Is the Dark Side "seductive"?

By Col. Orange, in General Discussion

Luke: "Is the dark side stronger?"

Yoda: "No, no, no. Quicker, easier, more seductive."

In which case the appropriate question is " does the F&D implementation achieve that ?"

On the other hand, why the hell are we listening to Yoda anyway, considering how badly he got things wrong in the prequels? His credibility is dead to me... like his Order. :D

Funnily enough, even at FR2 you will still have roughly 33% chances of failing to generate a Light Side pip, so even then you're still not out of the woods. It gets down to ~20% at FR3. That's still 1 chance out of 5 to have some power NOT work at all... the Dark side will stay seductive for a surprisingly long time...

Edited by LexMajor

Luke: "Is the dark side stronger?"

Yoda: "No, no, no. Quicker, easier, more seductive."

In which case the appropriate question is " does the F&D implementation achieve that ?"

Yes, I think it did. I think the set up of the Force die is a very elegant mathematical implementation on the back end of that exact phrase from Yoda. You will tend to see DS results more quickly on fewer dice, but averaged over time and as you increase in skill, the number of LS and DS pips will equal out.

Not to mention that there are more "double light side" symbols, so when you do roll a light side face there is a good chance it'll be "stronger". I agree the force die/mechanic is a very elegant implementation of Yoda's quote - probably one of my favourite parts of the FFG system.

On the other hand, why the hell are we listening to Yoda anyway, considering how badly he got things wrong in the prequels? His credibility is dead to me... like his Order. :D

Oooohhhh.... burn! XD

Luke: "Is the dark side stronger?"

Yoda: "No, no, no. Quicker, easier, more seductive."

In which case the appropriate question is " does the F&D implementation achieve that ?"

On the other hand, why the hell are we listening to Yoda anyway, considering how badly he got things wrong in the prequels? His credibility is dead to me... like his Order. :D

In the last season of The Clone Wars Yoda changed his thoughts dramatically. So his actions in Revenge of the Sith make more sense in that light. I highly recommend the last 3 or 4 episodes of Season 6.

Does it count as canon if it only ended up on Nextflix as an " unaired season "? (Not a moot point since the prior seasons are part of the Disney-Lucasfilm Story Group canon alongside the trilogies.) Although I'd note that it sounds like Yoda changing his thinking in TCW S6 only to then turn around seemingly again over twenty years later to tell Luke " quicker, easier, more seductive "...

Does it count as canon if it only ended up on Nextflix as an " unaired season "? (Not a moot point since the prior seasons are part of the Disney-Lucasfilm Story Group canon alongside the trilogies.)

Yes.

Yeah, I don't think they specified that it was only the "properly aired" seasons of The Clone Wars that counted as being part of the new canon, and instead simply included the entire series alongside the films and any new material being released after that particular date.

Does it count as canon if it only ended up on Nextflix as an " unaired season "? (Not a moot point since the prior seasons are part of the Disney-Lucasfilm Story Group canon alongside the trilogies.) Although I'd note that it sounds like Yoda changing his thinking in TCW S6 only to then turn around seemingly again over twenty years later to tell Luke " quicker, easier, more seductive "...

TCW S6 Spoilers ahead:

So wait, I am confused. Is the argument that Yoda was wrong about the Dark Side or just wrong in general? Because after TCW S6, The Order has taken the stance that they have little choice but to see how it all plays out and THEN act. While Yoda, through his journey to discover the ability to become a Force spirit, decides to take the long view of things: knowing that things will not end well but that there will be hope in the far future to destroy the Sith. So, the Order was crap Ep I & II, and by Ep III the order as a whole have decided to wait out the Clone Wars until the Sith have finally player their hand. While Yoda, knows its going to go poorly, but he knows there is hope in the far future and I think he finds peace in that.

Anyway, thats my 2 credits worth. Season 6 is really pretty fantastic, including the Jar Jar episodes. But I've never really had a strong hatred of him anyway, so meh.

I think in Yoda's case it was realizing that, in many respects, the Jedi Order had already lost the war, simply by participating in it in the first place, and that the Order's views on the Force had become too structured. To pull from the (excellent) RotS novelization, during his fight with Sidious, Yoda realized that as powerful and skilled in the Force as he was, he simply could not defeat the Sith, as the Sith had evolved since the last major confrontation nearly a 1000 years ago, while the Jedi had stagnated, and that as the Grand Master he was partly responsible for that stagnation.

I suspect the Season 6 Clone Wars arc which has him decide to play the long game plays a role in that, but at the same time he knows he can't just sit back and do nothing; its one thing to play the long game, but another to just simply step aside and let evil men have their way. Up until the actual fight with Sidious, for all Yoda knew he could very well have a chance to defeat the Sith Lord and stop the darkness of his rule from ever coming to pass.

It probably also plays a role in his lessons to Luke, on top of having 20 years to mull over where the Jedi went wrong in training Anakin, something that Yoda would likely feel very guilty over, since had Anakin been properly trained then the Chosen One could have averted this whole mess by defeating the Sith instead of joining them. Yoda also was doing a rush-job in training Luke, and so didn't quite have the time (or patience) to go into exacting details with a student that was being rather thick by his estimation, though given he was challenging so many of Luke's preconceived notions it's not exactly surprising that Luke wasn't exactly taking to the philosophical aspects of being a Jedi as well as he was to other parts of the training.