If the heros are X's and villagers V's can I spawn on the hyphens?

_ _ _-_ V _ X

_ _ _-_V _ X

It says they block LoS, does that include spawning?

Villagers are figures. Figures do not block LoS for the purposes of spawning. Thus, villagers do not block LoS for the purposes of spawning.

I'm curious where this is specified. In the vanilla rules it says monster figures do not block LoS for spawning purposes, also where are villagers refered to as figures?

The gathered list of answered questions, really. I submitted this particular question myself. I think the FAQ specifies villagers as figures when talking about crushing block vs RtL obstacles...

FAQ:

Q: Which map items count as obstacles for the Crushing Block trap card?

A: Crushing Block may never be played in a space adjacent to any token (or built-in map element) that blocks movement. The reason for this is to prevent the Overlord from sealing a hallway completely and preventing the heroes from ever progressing. This is a list of all relevant obstacles, current through the Road to Legend: Boulder, Crushing Wall, Rubble, Water. (Villagers are figures, not map elements.)

Ok, there we see that villagers are figures. Where is it stated that non-monster figures don't block LoS for spawning?

It doesn't say it in any rulebook, I think it was sadly one of those things said by KW in an email or a forum post off the old board.

However, that statement in the JitD rulebook about monsters not blocking LOS for spawning was written well before villagers existed so it very likely that when villagers were introduced they forgot to account for that.

If you were going to say that villagers block los for spawning, you could also argue that heroes in pits would block LOS of other heroes for spawning. Since heroes in pits have LOS reduced to 1 space (adjacent), that would allow an ol to spawn to spaces behind a hero in a pit, even though another here has a clear view to it. That would be ridiculous. If monsters don't block los for spawning, nobody else does. The reason monsters are pointed out is so the OL doesn't try to maneuver monsters to block los and just spawn more monsters behind his monsters.

Feanor said:

It's not ridiculous, it's the way the rules are worded. The difference is that monsters don't block LoS because the OL can manuveur them, the heroes get to manuever the villagers, so that would be their own mistake.

As for a guy in a pit, he is not in the space, he is below it, so he doesn't blocl LoS. The example I would give is (and maybe I am wrong here) a boulder can't fit into a pit (the same way large monsters can't) so it can't kill the hero. By the same token the hero can't block a boulder, so it must roll over him.

Dashakan said:

Incorrect. From the GLOAQ:

Pits

Pits have no effect on the line-of-sight or line-of-effect blocking abilities of the monsters contained inside them. A figure in a pit has its own line of sight restricted, but figures not in a pit treat that figure normally for purposes of line of sight.

Figures in pits DO block LOS, there LOS is the only thing affected. Once again, if you're gonna let villagers block los, you're gonna have to let other heroes block LOS...which would only cause a problem with pits.

Also, in some dungeon levels/rumors, villagers are NOT controlled by the heroes either right away or at all. One says specifically that the villagers can't move and all villagers alive when the heroes go through the portal yield CP. If they block los the ol basically has a 6 space rubble token that he can then kill immediately. If the heroes can't move them, your idea of saying it's the heroes mistake holds no water at all. You do what you want, but I don't see anyone rushing to agree with you.

Dashakan said:

Aside from the fact that's not how the rules are worded, having villagers block LoS is terribly broken. It's not the heroes' mistake if the OL gets to spawn behind them. Have you actually tried getting 4-6 villagers out of a dungeon while they block LoS for spawning? We did once (because the FAQ wasn't out) and it's all-but impossible. Without Boggs the Rat, I'm not sure it can even be done. There is always a place the OL can spawn something.

Actually the rules ARE worded that only monsters block LoS for spawning.

JitD, pg. 12:

The overlord player may not place a spawned monster
in a space to which any hero figure on the board has line
of sight (see “Line of Sight,” page 9-10). Exception: For
purposes of spawning new monsters, other monster figures
do not block a hero’s line of sight.

And it´s not only pits that would create trouble if you let other heros block LoS for spawning. There are certain possible constellations, in which a hero can block LoS of another hero to a possible spawn place, but not have LoS himself.

Exactly. Look, I believe that villagers probably should be treated as monsters for LoS purposes. The fact is simple - the rules don't support it. Also, a hero does block another heroes LoS for spawning purposes, so yes, a hero in a pit would block another heroes LoS, technically. I would never play that way, but thats how the rules are worded.

Look, I asked this question:"do figures block LoS for the purposes of spawning?"

The answer was never.

I'm honestly too lazy to dig through my email and find it, but I posted it to the old boards and I'm positive on the subject. Villagers never block LoS for the purposes of spawning, according to the descent Designers.

The fact is quite simple: we asked the question already.

or at least I did.

and the answer is no, they don't block LoS.

just so's we're clear.

Thundercles said:

Thanks for clarifying, Thundercles !

Even I as a long time reader was not aware of this.

(Devilish side question: Is an animated chest a figure with all consequences? :-)