UPDATE: subject line should be Diala and not Jan, as my lovely wife pointed out to me
Edited by JayvenClarification: Jyn's Dancing Weapon + Cleave
Isnt it someone adjacent to you? So you throw the saber then cut a guy as you grab your lightsaber in a quick upercut fashion
Here's the actual card for those who want to take a look:
Yup, I say it's fair game:
"If the target of this figure’s attack suffers one or more damage, the attacker may
choose a different hostile figure or object that he could target for an attack." (8)
+
"The chosen figure or object must be an eligible target." (8)
So, since it's a ranged attack:
1) The Hero must have LOS to the additional target (the one that you want to cleave)
2) The Hero must have enough Accuracy to reach target
EDIT: So yes, I'm also implying that the additional target
does not
have to be adjacent to the original target chosen.
The whole "adjacent to the Hero performing the cleave ability" thought only applies to a hero making a melee attack (without reach) who also wants to cleave.
Good little combo I think!
And feel free to prove me wrong haha
Edited
by Armandhammer
It is definitely one combo I'd like to see in the FAQ, that is for sure.
Our house thoughts (from my wife who is playing Diala) after I posted the thread is:
Option 1: Throw your weapon, hits the target, cleave around that target and weapon returns.
Option 2: Throw your weapon, hits the target, and then hits anything adjacent on its path back within it's reach.
That is how we are picturing it in a cinematic sense.
I definitely agree, Armand , that you need the accuracy to reach the additional targets.
I don't think it needs an FAQ.
"
The chosen figure or object must be an eligible target
. For
example, for a melee attack (without Reach), the chosen figure
must be adjacent to the attacker."
Bold emphasis is mine.
Again, everything after the bolded emphasis is an example of triggering a cleave with a melee attack, not a
ranged attack
.
So:
1) Diala decides to use the "Dancing weapon" special action against stormtrooper 1. Diala attacks and strikes a wound against stormtrooper 1. She rolled 4 accuracy during the attack.
2) Diala can now choose an eligible target. An eligible target using a ranged attack is an attack that has: A) LOS to the target B) enough accuracy to reach target. Diala cannot cleave target 2 because although she has enough accuracy (4), she doesn't have LOS to the target.
3) Diala can target stormtooper 3 because she has LOS to the target and enough accuracy. Stormtrooper 3 suffers the cleave effect.
Thematically it makes sense to me as well.
I mean, we are talking about a force user here.
I can easily imagine the lightsaber flying through the air, striking at stormtrooper 1, circling around to narrowly miss stormtrooper 2 but managing to clip stormtrooper 3 as it returns to her hand.
Furthermore, as I don't have a copy of the game, I'm not sure if there are any other instances where a ranged attack has a cleave option (most of them are blast, right?).
No ranged weapon gets cleave. Just Blast X.
Thanks for the food for thought, wife is asleep and I'll show her this later on.
No ranged weapon gets cleave. Just Blast X.
Thanks for the food for thought, wife is asleep and I'll show her this later on.
You're welcome
So it is a very specific situation.
What jumped out to me while looking back in the rules was that under the "Cleave" headings and "Blast" headings both sections are careful to avoid designating "cleave" as a melee only type of ability and "blast" as a range only type of ability.
We could see some odd mashups (ranged attack with a cleave option/melee weapon with a blast option) with new expansions. Maybe an explosive tipped staff of some kind?
We could see some odd mashups (ranged attack with a cleave option/melee weapon with a blast option) with new expansions. Maybe an explosive tipped staff of some kind?
Boba Fett has canonical weapons that are definitely 'blast' weapons since 1980 including a sawed off blaster carbine and a flame thrower.
The premier bounty hunter in the Star Wars Galaxy had knee darts that had a scatter/spray effect as well.
Hhmm.
I'm mixed on this. Totally like the idea of it working, and hitting more than one target with the force controlled saber attack. But adjacent or near adjacent targets make more sense than it flying back and forth all over.
There doesn't seem to be a limit to targets, so with 4 range you could attack targets in 4 different directions even if there were no line of sight between those targets? Technically, by the rules, I guess I see no problem. But thematically it's goofy. The sword would fly to 1, then practically back to you before moving to another, then back and forth over again and again.
I'd probably house rule it to make it consume accuracy. 2 targets at range 3 standing adjacent would take 4 accuracy. 3 to the first target, and an additional 1 to the next target. If they were a space apart, then you'd need 5 accuracy. 1 throw could damage multiple targets in 1 direction/area, but not bounce all over like the weapon handle was covered in flubber.
Something isn't right here. Doesn't Cleave just deal damage to a target that is adjacent to the first target? In that case, there is no discussion to be had here; if the initial target has nobody beside it, then there is nothing to cleave.
So if Diala throws her lightsaber, then she'll hit one target (assuming enough Accuracy), and then (when it applies) deal Cleave damage to one enemy adjacent to that target (if available). I don't see a good reason to interpret it otherwise.
No, cleave deals damage to one other valid target. No mention in the rules that it needs to be adjacent to the original target (Rules Reference Guide page 8)
There doesn't seem to be a limit to targets, so with 4 range you could attack targets in 4 different directions even if there were no line of sight between those targets?
"The chosen figure or object must be an eligible target ." (8)
Again, it's a ranged attack . In order for something to hit with a ranged attack you need: A) enough accuracy to reach the target B) LOS to the target.
So targets that are not within LOS (of the hero performing the attack) cannot suffer the cleave effect.
Everyone seems fixated on the Battlefront 2 lightsaber throw (straight forward, straight back) BUT the ability is called "Dancing weapon" after all, which suggests an elaborate range of motion. Think Yondu (Michael Rooker) from Guardians of the Galaxy with that arrow of his
I could see this becoming an issue with nonsensitive force users, but it seems that right now the whole ranged attack + cleave combo is only associated with Diala's special ability (and I'm assuming that her saber has a cleave option, which wasn't specified in the OP).
Doesn't Cleave just deal damage to a target that is adjacent to the first target? I
Blast: "If the target of this figure’s attack suffers one or more damage, each figure and
object adjacent to the target space suffers damage equal to the Blast value." (7)
Cleave: "If the target of this figure’s attack suffers one or more damage, the attacker may
choose a different hostile figure or object that he could target for an attack...The chosen figure or object must be an eligible target" (8)
EDIT: Ninja'd
Edited
by Armandhammer
Wow, that's a wierd interaction then. We'll need an official answer in a FAQ.
I actually got an official response and I believe it should be in a FAQ since we can see in this thread alone that it is viewed in differing ways.
The response I got was that it works like Armand mentioned.
"The chosen figure or object must be an eligible target ." (8)
Again, it's a ranged attack . In order for something to hit with a ranged attack you need: A) enough accuracy to reach the target B) LOS to the target.
I didn't realise that Cleave too was only *1* additional target, so that neatens this up nicely.
As long as you have LOS and the accuracy, you can hit that second target just fine.
Everyone seems fixated on the Battlefront 2 lightsaber throw (straight forward, straight back) BUT the ability is called "Dancing weapon" after all, which suggests an elaborate range of motion. Think Yondu (Michael Rooker) from Guardians of the Galaxy with that arrow of his
I could see this becoming an issue with nonsensitive force users, but it seems that right now the whole ranged attack + cleave combo is only associated with Diala's special ability (and I'm assuming that her saber has a cleave option, which wasn't specified in the OP).
I have no problem visualizing this at all, Jedi in various media have thrown their lightsabers for similar effects.
In Cannon, Darth Vader does this in combat with Luke to bring down the walkway he is on.
In video games Jedi and Sith both use this ability, peculiarly the damage being even more than when used this way than normal lightsaber combat.
In Expanded fiction, in the Thrawn Trilogy , Luke throws his saber without line of sight and only has the Force to guide his aim to dispatch a group of Noghri Death Commandos. Later on in the series, in their escape from the Chimera , Luke again uses this ability and takes out an entire squad (8) of Strormtroopers. In each instance he throws his lightsaber once.
I will refrain from further comment as the less said about the murderous traitor Luke, [the Butcher of Yavin] the better.