I'm just really sad they lost the command ship, it looked pretty badass. Like a beefed up CR90 mixed with the back half of a Venator cruiser.

it was a modified Pelta-class frigate (the medical frigates we see the Republic using a couple of times during The Clone Wars)

Thank you, totally going to be using that in my game.

I felt the S2 E1 was good, think about it this way too, Vader and the Emperor are not concerned with the Rebels, they want the Jedi as they are the real threat to their control of the galaxy. As the saying goes "This Death Star is nothing compared to the power of the FORCE!" which equals = Jedi or Sith

The crew did look for a tracker on the ship, Zeb was told to scan for them right after they left the capitol with the shuttle. They then went ahead to Lando's "FARM" and made some bogies to foul up the Empires scanners on the capital ships.

The crew is very head strong in dealing with the Empire too, so they did not suspect the Empire could really put them into such a trap, a common mistake for hero types. Vader's presence shook them to the core, and the fact that he blasted the whole flight of fighters and took down the larger ship all by himself, it shows he is the best pilot in the galaxy.

BTW, I call the jump to lightspeed and the tractor beam catch of Vader's ship a either double Despair or Triumph depending on who was rolling. That was quite comical and really felt to me a super solid example of the FFG dice system.

KSW

My biggest gripe of all is that Dave Filoni and team really missed out on some good story ideas. It was briefly alluded to that the Empire was trying to turn the general populace against the Rebels... well we never really saw that, they mentioned it, but that was it. How about forcing the Rebels to stay on Lothal for a couple of episodes and eventually someone they trust turns them over to the Empire fearing retaliation, or maybe they truly believe the Rebels are terrorists. You could have done a lot, but instead the writers took the easy way out.

i think we will see more of this later in the series. i am pretty sure this will come up again. if not on lothal, somewhere else.

Tracker turned on and Vader jumped in right away... sigh... That would mean he was already on course for there and practically there already. The big ships not shooting, stupid at best. Even the best Jedi/Sith can't deflect/dodge a complete barrage and he was alone for almost the whole fight as we've seen in other places, like the Arena on Genosis. With just a few fighters, best to open up with the big guns as well. Hell, Star Wars combat was based on WWII fighters, bombers, etc... The big ships had no issues opening up with the flak guns and AA fire while their own fighters were airborne and defending the fleet.

In some ways I understand the idea of the bad guys being really bad (killing minions for minor mistakes), but it gets grating and tiring after a while. If your people fear making mistakes as opposed to learning from them, then only those really good at deflecting blame will rise above the lower ranks. I know, I know... welcome to pulp comics where everything is Black or White. The bad guys are super bad, the good guys are, well, everything the bad guys aren't...

Tracker turned on and Vader jumped in right away... sigh... That would mean he was already on course for there and practically there already.

Not necessarily. He found the tracker, not that it wasn't already on and broadcasting. More than likely it had been pinging for some time and Chopper only now just found it.

Tracker turned on and Vader jumped in right away... sigh... That would mean he was already on course for there and practically there already.

Not necessarily. He found the tracker, not that it wasn't already on and broadcasting. More than likely it had been pinging for some time and Chopper only now just found it.

They dock with the command ship. They walk off and chopper comes charging out all in a huff...

"Chopper says a transmitter activated on our shuttle moments ago"

They run to the bridge to warn them to jump and immediately: "Commander, I'm scanning a ship entering our sector"...

Next to no time between the two events.

I'm not goning to argue against the gripes of lazy writing. I agree with bits of it, in fact.

That said, "swashbuckle first, think about the details later" heroes and "I know you know that I know that you know" villains have a long history in Star Wars .

It doesn't make it good writing, just consistent with the setting.

I'm not goning to argue against the gripes of lazy writing. I agree with bits of it, in fact.

That said, "swashbuckle first, think about the details later" heroes and "I know you know that I know that you know" villains have a long history in Star Wars .

It doesn't make it good writing, just consistent with the setting.

I don't have a problem with good old fashioned swashbuckling, but when you start jumping into the same trap over and over again I have to question your competence. The Tua trap was straight from Season 1; you mean to tell me they really learned nothing?

I'm not goning to argue against the gripes of lazy writing. I agree with bits of it, in fact.

That said, "swashbuckle first, think about the details later" heroes and "I know you know that I know that you know" villains have a long history in Star Wars .

It doesn't make it good writing, just consistent with the setting.

I don't have a problem with good old fashioned swashbuckling, but when you start jumping into the same trap over and over again I have to question your competence. The Tua trap was straight from Season 1; you mean to tell me they really learned nothing?

See the fun games that can be had with the Idiot Ball !

The Tua trap was straight from Season 1; you mean to tell me they really learned nothing?

Comically, they did.

They learned to trust themselves, their instincts and the Force... And it still led them into a variation of the trap.

Not defending it: But from an the crew's point of view, it was a different situation (and it kinda was, as all information the viewers get suggests that Tua was being honest).

I would say that the characters behavior was consistent (if overly bold) from thier limited POV but the writers ARE at fault for going to the same ploy so soon...

But again, consistent with the setting that gave us: Destroy the Death Star in ANH... Journeys of emotional and spiritual discovery in ESB... And, I guess we do the Death Star thing again in RotJ.

I definately think Star Wars needs to explore other facets and approaches to the Galaxy Far, Far Away and not always lean on its pulpy serial roots, but by way of being an attempt at "original recipe" Star Wars , Rebels is decently on point.

I don't think it was an "idiot ball" situation but more of the writers not caring how far along they had brought the characters.

I rewatched the scene where they set it up...

The moment they see who is asking for help, both Zeb and Kanan are calling foul and ready to end the transmission. Based on earlier set up, Hera lets the transmission continue almost out of spite against Kanan (and, yes, also her "help the hepless" tendencies) who has been and continues to bulldoze over her authority.

Sabine is incredulous of the situation, as well.
Ezra then chimes in that he thinks Tua is telling the truth and that he can sense her fear. Kanan confirms the sense but doesn't automatically assume that it's an "all clear".
They continue to hear Tua out and Kanan and Sabine are not swayed. Sabine even notes the obvious trap.
Ezra has been learning to trust his instincts and the Force, and they say go for it. Kanan agrees that the intel is worth it and two allies they have come to trust between seasons (as near as we can tell) both agree.

The characters were suspicious, applied prior experiences and training, consulted with alllies. They showed growth.

The final line of that bit is, literally "Well, I guess we are going back to Lothal" almost as if the chartacters, themselves, can't believe that is how it played out.

They then went into danger in a manner consistent with Star Wars heroes (which is to say: bravely, if illogically) and the writers STILL dumped them into a rehash.

Bad writing, to be sure, but it doesn't indicate that the characters aren't advancing... Just no matter how advanced they get, the writers fall to crutches, sometimes.

With Minister Tua, it genuinely sounded like she was going to defect due to her being terrified of losing her life. Remember that back in Season 1 she had a front row seat to what happens when Imperial officers fail Tarkin too many times. And Vader specifically said that she was being sent to Tarkin to explain her failure the group of Rebels that had blown up Tarkin's personal Star Destroyer and all but made a mockery of Imperial authority during that whole Mustafar incident. She knows that Tarkin is quite likely pissed, and in spite of everything she can think of (she is after all a civilian) to flush out these Rebels, she's had no results. She was also unaware that Kallus was on to her, and I suspect there was an off-camera moment where Kallus informed Lord Vader of her pending defection, and Vader decided to make use of it.

As for the Ghost crew not spotting the trap, a few things. One, as the audience we have the benefit of detached perspective since we're the ones watching from the sidelines. Two, they're on edge and desperate to get off Lothal as quickly as they can manage. They were also unaware that Darth Vader was on the scene and handling things personally, and the Spectres have had little trouble dancing around the usual quality of Imperials stationed to Lothal. If anything, their success at Mustafar may well have made them a tad over-confident; after all Kanan took out an Inquisitor in single combat, and they made Tarkin and the Empire look vulnerable after their little stunt at Mustafar. And when Vader shows up... well, as Kanan said, they were lucky to survive that encounter. Vader was pretty much toying with the rebels, and only avoided butchering them where they stood because he was playing a longer game with the small fleet as his objective.

As for Vader's sudden appearance and single-handed destruction of Phoenix Squadron and the command ship... on the arrival, it's speed of plot, plus it's entirely possible that the stolen shuttle's trajectory was used to give Vader's ships a general heading for where the Rebel fleet would be located. As noted above, after the confrontation with Vader the Ghost crew were scared (rightly so) and wanted to put as much space between them and Lothal as possible, so Vader would probably have the Star Destroyers head in that general direction, and wait for the homing beacon to go off before dropping out of hyperspace in that region of space. Given the Empire has unrestricted access to the Holonet (aka real-time communications), it makes sense.

Regarding his single-ship wrecking spree... in terms of FFG's game system, it actually makes sense. He's undoubtedly got Adversary 3 and enough ranks in both Piloting (Space) and Gunnery that he can afford to Fly Defensivly with the upgraded difficulty to his attacks not meaning a thing to him. As for the capital ship, he's likely making called shots on components and generating Triumphs on his proficiency dice, thus enabling what little damage his lasers do inflict to trigger critical hits, which enough of those will eventually leave the command ship dead in the water.

Granted, there's a decent amount of suspension of disbelief required to accept that Vader's gambit went off pretty much exactly as planned (David Xanatos would be proud, I'm sure), but consider there's only so much time they have (Siege of Lothal is a double-length episode) and that they're going to have to either gloss over somethings or simply jump straight to the action rather than letting the show get bogged down, something that's important to remember since the show is primarily for a younger demographic who likely don't have a very long attention span; the last thing the showrunners want is their primary demographic finding the show "boring" and changing the channel.

I agree with Donovan 100% on his assessment. I've been a SW "fan(boy)" (LOL) since '77. I've see and read pretty much every source material/story/game resource printed (and some that weren't). Many I've liked, many I've hated. Rebels I'm thoroughly enjoying.

In digesting any sort of fiction, written or watched, you have to understand what the target audience is. The Jedi young adult novel series(s) actually had some good plot and story behind them. As an adult I can pick them up and go "blech! What rubbish. The plot was weak, the characters were thin, blah, blah, blah.". I picked up a book meant to capture teewns and trying to add a "grown up" perspective. Not very 'grown up' if I'm judging it that way.

Same way I see Rebels. I sit and watch, making a point to try and enjoy it the way it was intended. Almost nothing ever produced for Star Wars that I can remember is anything I would ever classify as "intellectual" material. Star Wars has always been about (like the myths and legends the story was based on) stimulating the imagination. In this case, like Donovan said, the imagination of a younger demographic that probably doesn't dissect the plot and character development the way we do.

Importent quote from one of the most intellectual minds of the '20th....

---Albert Einstein

But, your mileage may vary. Not every story/arc/plot development will be enjoyable to everyone.

Where's the speculation about the real reason the Empire is interested in Lothal, as Tua mentioned in her plea for help?

Maybe the core of the planet is a giant crystal that will end up being used in the first Death Star? Thus, there will be at least two known planets that Tarkin is responsible for completely and utterly destroying?

Just a thought.

Where's the speculation about the real reason the Empire is interested in Lothal, as Tua mentioned in her plea for help?

She was afraid for her life, maybe she threw that out there as she could hear that they weren't willing to help her...

Where's the speculation about the real reason the Empire is interested in Lothal, as Tua mentioned in her plea for help?

She was afraid for her life, maybe she threw that out there as she could hear that they weren't willing to help her...

i think that's unlikely. that secret and how the rebels will try to keep the empire from using it is probably one of the main arcs in this season.

Could it be the Jedi temple that is hidden on Lothal?

Could it be the Jedi temple that is hidden on Lothal?

I don't think so, because the rebels are aware of that place existing.

But they weren't aware that the Empire knows of it. But I admit that may be too fine of a distinction for kids show.

But they weren't aware that the Empire knows of it. But I admit that may be too fine of a distinction for kids show.

Yeah, and it wouldn't be a great pay off for the adult audience either...

What if the lazy writing wasn't lazy writing?

If Vader is there because of the threat of Jedi, disabling the ship may not work. Someone sensitive to the force may sense danger.

As to the ship, Zeb obviously didn't find the hidden tracking device. We have learned, even from the movies, that hyperdrive speeds are the speed of plot. We don't know officially how they work. Also, where were Phoenix squadron located? Were they in the same system? Sector? They could be very close. The ship the rebels dropped in was a commercial transport. Should the Spectres need a rescue, having Phoenix squad able to send help would necessitate them being close. Not that jumping in with a-wings would do well against that many star destroyers.

Clearly the point of the episode was to show the ruthlessness of the empire, and Showcase the badasswey of Darth Vader. Mission accomplished.

Some things to remember about Vader and the Rebel Flagship;

1) Hera mentions upon seeing the military grade shield generators that the Rebels could use them. At that point, there were only the Ghost, a squadron of 8 A-Wings, and three capital ships in the Fleet. It's reasonable to assume as she took 6, that the idea was to give 2 to each Capital ship. If this is the case, then when Vader showed up, the flagship most likely didn't have shields - so a fighter attack would be very effective (look at Pearl Harbor).

2) Vader did have Star Destroyers backing him up, they just took longer to arrive than he did. Knowing this, it could have been his plan all along to provide what appeared to be the weak threat of a single starfighter to keep the Rebels in place until the larger support ships to arrive. Once he was there and saw the low level of threat the fleet was posing though, he decided to have the ISD's stay back and prevent their escape so he could sow further fear in the Rebels (that a single fighter was more than a match for their "Fleet"). This is the very same tactic that the Emperor uses at Endor, remember.

I don't believe The ghost crew actually nabbed 6 shield generators. Three at most. The whole "you have 6" was all Lando assuming too much.

Remember Vader showed up before they had made it into the ship, and only Zeb, Sabine and Hera, I believe, grabbed generators.