We recently introduced some new members to our Dark Heresy group among friends who had been interested in playing for a while. And one of them expressed interest in creating a mutant dreg PC. Ruleswise it was possible (all we had to do was decide that he rolled 01 on the Divination table during character creation), he wanted the "Brute"-mutation so I let him have it. He had a pretty good vision of the character so I didnt see any harm in letting him have his way, although i made it abundantly clear that mutants and abhumans suffer from severe discrimination (if not persecution) on most Imperial worlds.

In the end he happily ended up with an ex-penal legionaire mutant guardsman (explosive collar still attached for obvious reasons). It seems he could also work in moderately social situations due to him having the brute-mutation which although causes several malformed musclegrowths on the body, it could be covered up with appropriate clothing.

Im curious if anyone else have had players expressing interests in creating mutant and/or abhuman PC's and how that have worked out? For normal games the rules certainly dont seem very designed with that in mind, but I wonder if it could be interesting to have some "official" rules for creating, lets say Ratling or Ogryn PC's? (the guy who wanted to create an abhuman earlier had in mind to create an Ogryn character, but I found it difficult rules wise so he had to settle with a brutish freak mutant instead)

Ratlings are easy to use as PC's since they are (in my view anyway) the most accepted form of "mutant" in the imperium...I would just use the stats for ratlings from 40K and WFRP to add and subtract from the appropriate characteristics...maybe come up with a few racial abilities such as Trade: Short order cook/Baker/Saucier. If you don't have access to Ratling stats for 40K or halflings in WHFR, basically just subtract 10 from strength and add 10 to dexterity. You may want to alter WP and Fel as well. Ogryns would be more difficult due to their size, fearsome appearance and extremely low Int...but it's up to the GM in the end; a good PC could make it work, just be carefull of inexperienced players from using a mutant. Good luck!

Sorry, please substitue Dex with Ag...I'm getting my systems crossed!

there is actually a pdf for free download at dark reign 40k . com it has all teh stats for blanks, ogryns, ratlings and another one but i cant remember what it was.

hope this helps

Official rules are underway. At least for a hive-born Mutant. The "radicals" handbook seems to have them. Or so the Design Diaries state.

Otherwise, I would be carefull about it. If one takes the Beast Slaver Ogryns from "DotdG" into account, Ogryns seem to be really really really heavy heavies. I would think thrice before I would allow something like this into my game under player control.

Here's a link to Darkreign40k, somebody posted there a PDF with rules for abhumans:

http://www.darkreign40k.com/downloads/career-paths/something-other-than-human-v1.1-/details.html

While Ogryns do have (and would have) low Int I remember reading about certain ones getting a special treatmeant called B.O.N.E or something in the Lexicanum so that they could lead squads of other Ogryn into battle (effectivly making an Ogryn Sergeant of sorts)

Ignayus said:

Latest Guard codex, it boosts the intelligence and tactial ability to that of an 8 year old child

Using the RT mutations page, I'd make a Ogyrn have the Mental Regressive and Brute or Hulking mutations, which work a little differently on the RT chart.

darkwerks said:

Those are mine. They're also available from the link in my signature, at least when my bandwidth isn't playing up.

Ogryns are awkward player characters, to say the least. Their physical prowess is immense, but their intellect and ability to contribute subtly or insightfully to an investigative game (or in any sort of confined space) is extremely limited, even with BONE'ead augmentation. The relative importance of those advantages and disadvantages depend on the kind of game being run - a combat-heavy game will see them thrive, but a low-key investigation will see them relegated to intimidating suspects, because they're awful at everything else.

having used N0-1_H3r3's excellent PDF regarding this particular subject matter, I have all 3 abhumans in my group of 12 Acolytes. (they are rotated and used based on the type of scenario and circumstance). i really haven't found any real problems.

the Ogryn is no doubt a powerhouse. easily able to shake and bake bodyblows with the best of them. this is offset not so much by his low Int but moreso by his size...he's tough to conceal (so stealth missions are out for the most part)...but he's also easier to hit (Hulking in size)...the Imperium doesn't have a huge problem with Ogryn (stable gene, very loyal and all)...those that have never seen one are shocked and appalled but the crew that surrounds him can give tough stares also. there have been a few incidents, coming off of the guncutter in a spaceport caused quite a fuss. in combat, he's built to take it and take it he does. he's the biggest badddest thing and he gets shot at... ALOT. he's usually the 1st thing enemy combatants want to take down. he learns much slower but will snag a few more Talents for his troubles. and theres not much that he can have in the way of updated kit. they don't make too many things Ogryn sized so everything he recieves come directly from the Inquisitor. and once when Ratty was able to swindle a Departmento Munitorum supply master and acquired some ill gotten ammo for his ripper gun and new Ogryn sized guard flak.

the Ratling suffers some serious problems in my campaign. much moreso than the Ogryn, they have stigma attached. Ogryns are at least useful for heavy labour and head busting. folks think they're all a bunch of shifty juvenile-sized hooligans, thieves and n'er do wells. the one in my campaign is the archetypical ex Guard sniper...but has a penchant for shady dealings, a fast tongue and a dodgy disposition.

the Squat is an easy one. except he gets nasty stares from the Mechanicus for his blaspheming.

ultimately its all how the characters are played and how the GM builds and fleshes out the world around them. i dont think the Ogryn is as tough to have in the party as others seem to think. he adds a certain charm. They all do. I appreciate the diversity of the group and the role play opportunities they bring to the table. Used in responsible hands, they work rather well.

from france

just a side question what happens if the explosive collar is hit?

another side question for your topics do you consider abhumans as stable mutant race or all mutant? because as a necormunda fan i remenber the zerg who are described as a stable race or a race in the way of stabilisation. of course unless a players want to play a mute caracter zerg are not a good option. but i thnik they are playable as henchman. which lead me to a last question is they are rules for this kind of "pets/henchman"?

8 spider

most explosives unless unstable have to be purposefully detonated. the explosive collars are initiated by way of a control signal. i would think these collars would be pretty durable for the purposes of combat situations. the odd one maybe detonating with some sort of overwhelming firepower.

yes abhumans are considered to be a stable mutation. and i haven't come across any rules for 'pets/henchmen'. i don't, however, think one would really need them for the inclusion of abhumans into your particular game unless your GM forbade it. the Inquisition has all sorts working as Acolytes even in official sources (see Inquisitor -Specialist Games) there are examples of mutants and xenos breeds working alongside others. of course this will rankle and cause friction amongst the more Puritan aspects of the organisation.

We have great fun with our Ogryn character. Normally he's an NPC or if we have a "guest" player i let them play the Ogryn. He gets into some really funny situations if the player hams up the "Ogryn" angle.

What about less obvious mutations? Pointed ears? Higher strength due to gravity of planet they were born on? alternate organ configuration/location?

aka, most 'aliens' in star trek since they look mostly human, with minor phsycial abberations, how common are these and how much are the players persecuted for these alterations?

If you look at the appearance tables for basic humans in DH just pure luck in dicerolls can provide you with some really strange looking characters. Considering this, I'd say the mutation is many times in the eye of the beholder. I'd say stuff that clearly looks ominous and intimidating (like strange bone protrusion in the skull or glowing red eyes) would gather bad-will and witch burning squads a lot faster than just plain strange (pointy ears, six digits etc.).

It's also worth noting the radical's hand book has a number of mutie starting options. No abhuman rules.

The DH mutie options are pathetic. I'll stick with the RT mutants.

HappyDaze said:

The Radical's Handbook haven't been released here yet. Would you care to explain the different options of the two?

You can choose two minor mutations from the DH mutation chart (which suck...) OR you can randomly roll one minor and one major mutation from the DH mutation charts (which still suck...) and lose 1 Fate Point (for the cherry of suck on top). I'd much rather take the Mutant choice from Tainted in RT's Origin Path and one of the mutations from that book for 200 xp, and this could easily be added as a Background Package for DH. Most of the RT Mutations are actually mechanically worthwhile compared to the baggage that comes from playing a mutant.

For examples of how the DH mutations suck:

Tough Hide: The RT version is twice as effective.

Feels No Pain: The RT version grants a Talent and five times the Wounds.

Brute: The RT version gives the same benefits with no Agility penalty.

Wyrdling: The RT version is twice as effective.

Since those three are the ones I see players most interested in, the DH mutation options come off as totally sh*tty in comparison.

HappyDaze said:

You do realize that DH and RT games are on two very different power levels and the mutation effects are tailored in each game to respective power level?

If you start to pick-n-choose the most powerfull game mechanic effects from RT and applying them to DH environment with no discretion the result is that you'll be handing out loads of overpoweredness... DH mutations are supposed to be minor effects that are NOT worth the baggage that comes with it. This is because the whole point of the DH is that no sane player would want to play a mutant for any other than purely the challenge of roleplaying one.

Many of the options in Radical's Handbook are overpowered, IMHO. However, since every one of them come with a neon arrow saying HERETIC , maybe they aren't so bad. I'm actually weighing the option of using RT mutations in light of the shift in power between Radicals and DH/IH-created characters.

Now that I pause to think on it, the Inquisitor's Handbook origins were a little overblown as well.

Polaria said:

I have realized that they have largely failed in making them seamlessly compatible. Since I only view DH products as potential resources for RT, I don't really care too much about DH's supposed power level (which can actually exceed RT since there are so many 100 xp Skill and Talent advances even in upper Ranks).