That being said, 100$ IS a lot for a starter set (it may be fair, but it is also a lot).

That's the same price Warmachine, 40k and WFB are all that price. It is a lot of money to spend on a game, but it's not like it's unprecedented for a starter to cost that much.

It's possible that no matter how fair the price is that the market will not bear the cost of such a large, complex, high quality game.

Perhaps, but I trust that FFG considered that when they were making it. Considering how well they've done with their games so far, I feel safe in giving them the benefit of the doubt when it comes to making good and fairly priced games.

It's not like FFG is going to just accept the first idea pitched to them and not consider things like how well it will sell, or what the entry point cost is.

It's possible that no matter how fair the price is that the market will not bear the cost of such a large, complex, high quality game.

Perhaps, but I trust that FFG considered that when they were making it. Considering how well they've done with their games so far, I feel safe in giving them the benefit of the doubt when it comes to making good and fairly priced games.

It's not like FFG is going to just accept the first idea pitched to them and not consider things like how well it will sell, or what the entry point cost is.

That is what I said in the very next sentence after your quote. So...you're agreeing with me? Sorry, just getting confused on that.

I'm breaking my usual practise of quietly lurking to make a few observations.

Firstly, I sympathise with those who are experiencing sticker-shock at the core set's price, especially when I think it's likely that I'll be buying two sets. I remember playing with just one X-Wing core set and I almost gave up on the game then and there.

That said, there are any number of factors influencing Armada's core set price point. Besides those already outlined (quite competently) it may be that sales of the huge ships for X-Wing have dropped off, and FFG is looking to bring in their break even money sooner on what might be a slower-selling product...

...Or...

FFG is attempting inventory control with a higher price point. Possibly they're trying to avoid the out-of-stock incidents from 2013...

...Or...

I think the issue is exactly what we're seeing - higher priced components and manufacturing process, transport and warehousing costs, with the usual business mark up. Possibly complicated by the Chinese manufacturer negotiating a new contract and raising their price - a usual way of doing business in PRC.

Back in the day, I used to play Star Wars capital ships using the die-cast star destroyer models on flight stands, along with Micro Machine MC80's and suchlike, using a variation of the Full Thrust rules. All sorts of fun, and much cheaper, too.

But I still think I'll be buying Armada - though I'll certainly wait til I can get a demo game in.

So...you're agreeing with me? Sorry, just getting confused on that.

Yeah I am. Sorry for confusing you.

Considering both the Transport and the Corvette are already seeing a reprint, I'm going to say that sales were good on the X-wing Huge ships.

Considering both the Transport and the Corvette are already seeing a reprint...

That is good news. That means that they may of sold better then FFG was expecting. I base that on the idea that if I were FFG I'd produce enough to meet what I expected to be the initial demand. If they're reprinting already that means FFG may have underestimated the demand.

I agree - a new print run is reassuring, and I think it's better business to proceed with caution than reckless abandon.

I brought it up because I was weighing strategies behind the pricing of Armada, and just today I noticed a FLGS was offering a "weekend only" %20 off price on the Tantive IV.

http://www.shopofmagic.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=52&Itemid=68

Mind you, just because one shop is trying something extra to shift a product doesn't mean anyone else is having the same issue. If it becomes wide-spread, it's usually an indication that sales (at retail level) are dropping off.

I have my CR90, but I'd like another before too long.

I'm curious too if FFG had to make a new licensing agreement. If so, they may have even had to pay more than their last one due to the success of X-Wing, Disney owning Star Wars now...etc...

That cost would most likely be offset by a slight increase to their planned MSRP which could account for the $100 price tag.

Regardless, I'm buying one of those bad boys when they come out.

I'm pretty certain their license lasts to at least next year.

If so, they may have even had to pay more than their last one due to the success of X-Wing, Disney owning Star Wars now...etc...

Why would Disney increase the cost of the license because a product is popular? I've never signed a major licensing agreement but I can't see the logic in increasing the price just because something is popular.

The better X-Wing and now Armada sells, the better for Disney, because that is effectively free advertising for Star Wars.

I think for many players the choice is going to come down to either buying the next Huge ship (you know there's going to be one, maybe announced at GenCon?), or investing in Armada.

I don't see much epic play happening myself, so I feel I can put off on the next huge ship to start getting into this game. Capital ships are just what I want for Star Wars.

so I feel I can put off on the next huge ship to start getting into this game.

I may very well skip out on the Imperial Epic ships or at least wait to get them for a while, until I see how popular epic becomes around here.

But on one of the pages for Armada they said it will be out in 2015, so it's at least 5 months out yet, and most likely more. Releasing the game in Jan seems like a bad choice, marketing wise. Everyone is still recovering from Christmas, and have less disposable income then other times of the year.

Here in the UK one online retailer has Armada on pre-order for 63.99 (that's pounds, not dollars) and a full price of 80.00 is quoted

Interestingly, it is excluded from their usual free postage deal due to size/weight so it is clearly a chunky game.

Well, Disney is about to ramp up SW related content, which would in theory raise the value of the license. I don't foresee there being issues in renewing, since X-wing is pretty popular, and the good games helps the property overall. But, we will see.

As for the size of the box, the dimensions reminds me of Descent's box. Which is quite hefty.

Well, Disney is about to ramp up SW related content, which would in theory raise the value of the license.

Sure but a popular product adds value to the license on it's own, with out needing to increase the cost of it. Plus there becomes a point where you price someone out of the license which is a lose lose, unless you have someone else ready to pay that price.

If so, they may have even had to pay more than their last one due to the success of X-Wing, Disney owning Star Wars now...etc...

Why would Disney increase the cost of the license because a product is popular? I've never signed a major licensing agreement but I can't see the logic in increasing the price just because something is popular.

The better X-Wing and now Armada sells, the better for Disney, because that is effectively free advertising for Star Wars.

The license holders *always* think the success of a license product is due to the value of the license, and if you're making all this money off my intellectual property, I want a bigger share.

Conversely, they *always* think the failure of a licensed product is due to a crappy product.

Don't ever underestimate the value of greed.

But in this case, the 'best-selling product in FFG history' is still a drop in the bucket to Disney, and they and FFG both have people that can do math, so I doubt you'd ever see a substantial increase in the licensing fees unless Hasbro or Mattel decided they were interested.

If so, they may have even had to pay more than their last one due to the success of X-Wing, Disney owning Star Wars now...etc...

Why would Disney increase the cost of the license because a product is popular? I've never signed a major licensing agreement but I can't see the logic in increasing the price just because something is popular.

The better X-Wing and now Armada sells, the better for Disney, because that is effectively free advertising for Star Wars.

Your logic is impeccable - and is completely wasted on Hollywood. One of the reasons that Babylon 5 Wars was discontinued was because Paramount jacked up the licensing fees, as there were new movies/series planned. The owners at Agents of Gaming made an argument along the same line as yours, and were told by the studio rep that the gaming hobby was a very small percent of the targeted demograph and income.

Something similar happened to West End Games' license, in that the upcoming films caused 20th C. Fox to increase the license a lot (there were other factors involved in WEG, but they came to a head a bit later.)

I don't think Disney would bump up a license as a result of a transfer of ownership, especially when you consider the vast amounts of dollars (think "Carl Sagan") of profit at stake, with all the rest of the merchandising, plus theatre and dvd revenues - that *could* change once FFG's license is up for renewal.

And *that* might be why FFG is launching Armada now...to use the license for all it's worth. I'm not insisting that this the reason, but the clever lads at FFG don't seem to be standing still, waiting.

I'm curious too if FFG had to make a new licensing agreement. If so, they may have even had to pay more than their last one due to the success of X-Wing, Disney owning Star Wars now...etc...

That cost would most likely be offset by a slight increase to their planned MSRP which could account for the $100 price tag.

Regardless, I'm buying one of those bad boys when they come out.

I don't think they were required to make a new licensing agreement: Lucasfilms agreement with FFG would transfer over with all the other rights (unless Disney or LFL wanted to break it). However, contracting a new product print run with the manufacturer in China would probably require a new contract agreement, and the trend is for the Chinese to raise their prices as the business relationship develops.

Geesh, I'm posting a lot. I'm going back to lurking.

Okay, I give. The new pictures certainly make this release look more like the value. Looks like that Victory is as big as a transport. But I thnk this game is too much money for me.

I will say given the size of squadrons, they could be painted. That is a disappointment.

Okay, I give. The new pictures certainly make this release look more like the value. Looks like that Victory is as big as a transport. But I thnk this game is too much money for me.

I will say given the size of squadrons, they could be painted. That is a disappointment.

Coming from a miniature gaming background the unpainted fighters are no problem. They require very little work considering their size. Especially the TIE fighters, those are too easy to paint.

Considering both the Transport and the Corvette are already seeing a reprint, I'm going to say that sales were good on the X-wing Huge ships.

This is anecdotal, but I know one game store owner who described X-Wing and the CR-90 in particular as "a license to print money."

You just have to look at their pie chart from the In-flight Report to know just how important X-wing is too them.

Coming from a miniature gaming background the unpainted fighters are no problem. They require very little work considering their size. Especially the TIE fighters, those are too easy to paint.

Yea, some very basic painting shenanigans will have those in fighting order in no time.

Considering both the Transport and the Corvette are already seeing a reprint, I'm going to say that sales were good on the X-wing Huge ships.

This is anecdotal, but I know one game store owner who described X-Wing and the CR-90 in particular as "a license to print money."

Your game store owner just described Star Wars in a nutshell. 37 years and still printing strong.

Yea, some very basic painting shenanigans will have those in fighting order in no time.

Having painted 1750 points worth of Space Marines, and 3000 odd points worth of Flames of War... I agree I think that with some washes, a little dry brush and some minor detail work, you could have these squads looking good in about 10-15 minutes per squad.