capacity and 20% less weight. The only thing autoguns have going for them is full auto capability. Given their rate of fire, magazine capacity and the fact that full auto fire now applies a -10 attack modifier, I don't really see the advantage!

Remember that OW is not Dark heresy! The Munitorium issues Lasguns for reasons beyond their intrinsic tactical value. Tactically, Lasguns are considered "good enough" to get the job done. Especially when used in massed ranks of guardsmen! Logistically though, Lasguns are awesome! They are cheap, reliable, rugged and require almost no support from outside the warzone. This is why the Munitorium issues them as the primary weapon for guard troopers. Further, having the entire regiment fighting with essentially the same weapon makes stocking replacement parts and additional weapons much easier! For these reasons, The Munitorium is highly unlikely to issue an autogun in place of a Lasgun. (As a matter of fact, the Lasgun is actually issued in replacement for autoguns in regiments taken from worlds where they are used by the PDF.)

As to better weapon upgrades? According to the fluff it's highly unlikely that there would be squad level upgrades. Heavy and special weapons could be upgraded as missions demand. Veteran squads would no doubt gain examples to the better "toys" in the armoury such as Plasma cannons, meltaguns etc. but these would be special or heavy weapons issue only. The fluff also mentions that "battlefield salvage" is a fairly common way that veteran squads upgrade their kit. Commissars will often look the other way as long as equipment is not outright heretical or of Xenos origin (So the Daemon sword and Eldar Spliter rifle will likely be frowned upon!). However, as salvage, I'm sure your guardsmen could come across some heretic cultists sporting autoguns. Once the battle is over, you could grab their guns but maintaining ammo supplies could be troublesome.

You can silence Autoguns and load them with armour piercing rounds. Get your hands on that and enjoy punching through traitor flak helmets silently. Better for a suppression weapon, arguably, and generally much more flexible.

Also, slap a targeter on it, and enjoy watching that -10 disappear. Or play a Heavy > Sentry and stabilise for a lovely +10 when spraying bullets.

Autoguns are fantastic, if you know how to use them properly.

Just how noisy is a Lasgun? I suspect less so than an Autogun. You're also talking a squad level weapon so things aren't going to be real silent anyway. (Unless you're playing special ops types during a "silent interlude" type firefight.)

Semi-automatic weapons can conduct suppression fire also and are more ammo conservative.

You're putting a rare upgrade and scarce ammo on an average availability weapon In order to get the same effect I can get with the throw of a switch on a Lasgun? Why?

Not trying to be disrespectful Sarge! I know that an autogun can be an effective weapon. What I'm saying is that the Lasgun is at least AS effective tactically and far more so on a strategic (logistically) level. There are also a number of upgrades that can be added to the Lasgun to make far more effective than an autogun!

If the OP is truly determined to upgrade his squad from the Mk.36 Lasgun; I would recommend Either Hellguns or Bolters. Each has disadvantages but both are far more powerful than the Mk.36. For squads doing a lot of CQB actions I might recommend adding an Autopistol to the unit's kit. This weapon has all the advantages of an autogun at close range (Where full auto becomes more effective) but can be used in one hand. this allows players to also have a melee weapon in the other. Best of all, you still have your Lasgun available for general use! :P

Hotshot Lasguns are pretty useless against your run of the mill Orks, but against armoured enemies they're a good choice.

Honestly, I'd take Boltguns if it's an upgrade scenario.

I like autoguns simply because I like to imagine the satisfying kick and the roar as the bullet leaves the barrel towards the gribbly. Lasguns however, are logistically far more sound:you need far less ammo shipments when you can reload through exposure to light or a plug and a cord, lasguns are lighter, and they hir just as hard. Yeah, they are less versatile in terms of alternate ammo types, so that well-armored baddie is an issue, but otherwise I'm with Rad on this one.

That said, if its an upgrade, give them a boltgun or slap a bunch of sweet upgrades on their lasguns and watch them wreck the baddies.

Aye - given the stresses on the Guard's Logistical support network - and it being perpetually overextended and overstressed, as a general issue for line troops, lasguns are the way to go.

As an upgrade/special issue, other weapons are good, though autoguns are really more of a sidegrade than a true upgrade at that point, as bolt or plasma weapons would be.

I'm an Ork at heart. I love me some dakka. Nevertheless, what's been said over and over again in this thread is certainly true: Autoguns aren't as good as lasguns. It's 40k's way of letting you know it's the future. The weapon most comparable to the state-of-the-art for modern militaries is so rubbish that an army principally famous for being cannon fodder has something better. If you want dakka, you're looking for a bolter. Mmmm, bolters.

After all i must disagree. One of my players use modified autogun and it's a lot better than lasgun. While maybe autogun has 2 point less damage it has more options. Autogun with silencer and motion predictor, custom grip and a few other things is deadly. Last session he score 10 hits on full auto.

It's 40k's way of letting you know it's the future.

Then why chainsword user can wreck any human enemy in one round while lasgun user need few rounds to kill basic human? :D Also one of guardsman with feeling quality chainsword killed at least 12 genestealers in narrow corridors while another player did like maybe 2-3 points of damage. And from what i read only advantage of lasgun in fluff is that they are easy to handle and have plenty of amunition. Right now my players have autogun using sharpshooter, expert at ambush, lieutenant "chainsword" who kills anything in one round with his chainsword and a medic nickname "god of war" which is a joke by other team members since medic cant hit anything with his bolter. Hovewer i think that lieutenant "chainsword" won't live much longer since he killed commisar in front of like 100 witnesses (in one round ofc :D ).

If anyone will have similar problem in the future i reccomend from my expierience that before 5k bolters and chainsword are good enough and after that plasma, melta is a must if players face something more than common mutant. It all depends on who their fighting against. Normal humans drop like flies when players have bolters and such while tyranids are sometimes too much challange.