I can't wait for prequel ships. And if there is one thing I've learned about Star Wars, it will come out.

Not as long as Disney own it they have put an end to any prequel project from here on out.

Hobo I have called you out on this several times already. Ive given several examples of prequel or clone war related material that has come out post disney takeover.

Disney HAS focused more on the OT era because of Rebels and the new movies, but they dont have some aversion to the prequel era that makes it completely untouchable.

And i and other's have passed on the information that stuff already in production were allowed to finish and be released be it books or toys or whatever because money had already been sunk into them.

They know the prequels are not well though of in general and that's why they are ignoring them in favour of the OT.

Also i don't recognize your name was it on an alternate account or something? i really don't know you off the top of my head.

Actually I would have to say that IMO Battle of Coruscant in the opening of RotS was better than any OT space battle. Too bad the movie was awful.

With the exception of the missile robot things vs conventional missiles. That scene just infuriated me for 2 reasons. There is no single reason why you would choose this over a conventional explosion of energy. The jedis seemed to forget about the force and resorted to crashing their delicate ships together in the cold vacuum of space.

I feel the OT battles delivered more emotion. At Yavin, you experience Wedge's awe at the size of the DS, you felt the loss of Biggs and you hear the defeat in Garven's voice when delivering his final orders. At Endor, we see Ackbar's hesitation at losing his men against achieving victory.

Even Nein Numb's rubbery cosmetic face delivered more emotion when the Falcon burst from the DS than the actors in RotS.

But emotion aside, the RotS battle was visually amazing.

I have very little problem with the world of the Epidoes I-III. Most of the vehicles, droids and troopers are really cool. Eppisode I-III were missing story, plot, character development. There are a few things from these episodes that I really hate.

I think the one key take-away we can ALL agree on, I'm sure, is that...

John Williams is ******* AWESOME! Like, seriously, a master of cinematic audio!

From the main Star Wars theme (still iconic and "fresh" sounding 40 years on!) to 'The Imperial March', 'The Asteroid Field', the 'Throne Room' pieces, Emperor's theme, 'Battle of Endor', to 'Dual of the Fates', the 'Revenge of the Sith' theme (actually, hell, that entire soundtrack is a masterpiece), etc...

He MAKES the setting.

Not to mention Raiders Jaws Superman (1970s) yea John Williams is the man

Not to mention Raiders Jaws Superman (1970s) yea John Williams is the man

I'm happy to hear they tapped him for Episode VII.

I figure...no matter how badly JJ manages to mess it up, John Williams will still be able to knock out SOME kind of iconic theme for it, so...we'll have that, anyway!

Prequel stuff is growing on me.

hear me out...

... ... ...

I KNOW prequel stuff has a snowballs chance of being made but i no longer hate the idea

Never though i'd say that.

I don't get your anti-rebellion point, American was founded on rebellion. Small bands of armed rebels striking out against the Empire is our history, even if we have become just another empire today.

Im not being anti american when i say this next bit, i may not agree with American foreign policy lately (post WWII tbh )) but other than that I think it's a fantastic country that *could* be doing some amazing things in this world (you do a fair few amazing things but you actually have the resources to solve problems in ways that dont involve dropping bombs on things)... and trust me we brits are as bad so im not American bashing i think both our governments need a massive overhaul.

But.... if you dig into the history *behind* the propaganda the 'revolutionary' war has very shady origins and some *really* lucky breaks.

Lets just say it was more about organised crime than tax representation. Smugglers were outraged that British tea was cheaper than the tea they were smuggling in... *thats why it all got tipped in the sea'.

I heard a fantastic lecture about the real story behind the revolutionary war by an American historian some time ago and like all wars of antiquity the truth gets glossed over.. legends get born (even more so when you need them to create a nation state) and it becomes some epic crusade against tyranny and a 'mighty' empire. Most people conveniently forget that at the time the American continent wasnt industrialised and not seen as particularly important to the UK whereas in Europe all hell was breaking loose and we were very worried about the French on our doorstep, wars in Austria and the german states etc so only sent reserve and second line regiments to the states.

Its all ancient history now but its worth remembering that *militarily* the war didnt fo well for the USA. By december 1776 the support was waning, Washington was worried and it was Trenton that really swung it. Depsite being warned by scouts and American royalists that the frozen river would be crossed Johan Rall and 1400 German (well hessian, germany didnt exist as a country then) mercenaries did nothng and got slaughtered. A well needed win and pr victory.. perhaps your 'dieppe'.

Like i say im not american bashing. Im an internationalist. If im pushed on the issue I'm welsh, i've no great love of the English (despite having been a soldier for the crown) but i dont hate them. I just think its important to look at history objectively and not through glossy jingoistic terms.

I think the original point is quite valid. The US and UK *are* the 'empire' of the real world... like the 'galactic empire' we offer 'peace and stability' , as long as you do things the way we want and we can control the flow of resources

Just relating briefly to the sword fighting style point, I've done precious little actual sword fighting other than some choreographed stuff for the stage but I would have thought complaints about weight and momentum of swords that are... what... a handle and a tube of light/plasma whatever are a little off.

These weapons are presumably feather light (pardon something approaching a pun) and if one can casually lop off someones arm at the shoulder without more than a wrist flick then why risk getting yourself dangerously open to the riposte (which might casually lop your arm off at the shoulder with the flick of a wrist...) with weight to your stroke or momentum that might leave you off balance

If you look at some of the featurettes LFL did , George wanted the actual handle/sabre to be incredibly heavy.

Thats why in ANH vader and kenobi fight two handed.

He wanted it to look a bit japanese (being inspired by samurai films) but as katana's are clearly used one handed at times he made it look a bit different by giving the lightsabre a two handed grip, its supposed to take a lot of strength or a lot of force power to use.

Later on in bespin and on the second death star you see luke and vader use some one handed moves. This was partly becuase they got better at making sword fights work and partly because luke has grown in power to be able to handle one handed moves.

Anyway i paraphrase a documentary 'mini feature' on lightsabres in the redone cgi OT trilogy box set

Given lucas changes his mind on a daily basis, its just as likely next week we'll be told luke uses a one handed move because he had a splinter in his pinkie that day.

Just relating briefly to the sword fighting style point, I've done precious little actual sword fighting other than some choreographed stuff for the stage but I would have thought complaints about weight and momentum of swords that are... what... a handle and a tube of light/plasma whatever are a little off.

These weapons are presumably feather light (pardon something approaching a pun) and if one can casually lop off someones arm at the shoulder without more than a wrist flick then why risk getting yourself dangerously open to the riposte (which might casually lop your arm off at the shoulder with the flick of a wrist...) with weight to your stroke or momentum that might leave you off balance

I've done very little with real swords other than some very blunt sword fighting (no edge on them at all) and they are pigs to swing and recover a swings from (cavalry style swords with basket hilts), so when i've done larp events i've got really annoyed when 'roleplayers' swing 1kg late swords around like they are feathers wheras im trying to pretend its a hefty chunk of metal!

You get some people soing larp sword play who think they are zorro and you think 'if that was real steel i'd have bludgeoned you to death with the hilt by now!'

I don't get your anti-rebellion point, American was founded on rebellion. Small bands of armed rebels striking out against the Empire is our history, even if we have become just another empire today.

Im not being anti american when i say this next bit, i may not agree with American foreign policy lately (post WWII tbh )) but other than that I think it's a fantastic country that *could* be doing some amazing things in this world (you do a fair few amazing things but you actually have the resources to solve problems in ways that dont involve dropping bombs on things)... and trust me we brits are as bad so im not American bashing i think both our governments need a massive overhaul.

But.... if you dig into the history *behind* the propaganda the 'revolutionary' war has very shady origins and some *really* lucky breaks.

Lets just say it was more about organised crime than tax representation. Smugglers were outraged that British tea was cheaper than the tea they were smuggling in... *thats why it all got tipped in the sea'.

I heard a fantastic lecture about the real story behind the revolutionary war by an American historian some time ago and like all wars of antiquity the truth gets glossed over.. legends get born (even more so when you need them to create a nation state) and it becomes some epic crusade against tyranny and a 'mighty' empire. Most people conveniently forget that at the time the American continent wasnt industrialised and not seen as particularly important to the UK whereas in Europe all hell was breaking loose and we were very worried about the French on our doorstep, wars in Austria and the german states etc so only sent reserve and second line regiments to the states.

Its all ancient history now but its worth remembering that *militarily* the war didnt fo well for the USA. By december 1776 the support was waning, Washington was worried and it was Trenton that really swung it. Depsite being warned by scouts and American royalists that the frozen river would be crossed Johan Rall and 1400 German (well hessian, germany didnt exist as a country then) mercenaries did nothng and got slaughtered. A well needed win and pr victory.. perhaps your 'dieppe'.

Like i say im not american bashing. Im an internationalist. If im pushed on the issue I'm welsh, i've no great love of the English (despite having been a soldier for the crown) but i dont hate them. I just think its important to look at history objectively and not through glossy jingoistic terms.

I think the original point is quite valid. The US and UK *are* the 'empire' of the real world... like the 'galactic empire' we offer 'peace and stability' , as long as you do things the way we want and we can control the flow of resources

I agree, and don't get me wrong, I'm not really pro or anti American either, hell I'm more of an anarchist than anything really (I loves me some Crass and lots of 80's UK punk). I'm just pointing out the mind set of cinema goers when ANH came out, at least according to Lucas in a number of documentaries (I was 3 at the time so what do I really know). I think it's important to remember that when you're criticizing the TO for it's good vs evil themes.

I don't get your anti-rebellion point, American was founded on rebellion. Small bands of armed rebels striking out against the Empire is our history, even if we have become just another empire today.

Im not being anti american when i say this next bit, i may not agree with American foreign policy lately (post WWII tbh )) but other than that I think it's a fantastic country that *could* be doing some amazing things in this world (you do a fair few amazing things but you actually have the resources to solve problems in ways that dont involve dropping bombs on things)... and trust me we brits are as bad so im not American bashing i think both our governments need a massive overhaul.

But.... if you dig into the history *behind* the propaganda the 'revolutionary' war has very shady origins and some *really* lucky breaks.

Lets just say it was more about organised crime than tax representation. Smugglers were outraged that British tea was cheaper than the tea they were smuggling in... *thats why it all got tipped in the sea'.

I heard a fantastic lecture about the real story behind the revolutionary war by an American historian some time ago and like all wars of antiquity the truth gets glossed over.. legends get born (even more so when you need them to create a nation state) and it becomes some epic crusade against tyranny and a 'mighty' empire. Most people conveniently forget that at the time the American continent wasnt industrialised and not seen as particularly important to the UK whereas in Europe all hell was breaking loose and we were very worried about the French on our doorstep, wars in Austria and the german states etc so only sent reserve and second line regiments to the states.

Its all ancient history now but its worth remembering that *militarily* the war didnt fo well for the USA. By december 1776 the support was waning, Washington was worried and it was Trenton that really swung it. Depsite being warned by scouts and American royalists that the frozen river would be crossed Johan Rall and 1400 German (well hessian, germany didnt exist as a country then) mercenaries did nothng and got slaughtered. A well needed win and pr victory.. perhaps your 'dieppe'.

Like i say im not american bashing. Im an internationalist. If im pushed on the issue I'm welsh, i've no great love of the English (despite having been a soldier for the crown) but i dont hate them. I just think its important to look at history objectively and not through glossy jingoistic terms.

I think the original point is quite valid. The US and UK *are* the 'empire' of the real world... like the 'galactic empire' we offer 'peace and stability' , as long as you do things the way we want and we can control the flow of resources

I don't mean to be rude or offend you, but the Welsh are the original Brits, the Britons.

Both our governments definitely need an overhaul and removal of all the socialist power creep.

Actually I would have to say that IMO Battle of Coruscant in the opening of RotS was better than any OT space battle. Too bad the movie was awful.

The background was amazing...

the 5 minutes spent with the stupid buzzdroids and the bad dialog ruined it for me....

nothing beats Lando and Wedge flying around in the Battle of Endor taking out TIEs

Oh no you're not offending me at all.

I know that.

With the Roman invasion of the British isles (what was it 45 or 52bc, i cant recall, their was a scouting invasion then the real one) the tribes that were smart enough went to the hills or the extremities

(the welsh went west, the cornish right to the end, the picts etc went north and are part of the scots and the irish had an influx of refugees then too. a lot of us were in tribes that spanned the channel so you get similarities there)

The welsh, irish, cornish and scots are genetically more 'british' then half the people waving around Sr georges flags (he was greek by the way). Its not just the romans who had a hard time assimilating those tribes though. All those picturesque castles on the welsh border were built to keep up from raiding central england long after the romans had upped sticks.

(im pretty sure that is why you get a very common genetic type of 'tall, thin, red beard, fair hair' in scotland, ireland and wales from that common pre roman stock)

Most 'english' are part viking, part danish/norman (the normans were actually danes not 'french') and part german. The irony is that the British and the Americans are truly mongrel races (on your part my US pals, being spanish treasure hunters, germans, persecuted religious english folk, poles and jews for your basic 'stock', before we even consider the indigenous tribes who were pretty much massacred... i guess a bit of that still mixs into the genepool)

I say I'm 'welsh' , all my living family are and i've married into a welsh family but my fathers descent is Danish/Norman. The 'Harveys' were on the same boat as William the Conqueror .... but like i say I'd love it if we were all a bit more international.

If we keep dragging up old grievances, old wars, not letting people worship whatever god/devil/fairy/tree/goblin they like (as long as its not hurting anyone else) we're just going to end up wiping ourselves out eventually... whether its a war about whose made up deity is the best or a war over oil... gotta stop shooting each other really.

Oh no you're not offending me at all.

I know that.

With the Roman invasion of the British isles (what was it 45 or 52bc, i cant recall, their was a scouting invasion then the real one) the tribes that were smart enough went to the hills or the extremities

(the welsh went west, the cornish right to the end, the picts etc went north and are part of the scots and the irish had an influx of refugees then too. a lot of us were in tribes that spanned the channel so you get similarities there)

The welsh, irish, cornish and scots are genetically more 'british' then half the people waving around Sr georges flags (he was greek by the way). Its not just the romans who had a hard time assimilating those tribes though. All those picturesque castles on the welsh border were built to keep up from raiding central england long after the romans had upped sticks.

Most 'english' are part viking, part danish/norman (the normans were actually danes not 'french') and part german. The irony is that the British and the Americans are truly mongrel races (on your part my US pals, being spanish treasure hunters, germans, persecuted religious english folk, poles and jews for your basic 'stock', before we even consider the indigenous tribes who were pretty much massacred... i guess a bit of that still mixs into the genepool)

I say I'm 'welsh' , all my living family are and i've married into a welsh family but my fathers descent in Danish/Norman. The 'Harveys' were on the same boat as William the Conqueror.... but like i say I'd love it if we were all a bit more international.

If we keep dragging up old grievances, old wars, not letting people worship whatever god/devil/fairy/tree/goblin they like (as long as its not hurting anyone else) we're just going to end up wiping ourselves out eventually... whether its a war about whose made up deity is the best or a war over oil... gotta stop shooting each other really.

I kinda hope that 1/8 part of me that's British is Anglo-Saxon myself .

Just be happy to be an American, its a pretty cool thing to be.

I always find it odd when some guys in the states go 'im irish' , yet they have never been within three thousand miles of the place and would probably be pretty unimpressed if they did go there.

Having a great, great, great grandad who left ireland in 1770 doesnt make you any more irish than i am for having a pint of guiness and living next to a scuffy murphys pub for a while

Just be happy to be an American, its a pretty cool thing to be.

I always find it odd when some guys in the states go 'im irish' , yet they have never been within three thousand miles of the place and would probably be pretty unimpressed if they did go there.

Having a great, great, great grandad who left ireland in 1770 doesnt make you any more irish than i am for having a pint of guiness and living next to a scuffy murphys pub for a while

Well I'm 1/4 Irish, and I've probably been within 3000 miles, but point taken, it's mostly bragging rights .

EDIT: And I should mention I do want to go to all my "home" countries. (England, Ireland, Germany, Slovenia, Italy (already been there)). It's funny say I'm Slovenian and people go it's Slovakia genius.

Go to Belfast for a while... see how much those bragging rights are worth afterwards.

In fairness the Belfast i trained for was a warzone.. its apparently quite nice now

Just be happy to be an American, its a pretty cool thing to be.

I always find it odd when some guys in the states go 'im irish' , yet they have never been within three thousand miles of the place and would probably be pretty unimpressed if they did go there.

Having a great, great, great grandad who left ireland in 1770 doesnt make you any more irish than i am for having a pint of guiness and living next to a scuffy murphys pub for a while

Well I'm 1/4 Irish, and I've probably been within 3000 miles, but point taken, it's mostly bragging rights .

EDIT: And I should mention I do want to go to all my "home" countries. (England, Ireland, Germany, Slovenia, Italy (already been there)). It's funny say I'm Slovenian and people go it's Slovakia genius.

i'd move to Germany tomorrow if i could. I could do my job from overseas.. regrettably the wifes job ties her to the UK. I adore Berlin. Italy i quite liked (did some archeology at pompeii for a summer when i was a student).... England is overated.

we've all got like bad teeth and drink tea and have funny accents... surely you know that?

Go to Belfast for a while... see how much those bragging rights are worth afterwards.

In fairness the Belfast i trained for was a warzone.. its apparently quite nice now

Except on a Sunday morning when they have those flaming loudspeakers blaring out prayers I liked Ireland, still not 100% sure on what the meatcake is they sold in the local chipie was though.

We English never lose even when conqured we just absorb the invaders into our mongrel society, but bad and empire like as we are at least we arnt French!

Go to Belfast for a while... see how much those bragging rights are worth afterwards.

In fairness the Belfast i trained for was a warzone.. its apparently quite nice now

Except on a Sunday morning when they have those flaming loudspeakers blaring out prayers I liked Ireland, still not 100% sure on what the meatcake is they sold in the local chipie was though.

We English never lose even when conqured we just absorb the invaders into our mongrel society, but bad and empire like as we are at least we arnt French!

There was Bruce at Bannockburn.....

Go to Belfast for a while... see how much those bragging rights are worth afterwards.

In fairness the Belfast i trained for was a warzone.. its apparently quite nice now

Except on a Sunday morning when they have those flaming loudspeakers blaring out prayers I liked Ireland, still not 100% sure on what the meatcake is they sold in the local chipie was though.

We English never lose even when conqured we just absorb the invaders into our mongrel society, but bad and empire like as we are at least we arnt French!

I think i've told this tale before but anyway...

a good mate of mine is an officer in the USAF and when we were drunk one night i jokingly said to him... 'Jon, you know the best thing about being British? It's that we've never lost a war'

And he said 'what about the revolutionary war?'

And i said, 'Jon, you misunderstand, that was a civil disagreement between two groups of english people, until one group had one and *legally* became Americans in the eyes of the worls the war was actually more of a police action and an internal issue rather than a war'

'yeah, i suppose you're right' he said.

(btw we were both drunk and joking with each other, neither of us actually considers that a totally accurate historical appraisal although there is an *element* of truth in it. Consider that rebellions and mutinies that *don't* succeed are rarely called wars and the dissatified 'rebels' rarely considered to be a seperate country.... do you guys consider the CSA to have been a seperate nation btw or just rebel states?)

1/4 this, 1/8th that, 2 cups of salt, a pinch of paprika and a spoonful of purple. Blah blah blah.

Where were you born? What nationality do you identify with? 9 times out of 10 it's the same answer. This is your nationality.

Having said this, I believe it would be marvelous for us all to embrace the bigger picture. The world is getting smaller and we are slowly reaching further and further into the universe. Maybe it's time we erased some borders and simply became Earth. I know there are a thousand and one reasons why it will never happen .. but it'd be nice right?

I don't get your anti-rebellion point, American was founded on rebellion. Small bands of armed rebels striking out against the Empire is our history, even if we have become just another empire today.

Im not being anti american when i say this next bit, i may not agree with American foreign policy lately (post WWII tbh )) but other than that I think it's a fantastic country that *could* be doing some amazing things in this world (you do a fair few amazing things but you actually have the resources to solve problems in ways that dont involve dropping bombs on things)... and trust me we brits are as bad so im not American bashing i think both our governments need a massive overhaul.

But.... if you dig into the history *behind* the propaganda the 'revolutionary' war has very shady origins and some *really* lucky breaks.

Lets just say it was more about organised crime than tax representation. Smugglers were outraged that British tea was cheaper than the tea they were smuggling in... *thats why it all got tipped in the sea'.

I heard a fantastic lecture about the real story behind the revolutionary war by an American historian some time ago and like all wars of antiquity the truth gets glossed over.. legends get born (even more so when you need them to create a nation state) and it becomes some epic crusade against tyranny and a 'mighty' empire. Most people conveniently forget that at the time the American continent wasnt industrialised and not seen as particularly important to the UK whereas in Europe all hell was breaking loose and we were very worried about the French on our doorstep, wars in Austria and the german states etc so only sent reserve and second line regiments to the states.

Its all ancient history now but its worth remembering that *militarily* the war didnt fo well for the USA. By december 1776 the support was waning, Washington was worried and it was Trenton that really swung it. Depsite being warned by scouts and American royalists that the frozen river would be crossed Johan Rall and 1400 German (well hessian, germany didnt exist as a country then) mercenaries did nothng and got slaughtered. A well needed win and pr victory.. perhaps your 'dieppe'.

Like i say im not american bashing. Im an internationalist. If im pushed on the issue I'm welsh, i've no great love of the English (despite having been a soldier for the crown) but i dont hate them. I just think its important to look at history objectively and not through glossy jingoistic terms.

I think the original point is quite valid. The US and UK *are* the 'empire' of the real world... like the 'galactic empire' we offer 'peace and stability' , as long as you do things the way we want and we can control the flow of resources

Thanks Gadge for being more eloquent than I. =)

1/4 this, 1/8th that, 2 cups of salt, a pinch of paprika and a spoonful of purple. Blah blah blah.

Where were you born? What nationality do you identify with? 9 times out of 10 it's the same answer. This is your nationality.

Having said this, I believe it would be marvelous for us all to embrace the bigger picture. The world is getting smaller and we are slowly reaching further and further into the universe. Maybe it's time we erased some borders and simply became Earth. I know there are a thousand and one reasons why it will never happen .. but it'd be nice right?

I'd like to see Europe stop arguing about petty rubbish and be *europeans* and that would be a start, then the developed world could stop allowing about 2 per cent of it to own 70 to 90 per cent of the wealth...that would be a start

Never gonna happen though.

Some people would rather watch the world implode while sitting on a pile of cash than spend any of it saving it.