Hi all, as you might have suspected, I'm playing Explorator

Well I'm quite annoyed with the current fatigue system as it feels quite arbitrary and isn't gradually punishing.

With me playing Explorator, this makes me want to use the Logis Implant Talent. Which grants +10 WS and BS on a successful Tech-Use test. It also requires a T-test or you gain a level of Fatigue. So if you fail the T-test you end up with a net WS-BS bonus of 0 but a -10 penalty to all other tests.

This seems quite off to me and also that unnatural toughness isn't helping you in any way to withstand any effects of fatigue, sure, you can take the double amount of levels in fatigue before passing out.

So I have come up with an alternative system, penalising based on Fibonacci and which grants a bonus for unnatural toughness (simply divide the penalty by the UT bonus).

Unnat T #x	1	2	3	4
Fatigue	Current	New    UT(2x)	UT(3x)	UT(4x)
1	-10	-5	-3	-2	-2
2	-10	-8	-4	-3	-2
3	-10	-13	-7	-5	-4
4	-10	-21	-11	-7	-6
5	-10	-34	-17	-12	-9
6	-10	-55	-28	-19	-14
7	-10	-89	-45	-30	-23
8	-10	-144	-72	-48	-36
9	-10	-233	-117	-78	-59
10	-10	-377	-189	-126	-95

I was also considering lower gain in Fatigue for Best Quality Calculus Logis upgrade but seemed a little over the top. I was considering it halving the level of gained fatigue per failed T-test.

What do you guys think of this? Or do you say: "stop moaning about an OP class!"

I don't know if I'm leaning towards stop moping, but as this started out as a fix for a pretty minor issue, it turns Toughness into a much more complicated system.

You get fatigued from overworking your body, being critically wounded or being hit with psychic powers. It doesn't matter how tough you are, it's your body asking you to just stop and take a break. I don't think it really matters how tough you are, your body is starting to rebel against you at this point. You ignore it up until the point you've pushed your luck and pass out.

If you don't like gaining fatigue, just stock up on drugs. That's just power-gaming your weak, organic body like how an AdMech do.

What?!? First someone steals my lines and now someone steals my role as resident curmudgeon? Either I'm going to have to be faster on the uptake when these posts come around or I'm going to have to take my biliousness to a new level.

Explorators aren't OP. They just come across that way if your game has a lot of melees in tight spaces. They're meh in starship combat. They make you go faster. Meh. They can help you turn faster. That's actually okay. You'll be far more dependant on your voidmaster(s) and RT when fighting from VUs.

They're not OP, but that's only because you didn't build yours to be an Order of the Hammer Initiate at Rank 1, Xenographer at Rank 2, and then some combination of Genetor/Acolyte of Abraxes at Rank 3/4. You now have access to as much Exotic Weapon Proficiencies as you want, Pure Faith, Sorcery Techniques and Regeneration.

BEHOLD THE GLORY OF THE OMNISSIAH. Until your GM kills you with an asteroid from space.

Hmm, drugs, that I didn't think about that before!

My mind is so used to combat drugs to be something specific to Dark Eldar only (WHM 40k) that I forgot that most of the IoM runs on drugs on a daily basis.

Thanks to showing me the Righteous Path to the light of the Omnissiah Erathia. PS: that build sounds OP indeed, especially as I didn't here about all those alternative paths but the Genetor.

And Errant Knight, I learned the meaning of curmudgeon today, thank you sir!

Yeah, I'm a control freak. I don't let people take certain Alternate Rank combinations. I don't let them take certain alternate Origin Paths, either. Go break someone else's game.

And El_Jairo, Bah Humbug! Oh okay, you're welcome.

You could have a far simpler fix and say that you ignore penalties from Fatigue until the amount of Fatigue you have exceeds your Unnatural Toughness multiplier (or bonus if you're using those rules). So assume for my example a Toughness 50 Explorator:

RAW

Having between 1 and 4 Fatigue points and you are at -10 to all tests.

Having 5 or more Fatigue points and you are unconscious.

Having Unnatural Toughness x2 means you can now have between 1 and 9 points with -10 penalty, unconscious at 10.

FIX

Having between 1 and 4 Fatigue points and you are at -10 to all tests.

Having 5 or more Fatigue points and you are unconscious.

Having Unnatural Toughness x2 means you can now have between 1 and 2 points with no penalty, between 3 and 9 points with -10 penalty and unconscious at 10.

Doesn't change the mechanics majorly but represents Unnatural Toughness giving you more reserves of energy than an average character, and the Explorator in the above example could use Logis Implants twice unsuccessfully without worry.

As a related side note, I apply fatigue at the end of the round it was gained in, allowing the Logis Implant to actually be a +10, even if you fail. This makes it useful for characters when they "really need to make this 1 shot."

Yeah, I'm a control freak. I don't let people take certain Alternate Rank combinations. I don't let them take certain alternate Origin Paths, either. Go break someone else's game.

I didn't say I would allow it just that it was possible. I'd actually be okay with the build in my game as there is a good, logical progression there. I just wouldn't allow Pure Faith to be thrown in.

The drug you're looking for in combat is Spur, which will allow you to completely ignore Fatigue, or possibly even Wideawake if you're only gaining the one level of Fatigue both of which are from Into The Storm.

If you've got access to other books and your GM allows it, you can also look into Kick from Dark Heresy's Inquisitor's Handbook (my Adept was addicted to that stuff), or Spur from Black Crusade Core.

Many thanks Arathia,

Spur and Wideawaka is what I'll be looking for then. Our GM doesn't like to allow too many books as he likes to keep track on what is coming from where.

I'll also suggest that Fatigue should be applied at the end of the current players turn. So that if you inflict Fatigue on yourself, you only suffer from it next turn.

Kasatka, I like your fix a lot, as it is simple and yet there is a noticeable difference, without too much impact.

As I'm aiming for Genetor unnatural toughness, I'll pitch in your idea as well

Many thanks Arathia,

Spur and Wideawaka is what I'll be looking for then. Our GM doesn't like to allow too many books as he likes to keep track on what is coming from where.

I'll also suggest that Fatigue should be applied at the end of the current players turn. So that if you inflict Fatigue on yourself, you only suffer from it next turn.

Kasatka, I like your fix a lot, as it is simple and yet there is a noticeable difference, without too much impact.

As I'm aiming for Genetor unnatural toughness, I'll pitch in your idea as well

Genetor gives you the skills you need to perform Xenos Organ Grafting, but you'd need Dark Heresy's Radical Handbook for that.

If you cant get your tech use rolls to a baseline of about 80 by rank 3 you either built or kitted your explorator wrong, so with a fate point re-roll it should never be a problem anyway. Especially when members of said class all have medicae mechedendrites if they know what they're doing and can just constantly dose themselves with stim and everything else like a cybernetic Hunter S Thompson so that even if you did take a level of fatigue you could remove it more or less instantly.

**** me but seeing someone in here complaining the the rules are mean to their explorator is just giving me flashbacks to my WoW days when every godamn mage in the game constantly complained that they needed to be buffed another hundred times.

1) A first-level talent shouldn't require the creation of a min-maxed 'optimal' design to be functional.

2) The Logis Implant Talent is also on the Seneschal tree, who will not have mechadendrites or insane tech use rolls.

I'm not even referring to all out min maxing, any decently put together exporator is going to get there almost entirely on armory gimmes and essential advances during the first three ranks. As for your second point maybe the Space Accountant shouldn't be as good at cybernetics as the Cyber Wizard, just a thought.

Don't fix what isn't broken.