Just wondering what everyone thought how good/ competitive this list could be.

Darth Vader + EU

Soontir Fel + PTL

Bounty Hunter + Rebel Captive

The rebel captive i was not sure if i should use it or maybe a navigator and am still unsure.

What are your thoughts, improvements or anything thanks greatly.

Not my style, but yeah its good. (I would rather have skills/missiles on Vader than EU, but many people really like EU, so go for it).

Go with Rebel Captive (or Recon Specialist). Navigator on a PS 3 ship is underwhelming since you move so early.

Drop Darth Vader, he's a waste of points. Two attack dice for that many points just isn't worth it.

Drop Darth Vader, he's a waste of points. Two attack dice for that many points just isn't worth it.

And is the YT 2400 not worth it either using that logic?

A lot of people don't like Vader (or the TIE Advanced in general) because he is seen as a bit overpriced. Only by a point or two, but overpriced nonetheless. Early on the designers put a higher value on the ability to take ordinance than it turned out to be worth.

I personally think Vader has the best pilot ability out there, but his striking power leaves a bit to be desired. While the EU is great for him, you should find some way to add some hitting power if you want to get good value from him. I recommend Outmaneuver, or possibly Proton Rockets but only if you have the points for both.

Soontir/PTL is solid of course, the only thing I would change would be the Bounty Hunter and Captive. Captive is something you put on a juicy target (i.e. something your enemies will be forced to take out first) to make it cumbersome to shoot at. Most times your opponent will simply ignore the frankly less-dangerous Firespray.

Thanks i was thinking maybe the firespray might be the overlooked ship in the list, would like to know what could be used in its place if anyone has any ideas.

I am a big fan of the firespray. and Soontir Fel is great. I think the weakest link is probably the Tie-Advanced.

That having been said if you give him proton rockets Vader will do some neat tricks.

I'd try something like replacing either Vader or the Firespray with 2-3 Ties and trying out variations. Soontir Fel is one of those when he works its amazing, but at times the green dice betray you.

I do agree those dice can be your best friend or worst nightmare.

Vader is the weak point for sure. What other ships do you own?

Drop Darth Vader, he's a waste of points. Two attack dice for that many points just isn't worth it.

How can that statement benefit anyone? Vader can work. You have to work at it a little more but he is not the garbage you so body state he is.

And is the YT 2400 not worth it either using that logic?

How does blindly challenging the point and not using anything to back it up benefit anyone? Some truths just are. Also, making unrealistic comparisons won't benefit anyone, but to answer your question, the base YT-2400 isn't great, it is Dash and the title that will make it great. That being said, it is a large ship with a native Barrel Roll, which is a big deal, whereas a TIE Fighter with 2 shields isn't.

Drop Darth Vader, he's a waste of points. Two attack dice for that many points just isn't worth it.

How can that statement benefit anyone? Vader can work. You have to work at it a little more but he is not the garbage you so body state he is.

And is the YT 2400 not worth it either using that logic?

If the OP wanted a fluffy bunnies I don't care if I win or lose list, they would have stated so. Instead the OP asked for a competitive list. Vader is not competitive, even you acknowledge it yourself.

I haven't flown a YT 2400 nor flown against one so I'm not going to make a call on that until I've played with it a few times. But I have flown the TIE Advanced a few times and have flown against Vader enough times as well. There are better choices to be made than Vader (or any TIE Advanced) at the current time.

A list I like that has a firespray, soontir but no Vader is

Krass + HLC + Recon

Soontir + PTL

Academy x 2

A list I like that has a firespray, soontir but no Vader is

Krass + HLC + Recon

Soontir + PTL

Academy x 2

I flew almost this exact list last night and was very pleased. The only difference was rebel captive instead of recon specialist. The rebel captive paid off tremendously. Double stressing x-wings after k-turns and generally annoying the rebel scum.

The most difficult part was keeping the firespray pointed at them rather than relying on the alternate arc (no HLC). Engine upgrade would be nice but probably would work against you by taking away much needed focus actions.

Much discussion about the Vader here. I agree with TheJrade regarding Vader and Outmaneuver. EU is awesome, but you really need to make him more of a threat. Bottom line, if you want to use Vader, make sure he has some bite (ie. outmaneuver). Outmaneuver with EU is even better if you can fit the points.

Soontir + PTL is always solid.

As for Rebel Captive or Recon Specialist... I could see you going both ways. Captive isn't necessarily bad if using Vader and Soontir, and here is why. Soontir and Vader are, by nature of their dials/action capability, very maneuverable ships. It'll be easier for your opponent to go after the Firespray the majority of the time. Turrets are another story.

If you are maneuvering in a way to force your enemy to fire on your Firespray, Rebel Captive is great and messing with your opponents head. Maybe they don't want to get stressed and want to chase after your maneuverable ships instead...that's great for you! Maybe they have a lot of ships and just focus fire your Firespray with a lot of guns...the stress only goes to the first one who attacks you. Even if you are only stressing one ship, it's usually one with higher pilot skill, because that's who fires first...which can still mess with the enemy's tactics.

On the other hand, you could get more mileage out of Recon Specialist because of the defensive increase it gives while still giving you the chance to use a focus on your attack. Because of your lower pilot skill, you'll get to choose if you need to use both of your focus tokens or not on defense, keeping your ship around longer. Maybe you'll need both, maybe not. Either way your Firespray will be around longer. It's hard to burn through a ship's focus die with 2+ agility.

The bottom line here is that rebel captive doesn't keep your Firespray around longer, it just messes with your opponent's tactics. Recon Specialist will keep your Firespray around longer. It's whatever your preference is as a player.

Drop Darth Vader, he's a waste of points. Two attack dice for that many points just isn't worth it.

How can that statement benefit anyone? Vader can work. You have to work at it a little more but he is not the garbage you so body state he is.

And is the YT 2400 not worth it either using that logic?

Its just a statement of cost effective-ness. Everyone loves Vader. He's just not competitively priced because the early assessments of the developers was faulty.

your next choice of example is extremely skewed.

Nobody has really tested the YT-2400 naked yet, so we will see if that's worth taking. I doubt it.

The typical build with it however has a 4 dice turret, which is highly cost effective. We are already predicting it to be THE most powerful build of wave 5 sadly. When that time comes, we will see if that's right. (See Triple Action Dash).

An analogue: the naked YT-1300 with two attack dice is considered over costed and not used often. About 2 points over.

Tie Advanced are 4.5 points over cost. A considerable difference.

He only costs so much because he's awesome

Just wondering what everyone thought how good/ competitive this list could be.

Darth Vader + EU

Soontir Fel + PTL

Bounty Hunter + Rebel Captive

The rebel captive i was not sure if i should use it or maybe a navigator and am still unsure.

What are your thoughts, improvements or anything thanks greatly.

I'd fly it but I would put proton rockets on Vader or recon on bounty hunter

On what would you base your statement that the Advanced is 4.5 over cost? It is extremely similar to the A-Wing, albeit slightly tougher and with better pilots for being more expensive. I would think that making a fix similar (but not identical to) the A-Wing's well-received fix would be about what is needed. Remember, a fix is not intended to make a ship auto-include, but to make it a hard choice to make over other hard choices.

On what would you base your statement that the Advanced is 4.5 over cost? It is extremely similar to the A-Wing, albeit slightly tougher and with better pilots for being more expensive. I would think that making a fix similar (but not identical to) the A-Wing's well-received fix would be about what is needed. Remember, a fix is not intended to make a ship auto-include, but to make it a hard choice to make over other hard choices.

There about 5 or so recently Tie Advanced fix thread. Have you read them? 4 to 4.5 is Major Juggler's estimate.

The quick response is that agility and being able to take missiles was over costed by early developers. They've since been trying to rectify that. Also defense is much less potent than offense in this game. It takes a X wing average 12 turns to kill an Advanced. It takes the Advanced 20 to kill an X. (Basically, the X will win with 8 turns to spare).

We know this about fixes very very well. We are well acquainted with what it means.

You can also look at ship use and stat line efficiency as a rough estimate created by Major Juggler. A note to the skeptics that he has now a full year of data from multiple tournament levels across multiple countries and languages.