The way I am playing, I like having high PS, moving last, and having 2-4 very maneuverable ships. I started playing with 4 Intys with PTL, then moved onto 3 named Intys with PTL, and have now dabbled with the Phantoms.

It is plain to see that I'm all about maneuvering as my ships are very squishy. One or at most 2 ships firing at one of my guys and I might get damaged but survive, 2 or more ships on one target and my guy is toast.

I've been toying with the idea of two flankers and one fat target, in this case Whisper and Echo as flankers and a OGP Shuttle as a fat target. When I had two Tacticians in the Shuttle, it got taken out before I can even do anything with it. While I did win both games, the lack of maneuverability of the Shuttle really manifested itself. Once the enemy got in range, they took the Shuttle out before it could retaliate (shuttle was PS2). On the second instance, no ship was in Range 2 for Tacticians to kick in and once the enemies blew by the Shuttle, it was effectively out of the fight for 3 rounds as it slowly swung itself around.

Loading up the Phantoms with all the toys means that there is about 20 points left for anything else. The Phantoms with VI and ACD is 72 points but is obviously not as deadly as when equipped with FCS and Recon Specialist or Weapons Engineer, but that brings them up to 82 points.

I've fought against Falcons and I see the problem there as being unable to be outside his arc as he effectively has 360-degree coverage. However, I see the solution here is being able to pick off his escorts then concentrating fire on the Falcon afterwards.

I've fought against a mini-swarm and the problem there was that I was going to be in someone's arc one way or the other and if they decide to ignore my "fat target" and go for the Phantoms, then I am going to be in for some hurt. If the "fat target" was a Shuttle, then like I said, as soon as they blow past the Shuttle, it's not a factor for at least 2-3 turns.

So I need my third ship to be able to take a beating (fat target) but would still be maneuverable enough to keep up with the Phantoms or at least keep up with where the battle is unfolding. It should also pose enough of a threat so that the enemy would feel it if he chose to ignore the third ship.

If I were to start with Whisper and Echo with just VI and ACD, that leaves me with 28 points to spend and the only options that would fit are Ties, Tie Advanced, Tie Bomber, or the basic Lambda. Maybe Mauler Mithel with VI and Shield Upgrade? He's a good threat, high PS and 3 defense, but squishy with 3 hull and 1 shield. A Tie Bomber is more durable at 6 hull, but I'm afraid it's also more vulnerable with just 2 defense and it might not be enough of a threat.

I'm asking for ideas and suggestions here, as I'm all worn out. Unfortunately, I cannot see myself flying a Phantom without VI and ACD, so please factor that into your suggestions.

Thanks for reading.

Fly a third phantom. Sigma, naked, that way you get 3 points to boost one of the other phantoms.

I fought a 4x naked phantom list in my first match at regionals.

Steamrolled me, and I was flying 3 turreted ships.

I'd suggest a change in your thinking about the Lambda. If your opponent focuses fire on it, that's great; it means he or she is doing exactly what you want. 28 points is an insanely cheap price to pay in order to get two unopposed rounds for your Phantoms.

And if your opponent doesn't focus fire on the Lambda, then you get the benefit of its effective and very cheap offense. With 28 points I wouldn't even hesitate to run Omicron Group Pilot + Advanced Sensors + Engine Upgrade as my tank piece.

well, I just won a small tournament yesterday using 2 sigma squadrons with recon spec and spa. I then took a doomshuttle and backstabber.

personally I wouldn't run both named ships, it would be fairly stressful to me but I liked the doomshuttle as a nice beefcake center, and popping Vader once or twice can end alot of ships. However the shuttle is hard to fly and without another ship yo bump it so it turns harder it can be very hard to use.

I would try flying the sigmas though, they fly like x wings on steroids and easily pull their weight and then some

2 regular TIEs might work- Dark Curse and an Academy pilot for some decent blocking and Curse's slight tank ability, or two naked Black Squadron. Two TIEs give you the same six hit points that a bomber woyld, but with better agility and more firepower.

2 regular TIEs might work- Dark Curse and an Academy pilot for some decent blocking and Curse's slight tank ability, or two naked Black Squadron. Two TIEs give you the same six hit points that a bomber woyld, but with better agility and more firepower.

Ikka, thanks for that suggestion. Going up against the mini-swarm actually made me think of the Ties. 6 hp but more attacks and more defense.

Truegreek, unfortunately, I cannot see myself flying a PS 3 ship. With regards to taking both Whisper and Echo, I've had fun running 3 Intys with PTL so I think/hope I can deal with the two named Phantoms. Whisper is okay, it's Echo that takes some getting used to but I can see so many evil opportunities with Echo.

I've yet to fly Vader in a Shuttle. It might be fun making an attack, the opponent evades all hits, but I activate Vader anyway. I'll probably run this for a few times before trying something else. The only downside obviously is the Shuttle's lumbering maneuver dial.

Vorpal Sword, thanks for the Lambda build suggestion. I'll try that too. You are indeed correct, the Lambda has done it's job, but I would've preferred if it had been able to do a bit more. That is why I am looking at other ships that can "do the job" (ie absorb hits) but is a bit more maneuverable or deadlier.

I wouldn't fly a doomshuttle if your gonna take 2 named phantoms though. You would be better served with something like backstabber + academy

this is mostly because with a shuttle your sitting at 18 thp, (I know phantoms are dodgy).and alot of faith in your green dice. vader will only hasten how fast it dies and without good target saturation you probably won't get to use it more than once.

edit: hush, this is phone postinh

Hmmm... I guess taking JUST ONE Tie is pointless as it is too squishy, right? Taking Backstabber/Dark Curse + Academy means I can only take VI and ACD on the Phantoms, but I guess having the opponent factor in TWO ships is better than him thinking of just one.

Unfortunately at the 100 point level, it just seems you're asking for too much. With both named Phantoms, you're really not going to get a "tank" that isn't a Lambda. I like the idea of two maneuverable flankers with a heavy-hitter, so why not...

Bounty Hunter w/ Recon Spec

Echo w/ VI, ACD

Tetran Cowell w/ PTL

Now you have a Bounty Hunter adding considerable threat while Echo and Tetran fly around every which way. 2 point initiative bid, or if you like to live dangerously, through FCS on Echo.

Just a suggestion. I flew both named Phantoms before, and they were a lot of fun, but I play 150 point games, so I had more wiggle room to back them up (I ended up going with two Lambdas. Not the best decision I've ever made).

Unfortunately at the 100 point level, it just seems you're asking for too much. With both named Phantoms, you're really not going to get a "tank" that isn't a Lambda. I like the idea of two maneuverable flankers with a heavy-hitter, so why not...

Bounty Hunter w/ Recon Spec

Echo w/ VI, ACD

Tetran Cowell w/ PTL

Now you have a Bounty Hunter adding considerable threat while Echo and Tetran fly around every which way. 2 point initiative bid, or if you like to live dangerously, through FCS on Echo.

Just a suggestion. I flew both named Phantoms before, and they were a lot of fun, but I play 150 point games, so I had more wiggle room to back them up (I ended up going with two Lambdas. Not the best decision I've ever made).

Yes, you raise very valid point. I think FFG have done really good in deciding that 100 points is the limit, as tough decisions have to be made. I know I am asking for a lot considering both named pilots eat up 72 points and indeed, I have considered swapping Whisper with an Inty (Lorrir seems like a good candidate for the banked 1 barrel roll) but I'm trying to see what I can do with Dual Phantoms before I move on.

Alright, well, here's as exhaustive of a list as I could put together to cover your final 28 points. Note that most aren't "tanks", most won't detract enough attention from the Phantoms to really be worth it, and not every single option is listed upgrade-wise because that would be obnoxious. But if you see the options spread out, maybe something will inspire you.

-most combinations of two TIE Fighters, excluding Howlrunner and Mauler Mithel

ex. 2x Black Squadron, Dark Curse + Academy, Black Squadron w/ Wingman + Academy, etc.

-one Interceptor

Soontir Fel, Tetran w/ VI, Royal Guard w/ PTL and Stealth Device, etc.

-one TIE Advanced excluding Vader

(lower cost ones can get some sort of loadout, I'm not familiar enough with them to make suggestions beyond that)

-one TIE Bomber with a loadout

-one Scimitar Bomber and one Academy TIE

-one Lambda

OGP w/ Vader and Engine Upgrade, Yorr w/ Engine Upgrade, etc.

-one generic Phantom

Sigma w/ SPA, Shadow w/ Intelligence Agent, etc.

Others are free to add anything I might have missed, but as far as I can figure, this is pretty much all you can add to both named Phantoms with VI and ACD. I hope this helps!

4 sigmas sounds like the ballsiest list there is.

Thanks for the input. It seems like I'm spreading myself too thin by having both named Phantoms. I tried a couple of games with the Bounty Hunter and it is a big improvement over the Lambda. At the very least, it got to shoot a whole lot more. I think I'll try more of BH + Echo + ??? before I move back into 4-ship build territory.

Thanks for the input. It seems like I'm spreading myself too thin by having both named Phantoms. I tried a couple of games with the Bounty Hunter and it is a big improvement over the Lambda. At the very least, it got to shoot a whole lot more. I think I'll try more of BH + Echo + ??? before I move back into 4-ship build territory.

Been playing BH+Echo combo with some success. Built out a spreadsheet of possible combos with BH, Echo/Whisper, Shuttle, and Defender. Pick a phantom and two of the remaining three and play with the upgrades.

Be happy to share if you want to PM me.

At the moment, I am running either a tricked out Echo or a tricked out Whisper, or both of them which is really deadly. The last ship is really more of a distraction just taking pot shots, the Phantoms just dance around the board and wreck havoc.

I've even ran and won a list with just a tricked out Whisper and a tricked out Kath. Kath managed to take out one ship but was also taken out.... but Whisper just wiped the floor with the remaining 3 ships.

At the moment, I am running either a tricked out Echo or a tricked out Whisper, or both of them which is really deadly. The last ship is really more of a distraction just taking pot shots, the Phantoms just dance around the board and wreck havoc.

I've even ran and won a list with just a tricked out Whisper and a tricked out Kath. Kath managed to take out one ship but was also taken out.... but Whisper just wiped the floor with the remaining 3 ships.

same here, my Echo or Whisper are usually 40 points or higher. The rest I fill with low PS guys with lots of hit points to deal with the PS9+ Fat Hans or to run interference. It's definitely turned out to be the type of lists I like to fly.

Been trying to like Whisper, but while she's super tanky (with focus and evade) and can actually get initiative sometimes, I just don't enjoy flying her as much as Echo.

Echo is all about getting into position. Whisper is there as a last-shot bid at moving last. As nobody seems to have a chance at going last with a HSF on the board, I've really given up on trying to counter a Falcon-based build. One guy in my area likes playing HSF with Luke as one of the crew, and Biggs as one of the escorts and maybe a Z-95. I just dance around him all night long but I know I'll lose in the end. If I manage to take out both escorts, I'll consider myself very lucky. Unfortunately, I've only managed to get the Falcon down to hull points and my guys have been taken out totally.

Still, it's a very fun and challenging fight, and I get to practice my arc-dodging and range estimation, so even if I lose, it's still a win-win....

Definitely. Playing against those HSF lists is a practice of skill and patience, even if most of the time you know you're going to lose. I do think having a BH or Defender with a shuttle will give you enough HP and firepower to deal with Han, maybe separate Biggs and the escorts from Han so you have a chance to kill Han or the escorts easier. I've been able to kill HSF a few times before the escorts (especially when the escorts are B-Wings) by blocking with the shutlte, shooting Han R1 with the BH or defender, and then having Echo close in for the final kill when Han is at 3-5 hull points.