Ok guys.. tear it up. I'm thinking it could be fun, but who knows. I'm interested in your opinions.. if I should just chuck it.. so be it. The "Whisper" / Mara Jade combo looks interesting to me, and I dont recall if anyone mentioned it before.. they may have I just don't remember

"Whisper" (32)

Outmaneuver (3)

Mara Jade (3)

Advanced Cloaking Device (4)

Saber Squadron Pilot (21)

Delta Squadron Pilot (30)

Proton Rockets (3)

Stealth Device (3)

Total: 99

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Give me some thoughts, constructive criticism is always helpful.. this was just off the top of my head with all the defender and phantom threads I've been seeing and from some past threads... thanks

I find Whisper rather predictable, cloak blocking can be effective depending on what you're flying. I like the idea of Jade on there, you can do some arc dodging and sprinkle stress like potpurri, but I really cringe at a PS7 Phantom with so many points on it. Delta with Stealth and rockets: PRs are really cool, but on a 3ATK ship you're paying 3 points for one extra dice once. The Stealth Device can help, but maybe you shift some points to your squint for some added maneuverability?

PTL on the Saber will probably be a better use of 3 points than the Stealth Device on the Delta.

I think that for the same cost I might be more partial to an Ion Cannon on the Delta than I am the Proton Rockets.

I find Whisper rather predictable, cloak blocking can be effective depending on what you're flying. I like the idea of Jade on there, you can do some arc dodging and sprinkle stress like potpurri, but I really cringe at a PS7 Phantom with so many points on it. Delta with Stealth and rockets: PRs are really cool, but on a 3ATK ship you're paying 3 points for one extra dice once. The Stealth Device can help, but maybe you shift some points to your squint for some added maneuverability?

To the point of boosting the Saber, I think that's a worthy cause, I was tempted to shift the PRocks to Stealth fornthe squint.. sounds like a plan,, and getting PtL on the squint.. hmmm.. should I abandon the defender to no upgrades??? Worth a look to see how it flies..

Edit

Not sure how a ship with such maneuverability is predictable.. but with that in mind, is Echo a better choice??

Not sure how a ship with such maneuverability is predictable.. but with that in mind, is Echo a better choice??

A lot of the time you'll really only have one or two viable decloak options. If the opponent is able to block one of those with their movement they can usually cover the other with their arcs.

To the point of boosting the Saber, I think that's a worthy cause, I was tempted to shift the PRocks to Stealth fornthe squint.. sounds like a plan,, and getting PtL on the squint.. hmmm.. should I abandon the defender to no upgrades??? Worth a look to see how it flies..

I'd prioritize PTL on the Sabre instead of Stealth.

Looks fun. I agree that you might want to do something with the Saber, though it's hardly horrid naked.

Also, be careful that you don't poke someone's eye out with all those pointy bits!

I ran something very similar the other day.

Up your squad to 100 points then change the upgrades on the defender to a HLC.

Then drop 3 points off whisper and put PTL on the squint.

Worked really well in two of the three games I played, dice lost me that third game.

**** you dice gods....

P-rockets are cool but atm their only real home is the Tie advanced, maybe A-wings but I find they are better with the refit.

Should be good on Syck's too.....I can't wait for Syck's

I've been trying this out:

Colonel Vessery (35)

Outmaneuver (3)

Heavy Laser Cannon (7)

"Echo" (30)

Fire-Control System (2)

Weapons Engineer (3)

Advanced Cloaking Device (4)

"Backstabber" (16)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Basic idea is to deploy V+B on one flank, and Echo on the other. If my opponent goes after Echo, then Echo runs away and doesn't decloak, while V+B get unanswered shots from out of arc. If my opponent goes after V+B, cool, Echo doesn't have to worry about getting shot down. Either way, Echo target paints for V. Everybody is PS6, which means that I can make choices about when to have Echo shoot first to put the second TL on the ship that V is going to target, etc.

I don't think it's a top-tier list, but it can certainly put out some high quality dice. Flying it helps me get better at phantoms, which I need to do anyway. It's fun.

I like it, I'd take Outmaneuver off of Whisper and add VI.

Add PtL to the Saber and transfer the stealth to it.

That should make for a pretty mean list

Going to 2nd what Englishpete reconmended, adding only that a 33 point Onyx Squadron is a Bounty Hunter done incorrectly

There isn't really a point in adding more damage output to a phantom. what youre missing in spending into information, not firepower.

outmaneuver is like strapping a pistol to a machine gun.

there isn't really much of a point in putting anything other than VI on a Phantom currently imo. You're welcome to try for fun, but again its like winning more on games you've already won. like shooting a dead person again.

That said: I like Prockets IF you can land them. sure you pay 3 points for one extra dice, but if you have the right TL and F for that shot, its really really worth the extra bit of damage earlier.

Sabre should get PTL.

Of course I'm sure you know this but you're gonna get whomped by Falcons, as two attack will be all it takes to take down both the phantom and the sabre.

--

other than that, sounds fun. go play =)

to be fair, in regards to stacking offense on a 4 red dice monstrositiy, I've found that FCS does wonders to alleviate dice spiking infavorably

to be fair, in regards to stacking offense on a 4 red dice monstrositiy, I've found that FCS does wonders to alleviate dice spiking infavorably

I do agree with this addition though. =D really does do a significant amount of difference. Also very good against targets you continually need to kill. Cough Falcons.

I know this is just my opinion, but honestly I love the naked Delta Defender... It's a beast w/o anything on it. Yes your 4K is predictable, but at PS1 you are moving first, ensuring you get your 4K and an action each turn.

So what I would do with your current list is:

Leave Whisper as is...I like the concept...seems fun...

Drop Stealth Device and Prockets from Defender...

Upgrade Saber Squadron to Turr Phennir with Push the Limit.

This puts you at 100, so if you want that initiative bid you could always drop Turr to VI and have a few extra points.

Just my two cents. This seems like it would play similar to a list I've been running to great effect lately...using 3xAPs instead of a phantom...but I love the defender/Interceptor synergy.

I played that list at worlds and my 3 tie defenders ran right through it. I don't know how long my opponent had been playing that list but even without doing my 4k "freebies" the match didn't last long. I would go with what Englishpete said at the moment, but since I haven't yet played what he suggested I can't truthfully tell you my knowledgeable opinion. I will have to try it and see. As for right now have 2 naked defenders and 1 defender with Brath and predator. Even with bad dice in flight 2 at worlds i was 53rd out of 130 with my SOS. As with any build if you have bad dice you will have a bad day....

Thanks guys.. I appreciate all the feedback and positive comments. Will be looking at all these options and figuring the best ones to utilize.. I'm favoring heavily on Petes idea.. but I can mix it up to do a couple changes. Will Def be running the Delta naked. Boosting The Sabre with PTL and Stealth. The Phantom.. well I may give the FIS a try to see how it feels.. I'd like to run it sans VI .. but we'll see how it all works out.. I like to try things outside the norm.. sometimes it bites me in the @$$ lol sometimes it comes out alright

Thanks again

hey oneway, how about ruthlessness on the whisper? =D

also VI Turr is a really fun guy. just be thoughtful

I think Ruthlessness would be fun.. but I am loathe to stick VI on any ship when PtL is available. I understand the reasoning for the VI, but I think some EPTs are better.. but I'm not ruling it out altogether. Tossing one into my tourney box so I can swap it if I think I need some changes...

I do really dig Ruthlessness though.. lol fits my personality somewhat..

I think Ruthlessness would be fun.. but I am loathe to stick VI on any ship when PtL is available. I understand the reasoning for the VI, but I think some EPTs are better.. but I'm not ruling it out altogether. Tossing one into my tourney box so I can swap it if I think I need some changes...

I do really dig Ruthlessness though.. lol fits my personality somewhat.. 9

actually PTL on Turr should be used on his post combat action, not before, so sometimes you may find it restrictive. whereas using VI lets you also usually shoot first.

anyway i get it. just a thought.

wanna try this list?

PtL on Turr is always best after the attack, I usually do that, unless I have a good arc dodge before.. I do like shooting first lol. I'll try it both ways and see what I like better. I have some time before the tourny so I can perfect my list and game against people I'll be playing for he prize.

I like the list, I love shuttles.. those wonderous cosmic manatees...

Its not my design. This guy flummoxed me and wiped me out with it. it was full of "scrub"by dubby choices, like kitting out the space cow (that only got 2 hits in), weird flying, completely lucky rolls of his no mods against my modded dice, etc.

but.

he blocked me completely everywhere, all the time. it was enlightening to learn that I'm an idiot.

Imo, nothing wrong with kiting out the Shuttle. It's super freaking cheap enough that you can toss on quite a few points of upgrades and still have it come out more than reasonable. More importantly, it makes it a scary enough target that your opponent might actually diverty attention to it intead of letting it slowly drift past

My favorite kit is the "buzzsaw" if I'm using that terminology right (FCS + Gunner?) with either the Omnicron, Yorr, or even Kagi (hell, toss it on Jendon too if you're rolling with the auto-include Enginneer). It's a hilariously action independent ship that fires far more accurately than a ship in its price range ought to for having no actions (though Kagi starts getting a little porky with his increased base cos and all)

Not sure Kagi specifically needs many upgrades, though, since his ability is going to wrest attention away from your ships whether your opponent likes it or not (unless they also pack FCS )