Other than missiles on the new Z-95 and occasionally on A-Wings, you don't see a lot of squads with ordnance. Has anyone had any success with torps? What is a good build for them? Something like 4 Golds each with protons and flechettes?

'Ordinance'.

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

'Ordinance'.

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

I love TIE bombers with flechettes and concussion missiles. Oh, and bombs. Bombs are fun.

Unless you forget that you have them.

Edit: But I take it (by your title) that you want tips for scum, rather than true heroes of the galaxy.

I think the Rebel thought is that more ships is better, hence no ordnance on them.. I would be interested to see what would happen if everyone started using ordnance to enhance their builds..

I know people have issue that they are a one shot deal and to be more effective one needs to focus and TL..

I like to set up a bomber with Seismic charges and cluster missiles, and if I have the right set up a concussion missile too.. all sorts of fun, but the flechette missiles are interesting as well and the Ion ones too, so I may test those out soon..

personally i see torps to be kinda questionable but they're good for point filling when building "small" squads i usually see people who fly three Xs sometimes sliding one or two to fill in some points but not much else love for them sadly

I've seen Hobbie with Flechette Torps do pretty well. And there's the occasional B-Wing with PtL and APTs.

Really, ordnance finds its home in Epic play. A couple of proton torpedoes go a long way against a zero-agility capital ship, especially if you can get some crits through its shields. And having 300 points to spend means that dropping four on some one-off attacks isn't quite as big a deal as it is in normal play.

The issue of torps and missiles costing a lot of points for a one-shot weapon that doesn't do that much more damage to begin with and is far less accurate than just shooting hasn't gone away yet.

Sure, I can load a Bomber to full capacity, but taking a Phantom is cheaper and gives me more shots and more reliable hits.

Actually I see wedge with torpedoes all the time. His high PS means he has very little trouble getting them off an his ability works on torpedoes as well. Have Gavin pass him a focus and he can be pretty nasty.

Ya. The lower in PS you go the worse ordnance becomes. You really want to move after your opponent so that you can get the first TL off.

Pretty much every list I use has Wedge with Deadeye and proton torps. Subbing focus for TL is handy, meaning that you can decide at the start of the combat phase if you want to go in guns blazing, or pick up the extra attack dice at rng 2-3 comparatively. Almost all of my x's run torps.

Plus with deadeye, if you do have a TL, it allows you to spend focus for the shot, then reroll all of your blanks and focus results.

Rebel ordinance: you are not allowed to park your x wing on the street curb after 9:00 or during a snow storm.

Rebel ordinance: you are not allowed to park your x wing on the street curb after 9:00 or during a snow storm.

Snowspeeders exempted?

I've been running Corran Horn:

Horn +PTL+FCS+APT+Stealth A great little ship to deliver a massive blow and if the ship is still alive then use Horns ability to finish it off.

I am also running Z-95's with Homing missiles to some good affect.

Interesting discussion. From what I've gathered on this board so far, missiles are seen as better than torps. Concussion missiles over proton torps any day, it'd seem. Yet they cost the same.

Further, when you see how little Y-wings are played (and if they are, it's with ion turrets, not torps), and how often people suggest Tie Bomber-lists with lots of bombers without torps/missiles/proton bombs, you get the impression that there might be something here the games devs might want to rectify.

So, to sum up:

Big issue: Torps - especially the iconic proton tops - are not a real part of the game. This is especially a problem to the Y-wing.

General issue: It isn't very tempting to put torps and missiles on the boats that should see them as their bread and butter.

Interesting discussion. From what I've gathered on this board so far, missiles are seen as better than torps. Concussion missiles over proton torps any day, it'd seem. Yet they cost the same.

Missiles have been getting more reliable versions -such as the Proton Rocket which rolls 4 to 5 dice on a focus token it doesn't have to spend to shoot- but the torpedoes are still stuck with relatively low accuracy by being forced to spend their target lock to shoot rather than reroll. Proton Torpedo is good, but the Advanced Proton Torpedo is a waste to fire if you don't have both a target lock and a focus token (it's also 6 friggin' points). Flechette's are two points for attack 3, a price that I personally find a bit too high for only causing one stress on a hull 4- ship.

Which brings us to the second downside of torpedo's: there's only 3 of them. So now we're anxiously waiting to see what the ion torpedo will do.

Interesting discussion. From what I've gathered on this board so far, missiles are seen as better than torps. Concussion missiles over proton torps any day, it'd seem. Yet they cost the same.

Missiles have been getting more reliable versions -such as the Proton Rocket which rolls 4 to 5 dice on a focus token it doesn't have to spend to shoot- but the torpedoes are still stuck with relatively low accuracy by being forced to spend their target lock to shoot rather than reroll. Proton Torpedo is good, but the Advanced Proton Torpedo is a waste to fire if you don't have both a target lock and a focus token (it's also 6 friggin' points). Flechette's are two points for attack 3, a price that I personally find a bit too high for only causing one stress on a hull 4- ship.

Which brings us to the second downside of torpedo's: there's only 3 of them. So now we're anxiously waiting to see what the ion torpedo will do.

Adding to that, I think it's a problem if two of the three current torpedo options continue to be seen as not viable choices. I'd rather see FFG improve proton/adv.proton torps than introduce new ones.

Standard protons could be improved, but unfortunately I think adv protons ARE appropriately priced, and no one plays them still. Adv protons have nearly a 90% chance to roll five hits, and no other weapon in the game is that reliable. That just goes to show that people don't seem to like ordnance that's not cheap and/or doesn't provide a secondary benefit. I have seen a LOT of ion pulse Missiles, even at regionals, flechettes are popular in the local league, and proton rockets will provide a cheap, potentially heavy hitting option for 3 some ships and a cheap more efficient alternative to most other missiles on other ships.

Standard protons could be improved, but unfortunately I think adv protons ARE appropriately priced, and no one plays them still. Adv protons have nearly a 90% chance to roll five hits, and no other weapon in the game is that reliable. That just goes to show that people don't seem to like ordnance that's not cheap and/or doesn't provide a secondary benefit.

Its not the initial 6pt for them, its all the extra points you have to spend to insure you get your near 90% - one shot torpedo. To get them to work, you need range 1, and both a target lock and a focus. In order to get all that together in one round, you'll need PTL, or a ship with squad leader, or another ship able to pass a TL or focus. IDK, that's a lot of work & planning to get off one (mind you, glorious!) shot.

Standard protons could be improved, but unfortunately I think adv protons ARE appropriately priced, and no one plays them still. Adv protons have nearly a 90% chance to roll five hits, and no other weapon in the game is that reliable. That just goes to show that people don't seem to like ordnance that's not cheap and/or doesn't provide a secondary benefit.

Its not the initial 6pt for them, its all the extra points you have to spend to insure you get your near 90% - one shot torpedo. To get them to work, you need range 1, and both a target lock and a focus. In order to get all that together in one round, you'll need PTL, or a ship with squad leader, or another ship able to pass a TL or focus. IDK, that's a lot of work & planning to get off one (mind you, glorious!) shot.

And at +9 points at the lowest, that ship is never going to make it to the range 1 it needs.

Standard protons could be improved, but unfortunately I think adv protons ARE appropriately priced, and no one plays them still. Adv protons have nearly a 90% chance to roll five hits, and no other weapon in the game is that reliable. That just goes to show that people don't seem to like ordnance that's not cheap and/or doesn't provide a secondary benefit.

Its not the initial 6pt for them, its all the extra points you have to spend to insure you get your near 90% - one shot torpedo. To get them to work, you need range 1, and both a target lock and a focus. In order to get all that together in one round, you'll need PTL, or a ship with squad leader, or another ship able to pass a TL or focus. IDK, that's a lot of work & planning to get off one (mind you, glorious!) shot.

And at +9 points at the lowest, that ship is never going to make it to the range 1 it needs.

Oh, I know how difficult it is to get an APT to work. So maybe 5 points, but I certainly don't see them being fairly cheaper than an Assault Missile, which is the only expensive ordnance that sees any play. Admittedly, difficult activation conditions generally make upgrades cheaper, IE R7-T1 vs Engine Upgrade.

I definitely like what the designers are doing with new missiles/torpedoes, but I also think that they would say ordnance, for the most part, works just like they intended it to: a potentially punishing shot that is most likely to deal little or no damage. And because of that design approach, they have become increasingly unattractive to players. They have made a few attempts to fix that, but it has not changed. The fact that it hasn't changed just points to the idea that they don't think there is that big a problem with ordnance. But hey, this could be a completely unfounded claim. They ARE giving us more viable options, but even cards like Munitions Failsafe didn't really make many players play more missiles.

i've run tons of lists with torps.. they are not really as bad as people make them seem.. i know it is hard to fit them in a list with rebel ships since the base cost is usually fairly steep (not so bad now that we have 95's). As others have stated, they really shine in epic. You can outfit almost a whole squadron of y wings with torps..

torps specific:

Try running 4 rooks with torps some time. you'll fry 2 acadamies worth on average, I know it's not game breaking or even a tourny champ but it is fun and actually is still a decent list. I've actually been meaning to try 3 rooks + torps with cracken + squad leader..

I've read one some forums there are z-95 missile/torp swarms that have been running the racket on some local scenes. just purely by mixing and matching and using swarm tactics to get shots off at key targets with a missile/torp for nearly every situation its could be clever but don't own any Zs yet and never seen a full list of one of said squads. Something i'm interested in trying at some point though

I've read one some forums there are z-95 missile/torp swarms that have been running the racket on some local scenes. just purely by mixing and matching and using swarm tactics to get shots off at key targets with a missile/torp for nearly every situation its could be clever but don't own any Zs yet and never seen a full list of one of said squads. Something i'm interested in trying at some point though

I wasn't playing, but I've seen this in a local league:

Airen Cracken

Lt. Blount

3 Talas

All with Assault Missiles

Against a TIE Swarm. Cracken Missed, gave an action to a Tala. Blount Hit. Double Action Tala hit. Second Tala missed, Last Tala hit. Seven TIE Fighters wiped, and only Howlrunner got to fire.

Now, its certainly not reliable. Same player has been wiped several times with the same list. But it happened. Have also seen Captain Jonus and 3 Scimitars, all with Assault Missiles and Seismic Charges. It has beaten me, and two other players in the Third round, second of combat, and another in the fifth round. But, also, that player has lost repeatedly because of whiffed missiles.

Ordnance CAN be very punishing. It can ALSO fail repeatedly. Because of that risk, you have to ask if it's worth it.

I prefer secondary ordnance that meets one or more of the following criteria:

1) Is not expendable (i.e. re-usable).

2) Doesn't cost an extra action to use. (i.e. spend TL or such.)

3) High rate of return on investment (area of effect, cannot be avoided, doesn't miss).

So I prefer the Heavy Laser Cannon which is 4AD all game long (as long as your are in RB2-3)...or the Seismic Charge with a 1 point area of effect that cannot be prevented and you drop it without expending or requiring an action.

Granted there are cases (epic ships, swarm counter, ion) where the other types are desired. I just don't run with them in a standard 100 pt list.