Elusiveness and Wingman combo won't work like I suspect you might think. Wingman activates at the start of the combat phase and elusiveness after.

Push the limit would work on Howl, allowing for a focus / evade every round with the stress removed at the start of combat.

Swarm on howl, kill the obsidian, and steath devices for everyone.. just a thought.

Not where I expected you to go with that one...

I prefer the Mostly Named tie swarm myself if you're dropping to 6. Some of the named pilots are just too good to pass on.

Put Predator on all the Blacks, then downgrade the obsidian to an Academy and put PTL on Howlie.

Howl needs PTL or you lose her quick. I like the idea of running wingman next to her so she can PTL every turn.

I'd at least work in Night Beast somehow, maybe Dark Curse as well.

I initially tried a different sort of 6 Tie swarm and it worked brilliantly, only loss was to a really unlucky run-in with an OGP who managed to block my ships like crazy. Then I got absolutely taken apart by Soontir and I decided I'd never fly a list without a flanker again. I guess I could break someone off to flank, but it's a little awkward in diffusing the firepower.

The guy who won the regional at FFG, obliterating my Carnor, Howl, + 4 Academies list with Obsidians and Howlrunner convinced me of the merits of PtL, even over a Hull Upgrade for her. Wingman will be great as well. Bad experiences with predator are making me afraid of taking Academy Ties though. Just off the top of my head I might try this, though I'm not sure it's the best:

Alright, some good ideas. I can swap out my Obsidian for an Academy and put PTL on Howlrunner.

Elusiveness and Wingman combo won't work like I suspect you might think. Wingman activates at the start of the combat phase and elusiveness after.

Push the limit would work on Howl, allowing for a focus / evade every round with the stress removed at the start of combat.

Yes I saw that when I read the cards, but decided to go for it anyways and it worked to a degree but I agree that PTL will be more effective.

I initially tried a different sort of 6 Tie swarm and it worked brilliantly, only loss was to a really unlucky run-in with an OGP who managed to block my ships like crazy. Then I got absolutely taken apart by Soontir and I decided I'd never fly a list without a flanker again. I guess I could break someone off to flank, but it's a little awkward in diffusing the firepower.

The guy who won the regional at FFG, obliterating my Carnor, Howl, + 4 Academies list with Obsidians and Howlrunner convinced me of the merits of PtL, even over a Hull Upgrade for her. Wingman will be great as well. Bad experiences with predator are making me afraid of taking Academy Ties though. Just off the top of my head I might try this, though I'm not sure it's the best:

Howlrunner (21)

TIE Fighter (18), Push the Limit (3)

Black Squadron Pilot (16)

TIE Fighter (14), Wingman (2)

Black Squadron Pilot (16)

TIE Fighter (14), Wingman (2)

Night Beast (15)

Backstabber (16)

Dark Curse (16)

If anyone else has experience with this particular sort of list I'd love more ideas. I always seem to end up in Rebel heavy groups and never get to practice the Tie vs. Tie matchups.

I would advise you to drop the second Wingman upgrade and instead give him Outmaneuver. Then drop Backstabber and replace him with a Black Squadron Pilot with Outmaneuver. Then replace Nightbeast with an Obsidian. Looks like this:

Howlrunner + Stealth Device (21)

Mauler Mithel (17)

Dark Curse (16)

Backstabber (16)

Winged Gundark (15)

Night Beast (15)

That is the list I ran in the Store Championship and won.

Howlrunner + Stealth Device (21)

Mauler Mithel (17)

Dark Curse (16)

Backstabber (16)

Winged Gundark (15)

Night Beast (15)

That is the list I ran in the Store Championship and won.

That one is classic. I think some of the new tricks are worth losing mauler and winged and probably even DC for (never cut stabber or NB though).

I've been itching to try:

Black Squadron Pilot —

TIE Fighter 14

Predator 3

Hull Upgrade 3

(Total Points: 20) x 5.

You get the benefit of Howlrunner without having to stay at range 1 of her. And the extra hull point actually makes each tie a bit more survivable than a stealth device. And none of your ties are PS 1 or 2, so predator isn't as nasty when aimed at them.

I have found that TIE Fighters with the Outmaneuver upgrade are more effective than having Backstabber. Mainly because they reduce agility by 1 if outside the opposing ship's firing arc, making it easy to take down large ships like the Falcon.

I'm not sure I get that logic. I understand the specific and singular case of C-3PO, but in any other situation, adding an attack die adds more damage to the attacker's roll than removing a defence die stops the defender's roll preventing - hence more damage total. Not to mention, Backstabber is Pilot Skill 6 and cheaper to boot.

I think he means that you get more consistent damage rather than a potentially larger range. I've sometimes had problems even getting damage on a Falcon with Ties once Howlrunner goes just because of the single defense die. C3PO made it a lot worse. All of the Phantom and Anti-Phantom lists I'm seeing really make me think Tie swarms are the way to go, and reducing the impact of Predator with these will be huge so thanks for the things to try!

I have found that TIE Fighters with the Outmaneuver upgrade are more effective than having Backstabber. Mainly because they reduce agility by 1 if outside the opposing ship's firing arc, making it easy to take down large ships like the Falcon.

I'm not sure I get that logic. I understand the specific and singular case of C-3PO, but in any other situation, adding an attack die adds more damage to the attacker's roll than removing a defence die stops the defender's roll preventing - hence more damage total. Not to mention, Backstabber is Pilot Skill 6 and cheaper to boot.

Statistically, they are probably about the same, either way at range one the TIE rolls two more attack die than the defenders agility. Really what I am saying is, Outmaneuver works better because they can neutralize Rebel or Imperial large ships better than Backstabber can. Which is why I prefer the Upgrade more and why I have seen more wins with Outmaneuver than with Backstabber in my Swarm or Mini Swarm.

Maybe it's just me not caring about my TIE pilots (they're only numbers anyway). But I'm thinking of BSPs + Howlrunner with ruthlessness on everyone. Of course that's once ruthlessness is released.

If I'm reading the card for Ruthlessness correctly it would force you to deal that damage to one of your own ships if no eligible enemies are in range but one of your ships is in range 1, correct? Presumably this cannot apply to the attacker himself?

The card mentions it must be another ship besides the attacker , but yes, if you are in formation shooting at an enemy ship that is not near any others, you will damage one of your own. But, conversely, it damages enemies if they are close to the defender, IE you can shoot Biggs and damage Wedge. Kind of represents the Empire ship mercilessly spraying blaster fire and hitting another ship in the process, as well as their willingness to hurt their own if it means victory. Ruthless, if you ask me.

If I'm reading the card for Ruthlessness correctly it would force you to deal that damage to one of your own ships if no eligible enemies are in range but one of your ships is in range 1, correct? Presumably this cannot apply to the attacker himself?

It also means you can "splash" a target that is outside your firing arc.

Did you tested in a match???, greettings.