Title says it all: there should be a bar on row 5 to connect Dedication to the Shien line.

Title says it all: there should be a bar on row 5 to connect Dedication to the Shien line.

I'm going to have to check my book against the errata when I get home but you'd think that wouldn't be the sort of thing the people who should be diagraming the updates would miss. :-)

Mmm, I can see why they did it that way. I can see them keeping it that way and making someone have to buy into Djem So to get the Dedication talent.

Concerning linking the two halves together; not sure I'd agree with "buy down one "path" of Form V and get access to the best talents of the other focus" but I also don't see a way around it without having two Dedications in the tree.

We'll see what they say/do in the coming weeks...or maybe we won't find out for another 8 months.

I kind of like it, actually. Which of Shien and Djem So are more focused on your personal attributes? I would say Djem So has the edge as the form that cares about brute force taking control of the fight and is rather unconcerned with what the opponent does.

Before this, I had thought there wasn't enough separating djem so from shien sides of the tree, as only djem so deflection and falling avalanche seem djem so rather than shien to me.

Yet then there's no reason to go down the Shien line. You're going to have buyer's remorse if you get down to the bottom of it with neither Dedication nor +FR to show for it. The bottom talents don't even seem to be worth the cost -- just pick up the top Reflect so you can trigger Deflection and move on to another spec once you've got Dedication.

I disagree. Disruptive Strike seems incredibly powerful to me. Giving an opponent failures at no extra cost of actions or strain? Incredibly powerful. Improved and Supreme Reflect are great buys as well.

However, for a pure Djem So user, I can certainly see skipping out on them.

Disruptive Strike is good. I doubt it's 75XP good, though. You can get +1FR from Artisan for that.

Supreme Reflect is too situational for an even greater cost.

I personally, as I made vocal before, don't like Djem So Deflection because it feels too Shien so of course I could see some rework of the tree.

I think 2 dedications on the tree might be a bit much, but I don't think those two halfs of the tree should be connected either. Perhaps the tree could fit in a Force Rating? The shadow tree happens to have both, why not this one? Perhaps dropping one of the tree's reflects for it? Djem So 's half only has 2 parries for example.

I think 2 dedications on the tree might be a bit much, but I don't think those two halfs of the tree should be connected either. Perhaps the tree could fit in a Force Rating? The shadow tree happens to have both, why not this one? Perhaps dropping one of the tree's reflects for it? Djem So 's half only has 2 parries for example.

The specializations that have both Dedication and Force Rating are generally not associated with being able to use a lightsaber. Niman Disicple is the exception, having both talents, because the lore behind it has it be much more of a Force-focused Form than the other five.

Supreme Reflect is somewhat situational, but if you know you're going to be the target of a whole lot of blaster fire and don't have a lot of options to boost your attackers' difficulties on their combat checks, reducing the strain cost of Reflect down to 1 is going to help keep you from exceeding your Strain Threshold in only a couple of rounds.

DarthGM's got a point that adding a connecting point between Dedication and Disruptive Strike makes it too easy for a PC focusing on just one side to "cherry pick" the good talents from the other side. For a PC focused on the Shien side, being able to skip over to Djem So Deflection is pretty sweet.

The specializations that have both Dedication and Force Rating are generally not associated with being able to use a lightsaber. Niman Disicple is the exception, having both talents, because the lore behind it has it be much more of a Force-focused Form than the other five.

DarthGM's got a point that adding a connecting point between Dedication and Disruptive Strike makes it too easy for a PC focusing on just one side to "cherry pick" the good talents from the other side. For a PC focused on the Shien side, being able to skip over to Djem So Deflection is pretty sweet.

What about putting 2 dedications into the tree and not connecting them? Seems to me that would be the thing to do, since its basically like they're 2 trees as is.

That would make it the most overpowered specialization in the game to date.

And largely I am just speculating on different potential changes that would address the ops issues.

Absent a total re-work of the tree (unlikely) or including two Dedications (even less likely), the least they could do is to connect Row 2. That would make it a little less insulting. "That's only 5 points!" Like I said, it's the least.

it wouldn't be any different from having access to another specialization that has dedication as a capstone

it wouldn't be any different from having access to another specialization that has dedication as a capstone

Multispecialization cost. Depending on how many trees you spec into (and if its cross-career) you could functionally be getting that dedication for free. Also the part where specializations work best if you take the whole thing.

Absent a total re-work of the tree (unlikely) or including two Dedications (even less likely), the least they could do is to connect Row 2. That would make it a little less insulting. "That's only 5 points!" Like I said, it's the least.

Yeah, I could see a connection between the two halves at Row 2, particularly as the Djem So side does have a talent that requires a Lightsaber (Cunning) check.