Something i've been thinking about recently is a Psyker issue.

Now, in RT we've been told there will be some new/improved Psyker specific things, but i'dlike some feedback on a Houserule before i implement it in my games.

It'd work for the Players & thier opponants, so it's a level playing feild really.

The What:

Automatic success on Minor Powers with no chance of Phenomina.

Only for Sanctioned Psykers.

The How:

Jimbob the Psyker has a psy rating of 3 and a willpower bonus of 4, when ever he rolls he'll Always roll atleast a 7.

So i'd House Rule it that any powers that require Just a 7 to work will Happen with no need to roll dice and will have 1 level of degrees of success.

He'd have no chance of Phenomina. Because he's in such control of his minor psychic powers.

If he were to pass an Invocation check he'd have 11 as a base score.

So i'd House Rule it that any Minor power requiring 7 (or less) to manifest would have 2 degrees of success and any Minor power require 8-11 to manifest would automatically pass with 1 degree of success.

The How with Bad Stuff:
If the player wanted to try for more degrees of success he Can still roll, but he then opens up the chance for Phenomina and even getting less Degrees of Success if he rolls very badly.

If the players Fails his Invocation roll he cannot try to roll for Invocation for 9 (the number of the tzeentch/warp) minus his WIllpower bonus in hours.

If the player Fails the Invocation roll by more than 2 degrees then Every power he manifests for the next (9 - WP bonus) hours will automatically produce a roll on the Perils table.

I've only been thinking about this as when the psyker in our group has been using minor powers they Never fail before he's rolled any dice, and i thought this might be a good way to swing things until RT rules are out and we can see what the advanced/shiney newness Psy rules will be..

(our groups pet psyker has just gained a WP bonus of 5 before rolling any dice.... so he'd be looking at either 7 or 12 as he's only rolling 2 dice for powers still, god knows what kind of crazy stuff he'll do once he gets his Major powers and that 3rd dice. Probably die very horribly.)

Anywho, thoughts, criticism, comments & feedback welcome.

Velvetears said:

Well to be blunt, this goes against the concept that psyker powers are inherently dangerous and unpredictable, even for elite psykers. If you want your game to go that waym, sure, but keep in mind without the danger there is no balancing factor to powers and no reson not to spam it all fhe time.

If you want to have more reliable psychic powers I rather reccomend allowing the psyker to reroll one 9 on such a "mastered" power.

FotD said

Well to be blunt, this goes against the concept that psyker powers are inherently dangerous and unpredictable, even for elite psykers. If you want your game to go that waym, sure, but keep in mind without the danger there is no balancing factor to powers and no reson not to spam it all fhe time.

Seeing as it's only for Minor powers, and only for Sanctioned Psykers (who by all the canon, fanon & novels undergo hellish training and get a green card to use powers with less chance of Bad Stuff happening) & it it does say that if they fail the Invocation roll then Bad Stuff happens Every time for a few hours i dont see how this could really be in the face of All We Know about 40k psykers.

It allows for the fact for the psyker to really screw things up if they Push themselves mentally and open up to the warp a little more than they might do normally (say for the Major powers) for the chance of getting better than an automatic success and a degree on top of that (which for most minor powers means the psyker needs to roll just 5 or more on a couple of dice, which is easy enough to not be considered a strain.

Bear in mind that the psyker can easily train up his Willpower and Psychic abilities over a short amount of time, the above HR does allow for Really Bad Stuff to happen if the character wants to Push themselves, which is whats alluded to in the RT development diary (psykers only might suffer if they Push themselves)

Not once in my 20+ years of wargaming (including a few years working for GW) have i seen any really bad results from the psy powers, in our current TT group one player did roll 9's almost all the time, before the character was executed (he was also an unsanctioned psyker picked up before he could be fully trained) for being a danger to the imperium, but Bad Stuff never got much worse that 75 on the Phenomina table.

Even in the novels Bad Stuff doesnt happen and people fling powers round left right and center in them, as well as in the various pc games Nothing Bad is even taken in to consideration, click button for power, power works rinse and repeat..

Heck even in systems like Shadowrun(1+2ed) theres the chance for Bad Stuff to happen where the caster mentally and sometimes physically drains themself, yet i've never seen a character die from it, let alone go above moderately wounded from the drain, most times i've seen it soak to nothing.

I agree with Friend of the Dork here - the errata explicitly clarified that you always have to roll the one power die precisely because psyker powers are not safe. Experienced psykers with Favoured by the Warp already have a really low chance of anything bad happening to them (0,1 [rolling a 9 with one die]*0,25[rolling a peril on the first die roll]*0,25[rolling a peril on the second roll] = 0.625% chance for a peril happening).

And it's funny that you mention video games, because in Dawn of War, the Imperial Guard Sanctioned Psyker (the only one lacking daemonic patronage, high tech gadgets or natural Eldar aptitude) has a chance of killing himself and blowing up his squad with his powers.

Thank you Cifer for your support.

Velvetears: I haven't read the novels I admit, but my impression from the rulebooks and fluff is that even Sanctioned Imperial psykers take a risk, no matter how small, whenever they use a power.

That means that you're not likely to see a psyker use his powers to lift a glass of wine or some such, but spare them for emergencies or to use against the enemies of the Imperium. Of course, power corrupts and excessive use of even minor powers could quickly lead to significant corruption.

And on a game mechanical level, minor powers can be very powerful, at least without any risk in using them. Unnatural aim, for instance means that the psyker has effective +30 BS... that's not even possible for a guarsman to get (max +20 after 4 advances), and this stacks with advances and situatuational modifiers...

There is also, if I remember correctly, a feat that is listed in Diciples of the Dark Gods that once taken allows you to ignore the first 9 rolled if the Psyker uses half their maximum dice or less. If allowed as an elite advance that would sufficiently give the same effect allowing no real peril as the Psyker could roll one power dice and even if they get the 9 they are still "okay".

This may make you weep...

"Eisenhorn and Ravenor were fairly instrumental in convincing me that in the Warhammer 40,000 universe, it seemed like you could draw on your powers just a little and nothing outward would happen. No hoar frost, no howling winds, and no bleeding walls. Conversely, when a psyker really pushes his strength, you know it. All of the stuff mentioned before (and a bunch of stuff much worse) pops out of the woodwork. He could push his limits to gain greater power, but the downsides will be familiar to any Dark Heresy player: Insanity, possession, loss of gravity, and so forth. "

The brains behind the new psychic powers system for Rogue Trader, John Ivicek

So what i've decided to implement as a HR will be part of the canon.

Is it not nifty?

for weak psykers even small powers is a lot of effort, and for strong psykers there are psychic surpremacy that basicly does make weak powers safe.

Just a note on what I do if it helps. If it is a situation with no pressure and not really important to advancing the story then I don't force tests in order to see if a minor power works or not. I've found that it allows the psyker's player to "show off" a little and feel like she's at least competent with her abilities. When she gets into situations where there is pressure as in she can't fully concentrate on manifesting an ability like combat or anything else that actually advances the plot then she rolls.

This may make you weep...

Why would it? It deals with inquisitors and rogue trading astropaths, both of which are far stronger than your average acolyte. In Scourge the Heretic, Carolus telekinetically flings a shuttle - should we now implement the new power "fling starships" in Dark Heresy?

As they have said in earlier news RT will be compatible with DH. With that in mind the new rules can be implemented into DH games at the GM's discretion. Not all rules work for everyone but for some it will make the games more interesting, That being said I don't think our Psykers will waist there powers trying to open that pesky jam jar with the stiff lid.

Cifer said:

I would think that "Flinging Starships" would require a great deal from the Psykers and would most definatly require a role. The bigger the task the more stress and energy required.

Zarkhovian_Rhythm said:

Much the same as what we do, Roll when we need to and the rest of it is descriptive.

Cifer said:

Hell yes, Invocation all the way, then drop that power like crazy, i'd dig out the rule book and name a power that Could do that if you like..

But as an aside, this is a HR ONLY for Minor powers, not the sort of power you'd need to fling the starships (or shuttles) left right and center.

I was mainly referring to the fact that only because someone in the 40k universe can do something in a certain way, it doesn't mean a playable character in the comparably low-powered Dark Heresy can. If an inquisitor or a major astropath is able to manifest certain powers without fear of perils, that has no influence on whether an acolyte would be capable of that.

Cifer said:

Why not?

Why not?

For the same reason "bananas are yellow, therefore apples are too" isn't a valid deduction. Both are fruits, but they're still not the same. It's already known that Rogue Trader characters are going to be more powerful than present-level acolytes. Ascension will lift DH characters up to that level - and I daresay it will make the "safe psyker" rules from RT available to sanctioned psykers. That is, sanctioned psykers that are somewhere past the 16k experience.

Cifer said:

Like this you mean?

The humble GOlden Delicious, a famous yellow apple.

Like this you mean?

Yes, exactly like this. There may be yellow apples, but it's still not a valid deduction because there is no causal relationship between the two (and because not all apples are yellow). Or in our case: Despite the possibility that there may be acolyte psykers capable of safe manifesting, their existence is not proven by the existence of more powerful astropaths that can do the same thing.

Cifer said:

Actually, IIRC, it's already known that Rogue Trader characters will be roughly equivalent to DH characters with around 5,500 experience points. So, not really Ascension level... more like high-end of rank 5.

Would you mind supplying a source for that?

Cifer said:

From the DLT podcast, as summerized in this thread , post number 7.

Cheers for that link LT, i was trying to find that in my folder for the last half hour as i knew that RT characters would be around mid level as to whats alread available.

Narissa and i want to adopt you for your awesomeness.

Yes, I am amazing.