If a Decimator (Agility 0) is defending against Wedge ( -1 Agility for the target) at Range 3 (+1 bonus die), how many dice does the Decimator roll?

Zero?

Or One?

Thanks,

JKL

0.

The new FAQ, Page 8, under Increasing and reducing values:

Increasing and Reducing Values

When multiple card effects or abilities increase or reduce a value, such as agility, ignore any “to a minimum of 0” restrictions until the calculation is complete. For example, if a ship with a printed agility value of “0” and the “Structural Damage” card uses “Countermeasures,” its agility is “0.”

You do all the math you can, and if it's still 0 or less, then it's 0.

The Decimator rolls one die.

The range bonus is not applied when you're calculating your agility value (which is where Wedge kicks in), it's an extra dice rolled right at the end (refer to the rulebook, pages 11 & 12). Since you can't have a negative value, the Decimator would default back to 0 after Wedge's ability comes through, then get a bonus die from range. The process would be:

Decimator has 0 agility.

Wedge reduces it -1, giving us a total of -1.

We can't have a negative value, so it goes back to 0.

Calculations are complete, so roll dice equal to your agility (0) + 1 for range.

Decimator starts at 0 -

Wedge reduces by 1 (to a minimum of 0) , so he is AG 0

He rolls 1 extra defence dice (not to be confused with +1AG) for range 3.

He will be AG 0 and roll 1 dice.

I think 1 defense die is correct in that situation. Range modifiers are not "card effects or abilities", so you'd calculate all "card effects and abilities" and if the result is 0 or less, it becomes 0. Then apply any range modifier, intervening asteroid, or other non-card effects and abilities you might have.

Wedge attacking a Decimator, technically wouldn't get a chance to use his ability. He reduces it to a minimum of 0, which it starts out with already. He can't reduce it to -1. So, unless there's something else that would reduce the agility, and doesn't have the "minimum of 0" clause attached, I see Wedge being just another X-Wing.

and if the result is 0 or less, it becomes 0.

Are you sure about this? I don't remember seeing this rule anywhere. There is nothing in the game that will do it at the moment, but thats because everything so far has the qualifier (to a minimum of 0), but that's not to say we won't have one day.

Page 8 of the latest FAQ, see Sergovan's post above. And now with that ruling, there will probably be no need for them to add the minimum clause to each card in the future.

I imagine they'd still use it (space willing), if only to idiot proof the cards.

I'm not sure that covers it. They simply say ignore the qualifier untill after the calculation is complete

So as per the example: 0 -1 +1 = 0 (to a minimum of 0)

as opposed to 0 -1 (to a minimum of 0) = 0 +1 = 1.

I can't see them ever allowing negative values, and fully expect the qualifier to be on all cards that reduce a value, I just don't think we can assume it.

Wedege changes the agility value. The range bonus does not.

First you calculate agility. Which is -1. Then you change agility from -1 to 0 as per the FAQ. After that you roll those zero dice for agility plus the extra die for range.

The example in the FAQ (structural damage), and your example above (Wedge) have qualifiers.

I completely agree that's how Wedge works (see my post above).

What I am saying is that we can't use that to say that 0 is always the minimum. In both cases, the cards themselves,and not the rules or FAQ, set the value to 0.

If (I doubt it will, but if) a card comes out that reduces agility but doesn't say (to a minimum of 0), I don't believe the current rulings would set it to 0.

I was sure that I was getting the math right. I posted right before bed and I was sure that the extra defence die added was because of agility but it is not. It is just an extra defence die.

So the math in my previous post is wrong.

Agility of 0, Wedge -1 agility = 0 (can't have negative and nothing else modifies agility so it is the final calculation), then +1 green die is added [ not +1 to agility - which is the assumption] (as per Page 12 of the rulebook).

Hypothetically, if the cards did not say "to a minimum of 0" then it would be a different story.

Wedege changes the agility value. The range bonus does not.

First you calculate agility. Which is -1. Then you change agility from -1 to 0 as per the FAQ. After that you roll those zero dice for agility plus the extra die for range.

I'm not so sure about this.

The FAQ doesn't mention anything about calculating agility, then zeroing it, if it's less than "0" before adding a die for Range 3. Actually, it doesn't mention anything about the Range 3 die, which doesn't really help this discussion.

The FAQ says increase or reduce a value until the calculation is complete, then apply the zero minimum if it's less than "0".

So the way I see it is: start at Agility "0", -1 for Wedge, +1 for Range 3 = "0" then check minimum of "0". Done.

Wedege changes the agility value. The range bonus does not.

First you calculate agility. Which is -1. Then you change agility from -1 to 0 as per the FAQ. After that you roll those zero dice for agility plus the extra die for range.

I'm not so sure about this.

The FAQ doesn't mention anything about calculating agility, then zeroing it, if it's less than "0" before adding a die for Range 3. Actually, it doesn't mention anything about the Range 3 die, which doesn't really help this discussion.

The FAQ says increase or reduce a value until the calculation is complete, then apply the zero minimum if it's less than "0".

So the way I see it is: start at Agility "0", -1 for Wedge, +1 for Range 3 = "0" then check minimum of "0". Done.

Start at 0, wedge refuces to -1. End of calculation, go to 0 because of Wedge's ability. Then add a dice to your dice pool as per range rules.

Wedege changes the agility value. The range bonus does not.

First you calculate agility. Which is -1. Then you change agility from -1 to 0 as per the FAQ. After that you roll those zero dice for agility plus the extra die for range.

I'm not so sure about this.

The FAQ doesn't mention anything about calculating agility, then zeroing it, if it's less than "0" before adding a die for Range 3. Actually, it doesn't mention anything about the Range 3 die, which doesn't really help this discussion.

The FAQ says increase or reduce a value until the calculation is complete, then apply the zero minimum if it's less than "0".

So the way I see it is: start at Agility "0", -1 for Wedge, +1 for Range 3 = "0" then check minimum of "0". Done.

The FAQ explicitly mentions agility as an exampe of a "value" to calculate.

Increasing and Reducing Values

When multiple card effects or abilities increase or reduce a value, such as

agility, ignore any “to a minimum of 0” restrictions until the calculation is

complete. For example, if a ship with a printed agility value of “0” and the

“Structural Damage” card uses “Countermeasures,” its agility is “0.”

Since Agillity is a value to be calculated, and range/obstacles do not affect agility, I don't se why you would not calculate agillity acording to the FAQ first, and then add any other modifiers that do not influence agillity.

I think we are probably going to require a FAQ on this.

I think we are probably going to require a FAQ on this.

Nah. It's pretty clear as written. Just in case though, here's an email reply from Frank.

Hello,

In response to your rules question:

Rule Question:

Hello! I have a quick question about calculating agility values with range. The FAQ says to calculate all changes by abilities and upgrades before finalizing the value. My question is if range bonuses come into play in this calculation process. The case for this is:

Decimator is at range 3 of an attacking ship. For whatever reason, whether it be that wedge is the attacking pilot, outmaneuver is on the attacking ship, or the decimator has a structural damage crit, the decimator's agility is being negatively effected. Is the decimator's agility then 0 (0 base value, -1 from crit/upgrade/ability, +1 from range 3) or is it 1 (0 base value, -1 from card effect, finish resolving cards so back up to 0, then +1 from range 3)? Thanks for your time!

The additional defense die granted from range does not increase the agility value of that ship, it is merely an additional defense die. Any effect that decreases a Decimator’s agility would only have an effect if there was another effect in play that was increasing its agility (such as Commander Kenkirk’s ability).

Thanks for playing!

Frank Brooks

Associate Creative Content Developer

Fantasy Flight Games

[email protected]

A FAQ on what??!!

We already have a FAQ ruling that explains how to modify agility. We know that the bonus die at range 3 doesn't come from agility. There isn't anything to FAQ.

I am quite firmly on the "extra die is not a result of agility modification" side. There are people who disagree. Until we get a FAQ ruling these people will not agree. So please don't jump down my throat.

I am quite firmly on the "extra die is not a result of agility modification" side. There are people who disagree. Until we get a FAQ ruling these people will not agree. So please don't jump down my throat.

I'm not actually seeing a whole lot of disagreement here. Parravon seems to be the main holdout, but I trust he'll come around

There are certainly contentious rules cases. This really isn't one of them. The rules are absolutely clear, without even the need to rely on precedent. If it needs an FAQ it's because people often miss the "Agility then dice" order of operations, not because a bunch of people refuse to accept it once it's explained.

Indeed. Hence why a FAQ is the only way to get them to agree.