You can keep claiming fat falcons aren't more powerful then hsf builds all you want you were wrong 7 months ago and still wrong now.

Don't think we had fat falcons 7 months ago...

But no where did VS ever say they weren't more powerful, then the older HSF. He said that the falcon was more powerful then the one in the HSF because you spent more points on it.

He's talking about a thread from February where, essentially, he predicted that Han + Bandits with Ion Pulse Missiles were going to take over the metagame because missile-carrying Headhunters are better than X-wings. I said that no, I'm not sure that's really going to be an issue--Headhunters provide additional options for HSF-style lists, but don't make the list more powerful.

Then a few weeks ago he jumped on me for the same thing again, and I disagreed again. Basically, my position is that Falcon + Headhunters has definitely turned out to be a far bigger deal in the metagame than I expected, but I'm standing firm on the point that Threepio isn't substantially better (in a mathematical sense) than Chewie as a defensive crew option, and I'm also not giving in on the idea that having Headhunters + missiles as escorts is stronger than having X-wings or B-wings.

Now he's on about it again, to the detriment of the point I'm making in this thread--which, to be explicit, is that it's more expensive to run three Prototypes than to run three Talas or Bandits, and in an HSF-style list those points require compromises on the Falcon's upgrades. And since the whole point of Fat Falcons is that you can get a power boost on your Falcon by reducing the proportion of your list you spend on escort fighters, Rebel Aces is actually going the wrong direction as far as Fat Falcon lists are concerned.

You are so full of it. I said Han c3po gunner millennium title 3 zs and said use whatever points left on ion missles or concussive. Word for word that was my statement.

You directly said it wasn't stronger and only an option over hsf.

You still just argue and fail to admit u were wrong and I ended that thread saying I was tired of arguing with you and wait till they are released just to show you it was overpowered. And your still dragging your head in the sand.

This quote by you is exactly what that thread was about. How can you interpret that quote any other way. You never said essentially or anything as such and you are just lying right now so you don't seem completely out of touch with reality.

Vorpal sword wrote:

Yes, I can honestly sit here with a straight face (although not all the time, because my three-month-old son keeps smiling at me, and it's hard not to smile back) and say that while adding Headhunters and Threepio to the game increases the options for running HSF, it definitely doesn't make it stronger.

::sigh:: these forums become a more terrible place every day...

::sigh:: these forums become a more terrible place every day...

To be fair, they've been pretty good this week, but I've also noticed a lot less posts by some people so that could be part of it.

And again your point of upgrading the 3 z95s to chardon refit prototypes not being better because you take away upgrades on the falcon is again wrong since after the inclusion of c3po and gunner to the falcon there isn't another upgrade that adds as much both defensively and offensively to the entire squad. 1 evade die per ship plus the increased manueverability dial and boost options means I can avoid fire arcs better and get other ships into my firearms easier.

I prefer predator on chewie over Han because it's a better version of Hans ability that includes chewie a pilot ability although I do concede it's a wash due to hans increased ps in a named phantom meta. And that still leaves me two points which I rather use on anti pursuit lasers and fly my large based falcon offensively to block other ships knowing my opponent is flying to try and get the best shot on the falcon and do more damage while avoiding damage from that ship then use the millienium title which is nice if you have a spare point but not needed since a focus token is not bad. This last paragraph is how I like to fly my build but there are a dozen other varients using these points because these points are a lot more subjective.

Look I'll call you out again a second time and I'll drop this subject until major juggler shows the results of future tournaments. And I can garauntee you we will see we will see prototype awings out placing z95s in fat falcon builds because as a whole it's simply a stronger build.

::sigh:: these forums become a more terrible place every day...

Yeah, I'm just about ready for an extended break. I don't think I can do this anymore.

You are so full of it. I said Han c3po gunner millennium title 3 zs and said use whatever points left on ion missles or concussive. Word for word that was my statement.

You directly said it wasn't stronger and only an option over hsf.

You still just argue and fail to admit u were wrong and I ended that thread saying I was tired of arguing with you and wait till they are released just to show you it was overpowered. And your still dragging your head in the sand.

You know what, I had a long post put together but it's way, way off-topic and it's stupid, personal inside-baseball stuff. Anyone who wants to read exactly what happened and why Gungo's been following me around for months, it started here .

I'm going to go do something more constructive, like shouting at clouds.

Please don't be full of your self you have 2600 posts I have just over 200. I don't post for months until something is released or is previewed. You just tend to argue with everyone who doesn't agree with you.

You just tend to argue with everyone who doesn't agree with you.

And yet... Here you are someone who rarely posts, making a point of tracking VS down to argue with him...

Please don't be full of your self you have 2600 posts I have just over 200. I don't post for months until something is released or is previewed. You just tend to argue with everyone who doesn't agree with you.

You just tend to argue with everyone who doesn't agree with you.

And yet... Here you are someone who rarely posts, making a point of tracking VS down to argue with him...

You may have just over 200 post Gungo but, as I believe Vandor is hinting at, a whole lot of them seem to arguing with VS specifically instead of making some stand alone comment.

Please don't be full of your self you have 2600 posts I have just over 200. I don't post for months until something is released or is previewed. You just tend to argue with everyone who doesn't agree with you.

You just tend to argue with everyone who doesn't agree with you.

And yet... Here you are someone who rarely posts, making a point of tracking VS down to argue with him...

You may have just over 200 post Gungo but, as I believe Vandor is hinting at, a whole lot of them seem to arguing with VS specifically instead of making some stand alone comment.

Ok. Here's my addition to the thread. EVERYONE CALM DOWN OK!!!!!

Alright, we cool now? Really, don't you have better things to do than argue with over who wins the interwebz? If you think Post-Aces prototypes are really better, then field test them to see; then you can get back to us with your findings. If everyone wants to keep arguing here, then I'm going to have to start reporting here. (Hint: this post is not aimed at Vorpal Sword, one of the rational posters on this forum).

That being said, while I do not see Prototypes completely supplanting Z-95s, I could see swapping one out for a Prototype to get something a little different.

The OP for this thread was what is the difference between a HSF list and a Fat Han list, neither of which includes prototype A-wings with Chardaan refit in them.

The thread has now taken a tangent line on if 3 Talas or 3 A-wings would impact a HSF list, which is fine but since Rebel Aces was just released, it will take some time before the Meta works this theory out through trial and experience.

My question to the Han Solo thingy (overdone for sure):
C-3PO only gets ONE shot at guessing every turn. The Millenium Falcon using the Evade Action, only gets ONE Evade Token per turn.

If I have 5 Academy TIE Fighters shooting at Han (yes he would have damaged or potentially crippled one or on the outside chance, destroyed one), that's 4 (or 5) attacks in that first round.

Obviously the Evade token is sitting there to be used whenever, but 3PO? When do you use that? I mean you have to declare before you roll the Evade die right?

You declare it before you roll.

Against range 1-2 attacks, you almost always bet for zero, or one if you really wish to gamble.

If it is at range 3, you can gamble for "one evade" and get double evade, or you can do the same and bet on zero so you get one assured evade. I don't know the chances to specificaly say which one is better, even tho the zero bet will always mean 1 damage less no matter how you roll.

The funny thing with a C3PO + Fat Han build is getting Fat Han. Against a decent player it is very unlikely even playing swarm that you could ignore the Z's and go straight for the Fat Han (engine upgrade, engine upgrade, engine upgrade, yes, people freaking forget about engine upgrade), it would be a mistake by the Fat Han. You can take advantadge of this by engaging the Z's earlier and mindgaming the Fat Han player to think you are chasing the falcon when you will do a hard turn to engage the Z's, effectively isolating both groups from each other, and probably not taking shots from Fat Han that turn.

Or atleast, that's how i deal with it when playing swarms, or 5 Ties + Whisper (obviously i mix it up, if my opponent ends up knowing i will always go for the Z's, it would be irrelevant). Normally i end up killing the escorts first, even tho every person in this forum will tell you to focus down Fat Han, and in my opinion, it is obvious they haven't played against the list and are just rolling dice at their desks.

The difference between a HSF and Fat Han builds are obvious. The first one is a more agressive build with escorts chosen to deal damage, while the second is a more nimble and durable Han, with bumpers/blocking escorts.

Hit the report button folks. When there are posts that only contain trolling and personal attacks, that's an easy call to make. Keep these forums moving in the right direction by helping police.

Is there any reason you wouldn't falcon, 2A, 1z? 3pts is 3P0 or predator depending on the need for offense or D. Not as easy to fly/less manueverable, staggered PS, bu it could be the best of both worlds.

And to the original Q: I'd say HSF is an offensive build and Fat Falcon focuses on defense and HP and that defense makes it just as big a threat long term. As to variants list names are just guidelines, there can be tweaks.

1 people defeat with swarms, the other people yell is OP when their Phantoms get crushed, you can guess which is which.

Please don't be full of your self you have 2600 posts I have just over 200. I don't post for months until something is released or is previewed. You just tend to argue with everyone who doesn't agree with you.

There seems to be a new thing going through this forum, the guy with 200ish posts suddenly makes out the guy with 2000+ posts to be some egotistical moron who never agrees with anyone. It's funny and stupid at the same time.

Speaking as the OP, I think my question has been adequately answered. If you all want to fight, I'm happy to sit here and watch.

Are there other personal pet trolls out there? I thought we were just about rid of Ribann/Jango.

Speaking as the OP, I think my question has been adequately answered. If you all want to fight, I'm happy to sit here and watch.

Are there other personal pet trolls out there? I thought we were just about rid of Ribann/Jango.

Unless . . . Gungo IS Jango is Ribann!!!! O_o

DUN DUN DUN................