One of my new players last night reminded me just how long it's been since I've looked at how slicing works, and I've realized that I need to refresh myself on the process and limitations.

Without digging out my old d20 notes, this is how I've been handing it:

==Requirements==

1) A computer to interface with (a datapad, for example)

2) A computer that you are targeting (a bank, a weapon system, etc)

3) A means of communication between them (comms and/or HoloNet).

==Special Considerations==

1) Finding information isn't nearly as hard as altering that information (i.e. checking an account is must harder than draining that account).

2) Accessing the means to communicate is often half the battle (as some information, like military secrets, are only accessible on site).

That said, am I far off my rocker here?

The player in question was trying to use an illegal HoloNet transmitter that he was borrowing from an NPC to look up information on a pirate they captured to see if he was worth a bounty to anyone and then to look into that pirate's accounts with the sole purpose of draining the account dry (he was too late, of course, as members of his crew beat him to it).

Unless I'm mistaken, it IS possible to do work like this remotely, but isn't the majority of slicing done on-site due to tracing and/or the information in question isn't accessible remotely?

On the other hand, one other thing to consider is the typical "Anything a PC can do, an NPC can do in return." I'm saving this one for the time the slicer decides to get greedy via remote access and have things trace back to him, but I like to make sure I'm not missing something within Star Wars technobabble somewhere that may make more sense.

Any input, favorite stories, or how other tables are treating slicing would be helpful!

I know in a couple of games I've run in, the most basic stuff you can get remotely, but if you wanted to crack something or get into something we had to get closer to the source or be on sight to hack deeper into things.

For example, I was able to hack the blueprints of a building we were going into, but had to be on site to get access to the servers and security systems. Which was able to get access from a near by cafe, with little difficulty. the rest went from there and that was that.

Star Wars isn't really a network-y setting. I think some people don't get the dichotomy and think high technology must equal everything connected. Two things I highlight are that firstly, unlike our world Internet which is designed around everything being able to talk everything else if both ends want to, the Holonet is very centralized. The Internet was designed to be able to route around damage and weather attacks. The Holonet is basically a State-run communications network and is designed around control. Secondly, and this is significant, the Holonet doesn't run on radiowaves. You're communicating at above lightspeed between star systems. It *cannot* be wifi as we know it. So whatever the technology is, what we see of it tells us that the constraint isn't latency, it's bandwidth. Everything we see in the movies of TCW is consistent with this. You might be able to communicate across 40 lightyears, but you've only got 2Mb/s! That's why you see patchy holograms and Princess Leia couldn't send the plans for the Death Star via email. It's entirely valid that a different technology has different constraints Personally I think that just like calculating Hyperspace routes is computationally intensive, transferring data is exponentially intensive too. So even the big ships still don't have much.

This explains why despite the high technology of Star Wars, if you want to control the trash compactor on the Desth Star, it really helps to be on the Death Star. Holonet wasn't designed to be an open network where anone could join and interoperate. It was designed to be an onformation control system. And if you want to opearate at Space distances, you do so with 1990's connection speeds.

This came up once several months back. My personal take has always been that it's not comparable to nowadays, where we have an internet of 'things' - the 'house of tomorrow' from the 50s where everything is controlled in the house via some central computer system.

If my players are trying to hack to *do* something - lock/unlock doors, access internal systems, etc - I make them do it on-site. If they want to put an Imperial facility on lockdown and make it so they're the only ones who can do anything - they have to be at a comprehensive terminal in the base. From small ones like the door panels you can 'trigger' lockdown but then every door becomes harder to slice through. (I do this based on a 'every door has an emergency code in event of intrusion' logic.)

If my players are simply trying to *find* something - information on whereabouts of a sector Governor aside from published itinerary, pull the last seven cruise liners to make Mantooine their port of call, find information on a 'Steven MacGuffin', they can do it from any of the public - or private - holonet terminals. Some information is going to be obscured and difficult to find, whereas some is going to be restricted and potentially have countermeasures, whether automated or manned cyber defenses.

This can vary based on target - controlling the lockdown on a customs outpost on a backwater world isn't incredibly difficult, but is challenging. Doing the same on Balmorra would be nigh impossible. Slicing in a falsified access code/cylinder is easier than overriding the system.

Indeed. The fact that R2D2 had to physically find data ports supports the idea that Wi-Fi isn't really a 'thing'. A given facility has a computer network, and if you slice it you can override some bits of it - but it will invariably require you to sneak in to do so.

I run things as if most civilized planets have wi-fi for public access of the local Internet-type network which make searching publicly available information about as easy as in any large, industrialized-world city here on Earth. However, groups and organizations (corporations, crime figures, the Empire and so on) that have data they don't want others to read (any kind of classified material) are never stupid enough to put that on servers or computers that are connected to the planet-wide wireless network.

Why not, you ask? Because if I, being the GM, was in charge of that organization's computer security classified information would only ever be stored on computers that were physically disconnected from the world wide web. Internal networks only, is my rule of thumb, which means actual physical access. Not necessarily access to one specific computer (although for particularly sensitive data this can be the case) but at least one of a handful of terminals inside the building.

This isn't something I do to be mean to my players. It's partly because that's a realistic way of treating classified data, and partly because it makes for a more exciting adventure if my players want to obtain said data. If the slicer can sit in a cafe and steal everything it means that all the other players are sitting around being bored. Burglary, on the other hand, is fun for the whole group.

As with most things, it is dictated by the story. If what the PC's are trying seems reasonable and you can run with it, let them suggest actions, and hit them with appropriate results for advantage/threat etc. If your story dictates that the information is tough (the location of the Nemesis' hidden stronghold) then let them try but then announce that even though they did everything right, they just came up blank. It seems the data they require is not (for security reasons) accessible via any public holonet link. A hardwired terminal accessed with appropriate encryption keys from a secure installation is probably the only way to get this kind of intel.

But if it's not story-centric you can have all kinds of fun with them following up leads and stumbling down slicer rabbit holes. Especially when they hit anti-intrusion software that trips alarms and tracebacks. There's a good reason my PC's do a lot of slicing work from Holo-cafes...

Thanks for the input so far, everyone!

From what I can tell, the player in question is pulling the typical stunt I see from most new slicer players (or those who've played Shadowrun): be a hacker, hack into everyone's accounts from a remote a location as possible, and make millions.

I will note that I never thought of the holo-cafe idea; in prior games my players would just hit a "public terminal" to get the information they need about the local area or some tidbits to get things rolling (like the public comm number of the guy who runs Business X) and/or hack into a place nearby (the Jawa once tried to hack into the security system of a building via the public terminal; the explanation made enough sense to work!).

Anyone else have any tibits about how they handle this mess (at least until we see something solid on it from FFG)?

Perusing this thread and seeing that some of you are requiring the slicer to be on site/location to do the slicing, how do you handle the starship and vehicle action "Slice Enemy's Systems"?

This starship action would imply that remote slicing is possible.

I'm not a fan of remote slicing in the Star Wars Universe. And i agree with Magnus Grendel's observation that R2D2 had to physically couple with computers to be able to communicate with and affect them.

Our current technology is pretty antiquated in comparison to Star Wars. We're also seeing that having a centralized network like the World Wide Web is pretty useful but at the same time very vulnerable to many things. I'd like to think that a significantly advanced technological society of many species scattered throughout the galaxy would not depend on a all encompassing space network or even system wide or planetary wide network. Maybe a communication network, but not a data network. Therefore, they would isolate important data to non-networked computers or droids, keeping this data inaccessible to anyone who isn't at the site where it is kept. A good example is the jedi library you see in TCW, holocrons holobooks or a specific non networked terminal inside a building or installation. etc..

There are all sorts of examples in the original three movies to suggest that wifi/remote data networks are non-existent and this makes sense to me. Communication network is a different story though.

So, if you're player wants to slice the city central computer system, that's going to give him specific information about the city. On the other hand, if your player wants to slice the security network of the arm's dealer based in that city, he's going to have to go to their headquarters, break in and find a terminal. Even then, the data might not be in the arm's dealer's network, it might be on a datachip in the arm's dealer's vault. So some reconnaissance may be necessary before the heist.

I also like to think that their is very little difference between droids and computer systems. Both being artificial intelligences. One is just a smaller mobile unit, while the other is a larger non-mobile unit, but the latter can hold much more data and fills multiple roles while droids usually fill a solitary role. With that said, can your slicer speak the language of the computer, or will he need a protocol droid to aid him in deciphering the language, otherwise whats the use of a protocoal droid??

I could go on, but looking at the star wars universe in the original three movies (not the expanded universe) once could easily imply that wifi data networks are almost non-existent and for a very good reason.

I've been allowing my slicer to do remote hacking, and i'm slowly beginning to realize that we've both been thinking in terms of our own societies capabilities not Star Wars capabilities. I plan on going back to what i'm seeing in the original three movies and remove remote slicing all together, requiring slicers do their homework and be onsite to get specific information.

Naleax

Perusing this thread and seeing that some of you are requiring the slicer to be on site/location to do the slicing, how do you handle the starship and vehicle action "Slice Enemy's Systems"?

This starship action would imply that remote slicing is possible.

This was actually discussed in another thread a while ago , and the consensus was that the remote slicing is done within range of the sensors as you are using the systems within sensors and comms to cause the mayhem. The conversation goes on that "hanging up" doesn't fix the problem.

I also like to think that their is very little difference between droids and computer systems. Both being artificial intelligences. One is just a smaller mobile unit, while the other is a larger non-mobile unit, but the latter can hold much more data and fills multiple roles while droids usually fill a solitary role. With that said, can your slicer speak the language of the computer, or will he need a protocol droid to aid him in deciphering the language, otherwise whats the use of a protocoal droid??

You have to remember that in order to slice, a slicer needs a set of tools, like a datapad or terminal. It'd be like using a computer in our day and age: you need a monitor to grasp what is going on and you'll need it and other tools to interface with it.

Now, when a computer speaks, that's when you will probably need that droid.

This was actually discussed in another thread a while ago , and the consensus was that the remote slicing is done within range of the sensors as you are using the systems within sensors and comms to cause the mayhem. The conversation goes on that "hanging up" doesn't fix the problem.

Interesting thread, thank you for pointing that out. However, the argument could be made that if you can do it with a ship's sensors/comms, why can't you do it with a computer terminal. Really the same rule could be applied in theory to any system, whether it be a remotely accessed computer system, or a droid. The rule seems to have been hastily drafted and implemented as something extra to do for crew members who might be slicers rather than what truly can happen in the Star Wars universe.

We assume that Slicing Enemy Systems can be done externally, but that's not necessarily spelled out. It may be that the slicer has t be aboard the enemy vessel or at least have some hardware covertly installed that gives him remote access.

The more I think about it, I think Slicing Enemy Systems was one part add-on, and one part a nod to a smuggler who had a comm and sensor system designed to allow him to slice into an enemy's system and go so far as to vent the life support.

I haven't had any caffeine yet so my mind can't recall the name, but I'm sure someone around here remembers it.

The more I think about it, I think Slicing Enemy Systems was one part add-on, and one part a nod to a smuggler who had a comm and sensor system designed to allow him to slice into an enemy's system and go so far as to vent the life support.

I haven't had any caffeine yet so my mind can't recall the name, but I'm sure someone around here remembers it.

I think that might of been Talon Karrade with one of the Wild Karrade variants.

The more I think about it, I think Slicing Enemy Systems was one part add-on, and one part a nod to a smuggler who had a comm and sensor system designed to allow him to slice into an enemy's system and go so far as to vent the life support.

I haven't had any caffeine yet so my mind can't recall the name, but I'm sure someone around here remembers it.

I think that might of been Talon Karrade with one of the Wild Karrade variants.

I broke out my copy of The Essential Guide to Vehicles and Vessels and found that it was the Hyperspace Marauder . Granted, it isn't really "canon" and is rather overkill, but it's a prime example that it IS possible to use the comms to disrupt systems.

We dropped it in our game, even though I was playing a Slicer (of course I was also the Mechanic, so I had a job on the ship).

It holds no water in canon and to me felt like "Let's make another position incase there is a Slicer who has nothing to do in ship combat". Personally I'd allow Computers to be usable in place of Mechanics in a "Damage Control" maneuver for reducing ship Strain (of course I'd also allow Piloting (type) as well), representing they are shifting power loads and compensating the "Field Capacitors with the Handwavium Circuits to reduce the load in the Wibbly-Wobbly Device!"

Can you slice a network or a droid with just a datapad? As I read description of this device it is more like a tablet. In my last game I have allowed to slice the droid´s memory with a datapad, but I gave some setbacks as this device was not really created for slicing jobs... How do you handle this in your games?

I'd treat it the same as with attempting Medicine checks without the proper tools and increase Difficulty by one. Since they single out 'slicing tools' I agree a datapad isn't any real help.

I'm AFB but there is a whole section on Slicing in the new splatbook for technician careers (Special Modifications). I've only had time to skim it but there may be some useful info there.

Can you slice a network or a droid with just a datapad? As I read description of this device it is more like a tablet. In my last game I have allowed to slice the droid´s memory with a datapad, but I gave some setbacks as this device was not really created for slicing jobs... How do you handle this in your games?

The first question would be, are we really talking about "just" a datapad, or one modified by the slicer to assist with slicing? Once that question is answered, proceed from there.

I think the misunderstanding is what a Datapad is and what Slicer tools are in the SW universe. In SW all computing and AI (Droids) processing is hardware only the data is software. So computer system security isn't code it's hardware and Slicer gear is specialized equipment, not intrusion software, to defeat that security hardware to allow access to the information beyond. I know it sounds odd and doesn't make a lot of sense in our world but this is the general basis for how these things work in SW. A Datapad doesn't have the necessary physical equipment required to slice a system it can only access system data. Again I know it doesn't sound right if you base it on today's tech but thats the way it is in SW.

Check out the sidebar titled "The basics of slicing equipment" in Special Modifications, page 50.

Check out the sidebar titled "The basics of slicing equipment" in Special Modifications, page 50.

I have to wait for that just a few days more

Basically: slicing with a datapad is challenging and requires "ingenuity" as the sidebar puts it, and it would add setback dice to the slicing attempt. You average datapad is basically poorly geared towards slicings, once you've started to customise it and such, you end up with slicer gear (a couple of hundred creidts on top of the basic datapad), which counts as the "Right tools of the job," and can/will/should provide one boost die to slicing attempts.

Add a databreaker you increase that to two boost dice - though I generally rule that you should have the slicer gear regardless, to interface with the system ... and I see the databreaker as an addition to the slicer gear, not a replacement. That's me though.

The dataspikes in SM are one time use items, but are pretty nifty. They are consumed upon use, but allows to perform the Disable Security Program action as a manoeuvre (and arguably other actions, but that is the one mentioned specifically.) Furthermore it decreases the difficulty two steps, minimum simple (i.e. zero difficulty dice.)