My group are veteran role players but are new to AoR, having played through the beginner game we all found it a little too straightforward for our tastes. We're used to a bit more detail and complexity so I was wondering if the beginner game was (for want of a better phrase) dumbed down when compared to the full rules?

Specific areas we wondered about were:

Movement - is it always based on the range bands or do you get an actual movement allowance? It seems in this game doddering old C3PO would be able to move as fast as your average commando.

Crits - are there really only 4? It really takes the edge of getting or inflicting a crit if you know the first one will always be strain, the next will always be one setback dice...

Death - If a player has more wounds than their threshold are they dead or just unconscious, if only unconscious what does it take to actually kill a player?

Destiny - We may have been doing this wrong but any time I flipped a destiny token to boost my roll, the players immediately flipped one to improve theirs too, kind of negated the effect of destiny if your opponent instantly matches it. Maybe we missed something?

Cheers

Short answer, yeah it gets more complex.

Movement: this is more of a complex issue.

- Maneuvers in combat: strain can play a role here, since characters with a higher strain threshold could be considered more maneuverable. Also, since combat rounds can last up to a minute, a maneuver to "move" is less "distance moved" than "something significant you did." So while 3PO might shuffle his way across the battlefield, waving his arms in a panicked way, the commando would be more wisely proceeding in a careful manner, perhaps finding cover where he could.

- Athletics: your athletics skill can determine how fast you are, so if you're trying to get somewhere in a hurry there's no better way than to make an Athletics check. So in a race, the commando would mop the floor with 3PO.

Crits: nope, there's a chart. Roll a d100, add modifiers from previous crits and other effects (weapon qualities, talents). The real nasty crits are at 100+. Death comes from a Crit at 150+.

Destiny: it doesn't really negate anything. Triumphs and Despairs don't cancel each other, so it really just allows for more potential for interesting things to happen. That being said, the Destiny Points only "flip" to the other side once the action is resolved, so the players can't flip the same DP that the GM flipped...if they have no other DPs, they are SOL.

Cheers for the reply, good point on how more strain can effectively make you more more maneuverable, I hadn't considered that. Also glad to hear there's more to crits, especially that there are really nasty ones!

Speaking of Triumph/Despair (and similarly Advantage/Threat), I found I rapidly ran out of inspiration for good or bad side effects and found myself falling back on gain/lose strain or give/receive boost dice which got boring quickly. Anyone got suggestions on what else to throw in, I appreciate this is very much situation dependent but any pointers would be handy!

Regarding Death:

If a character has more wounds than his threshold he is merely unconscious, not dead. Exceeding the wound threshold inflicts an immediate Critical Injury and renders the character unconscious (or otherwise inactive); but it doesn't kill him.

As was said, to actually die requires rolling very high on the Critical Injury table. A roll of 131+ can potentially kill, and a roll of 151+ kills the victim instantly. The dice themselves obviously only go up to 100; but there are modifiers that can push the result much higher. In particular, each untreated Critical Injury the character possesses adds +10 to future Critical Injuries rolls, so they tend to get worse and worse.

Regarding Destiny Points:

Speaking of Triumph/Despair (and similarly Advantage/Threat), I found I rapidly ran out of inspiration for good or bad side effects and found myself falling back on gain/lose strain or give/receive boost dice which got boring quickly. Anyone got suggestions on what else to throw in, I appreciate this is very much situation dependent but any pointers would be handy!

I had this early on too, but you'll grow into it. When you plan your adventures and the challenges in them, think up a few Advantage/Threat results at different levels ahead of time. If somebody is slicing a computer, Advantages might give extra information, while Threat might trigger an alarm somewhere (unheard by the PCs). Once you've done a few adventures pre-planned, you'll be better able to think of them on the fly. Also, the published adventures, especially Beyond the Rim, have some really good examples of how to use these narrative resources.

In the meantime, throwing around boost and setback dice, and upgrades to proficiency and difficulty, is always very useful. The trick is to provide a narrative reason for it so you and the players can visualize the effect. It's helpful to take a moment to spell it out, that way the players contributing the dice feel like they did something. Example from a game: two players were shooting at some Trandoshans huddled behind a crate, both missed but with plenty of advantages. They each passed boost dice to the main shooter in the group (and also recovered some much needed strain). The main shooter then proceeds to aim twice (2 more boost dice) so had a huge handful of dice to roll. Result was 4 successes and 9 advantage, which was enough to kill 1 minion outright, and do three more crits (3A each crit--crits kill minions automatically). Narratively this was described as the previous shooters driving the minions into a cluster (splinters of the crate flying everywhere) and the main shooter taking down the tightened (frightened) group.

For small amounts of threat and advantage, Strain is a useful currency both in and out of combat. Slicing a computer? Electronic feedback shocks you. Talking to a Hutt? Beads of sweat roll down your forehead...etc. Triumph and Despair are often easier because they're more dramatic, plus the players often have a good idea what they want...I've had players find a stash of spice while doing a mechanics check. But usually, if the situation is dramatic enough already, the result is easier to handle because it flow naturally from the conditions. Example from a game: PC was negotiating over comm with a crime lord who'd invaded his apartment on Coruscant and found his girlfriend. PC was flying by speeder back to his apartment when the negotiation went bad: he got a Triumph, but also failed with a Despair. Crime lord says something like "it's a shame to waste such a pretty face" and throws girlfriend off the building. Triumph means the PC is closer than he thought he was, and sees her body falling. Then the race begins to pick her up before she hits the ground...

tl;dr you'll get better at it

Because it wasn't really answered, no, the full game doesn't do away with range bands in favor of measurement or movement allowances. Like everything else in the game, the narrative is more important than the details. Thus, a character being at Medium range and moving into Short so he or she can fire their blaster on stun is more important than measuring their exact placement.

This plays partly into how advantages+ are uses. You can use advantages to describe environmental effects such as additional cover or other atmospheric details that you just can't get away with if you are measuring and describing everything exactly. One example I remember hearing regarding threats and despair was the missing bridge/swing scene in New Hope. Things like that can happen with despairs (and probably threats), which ties back into the whole abstraction of range and movement. It's not important where things are, so long as they are there when it is important.

Think of it like a movie. Yes, it's established that R2-D2 is slow. So the droid is always behind everyone else in every scene we see. But between scenes, there is a crew that stops the camera, picks up the droid and puts it back in the scene. This game tries to emulate that speed doesn't matter in the dramatics of a scene. That being said, the chase scenes can easily be made so a droids speed comes into place because the GM can call for skill rolls and then how many droids are going to have skills that involve running or coordination?

Speaking of Triumph/Despair (and similarly Advantage/Threat), I found I rapidly ran out of inspiration for good or bad side effects and found myself falling back on gain/lose strain or give/receive boost dice which got boring quickly. Anyone got suggestions on what else to throw in, I appreciate this is very much situation dependent but any pointers would be handy!

Easy - ask your players! Let EVERYONE be creative, both good and bad. Let them tell you how awesome they are. Let them go "oooh, I know what happens!" for the despair. This is a collaborative story - let everyone collaborate on the results.

(I even let them chose the difficulty sometimes. "The faster you pick that lock, the harder it will be - how many purples will you try and get it done in?"

(I even let them chose the difficulty sometimes. "The faster you pick that lock, the harder it will be - how many purples will you try and get it done in?"

That sounds more like setback dice to me. Then some of those talents might kick in.

You basically get better at using the dice creatively once you play more and get more comfortable with the system.

Also, remember that the rules are such thatthe GM chooses how to spend PC disadvantage and despair. PCs spend their triumph and success. And the opposite can also be true.

Basically if your PCs roll a Triumph the thing you say is ''what you going to do with that?"

The same goes with Despairs really. If I as a GM can come up with something awesome for a despair then great, but more often then not the players can come up with something cooler. Their often harder on themselves then I'd be. In our group players are usually freely coming up with alternative suggestions as I ponder what to do, and quite often I'll go with those.

I have mentioned this elsewhere: The cinematic career Han Solo has more to do with the interplay of Advantage/Triumph than Successes.

Dumping Boba Fett into the sarlaac being a great example.

I have mentioned this elsewhere: The cinematic career Han Solo has more to do with the interplay of Advantage/Triumph than Successes.

Dumping Boba Fett into the sarlaac being a great example.

New talent: Corellian Luck (Ranked)

Roll 1 Force die per rank as an incidental before every action. White pips add Advantage to the check, and black pips add Threat.

:-D

I have mentioned this elsewhere: The cinematic career Han Solo has more to do with the interplay of Advantage/Triumph than Successes.

Dumping Boba Fett into the sarlaac being a great example.

New talent: Corellian Luck (Ranked)

Roll 1 Force die per rank as an incidental before every action. White pips add Advantage to the check, and black pips add Threat.

:-D

It's not my fault... IT'S NOT MY FAULT!