Granted Brath still does nothing against chew-p-o's, the potential 4 crits on Han would still be devastating

This is wrong.

Brath circumvents Chewie.

Edit:

Well color me pink. Brath just jumped up a notch in my book.

I'm taking this list into a tournament tomorrow:

• Whisper/VI/ACD/FCS
• Echo/VI/ACD/FCS
• Shuttle (Omicron)/FCS

I'm hoping all the target locks make better use of the 4 attacks for each Phantom, helping me kill any superfalcons before he can torch me too badly; then clean up the rest with whatever I've got left.

We'll see how it goes. When Phantoms face HSF/3PO/MF title, it's cross your fingers and hope for the best.

I will try:

Soontir+PTL & shield upgrade

2x OGP shuttle; FCS/gunner & engine upgrade.

2 pts for ini bid should work far more often than not.

I hope 2x buzzsaw shuttles can handle a Falcon and Soontir everything else.

What is the best piece of ordnance to stick on a squadron of bombers if one wants to put the hurt on a tricked-out Falcon?

Homing missiles(no evade spending+keep target lock) Clusters(2 attacks).

I love that the Phantom was the big thing two weeks ago and now everyone is trying to counter the Superfalcon now.

Empire:

Phantom + Mini Swarm has the best odds to strip 3P0 and Evade and do the most damage

Rebel:

Love Corran + R2-D2 + Z-Swarm

Answer: fear of an arc-dodging ship with 4 agility dice. You want to go turret or high PS to deal with that, and those things are not very swarm compatible.

Hence, the super-falcon is now an animal with no natural predator in the environment. We brought in the mongoose to get rid of the snake and are now overrun with mongooses (mongeese?)

I think most smart people didn't fear the phantom, they feared the effect that its presence would cause. Think of it this way...swarms counter falcons...what is keeping people from playing swarms?

Answer: fear of an arc-dodging ship with 4 agility dice. You want to go turret of high PS, and those things are not very swarm compatible.

Hence, the super-falcon is now an animal with no natural predator in the environment. We brought in the mongoose to get rid of the snake and are now overrun with mongooses (mongeese?)

That's pretty much the consensus people have. So, this thread is about dealing with that mongoose. The most common answer is to go back to the swarm and hope you don't have to face the Phantom.

In casual games where you know you're the Imperial and your friend is playing rebels, the strategy is to talk about how cool the Phantom is, and then bring a swarm.

In a tournament, well, you can either bring one of three options (swarm, Phantom, Falcon) or some thing that can hold its own against any of these three, and hope that you can muddle through while each of the above meets their nemesis hard.

People can go swarm and hope to not see phantoms. It is a fine bet. I'm going missile. I've an alpha strike squad I'm testing that launches 20 (mostly focused or TL'd) attack dice in the opening salvo. I'll let C3PO stop one of those. Put your falcon or Bandits in front of it, I care not which. It is a make it or break it list, but at least I'll have plenty of time between rounds either way.

Deny the falcon actions that increase it's potency in both defense and offense (no evade and no focus, and certainly no arc dodging). It's not just the red dice that the swarm brings to the table against the big falcons.

Brath with Predator or Outmaneuver and an HCL is a very solid counter to a super falcon and, especially with Predator, will shred the Z-95s or other low PS escorts.

I know it's not en vogue, but I've always had decent success against falcons with the interceptors in my list (they care less about 3PO and with PTL actually have good defense). I've always felt that Jax in particular is an underrated pilot. In fact,a player who is much better than I am pointed out that Jax (provided he has some defensive upgrades) helps to frustrate a falcon, too.

I thought the 4x Academy, 4x Obsidian list that won a recent event was a pretty smart choice. Swarms tear through Falcons best, and you have so many ships/guns, you can corner Phantoms or at least have something pointing in their direction.

If marksmanship ever becomes a 'thing' again I'd be weary of sensor jammers. Guaranteed crit is no bueno. This super falcon has me super bummed. I've been wrecked by super chewy with predator. As strictly a rebel player I haven't been able to figure out a counter. Perhaps it is a z swarm. But without howl its an uphill battle. If your only throwing 2 dice you need them both to stick. The only other option is Etahn. But he's so expensive in comparison to howl. And even then crust don't matter much to chewy.

A squad idea I had a bit ago, haven't gotten to try it yet. See if you can get them off the board.

Nice Falcon You Got There, Be a Shame If Something Were To Happen To It...

Colonel Vessery + Outmaneuver + Ion Cannon

Omicron Group Pilot + Intelligence Agent + ion Cannon

Black Squadron Pilot + Outmaneuver

Black Squadron Pilot + Outmaneuver

Once you've got the Falcon Ioned, you can keep it flying straight and pound it with hits, every one outmaneuvering (hopefully) and thus shutting down any potential C3P-0 builds.

And even then crust don't matter much to chewy.

I hate it when the crust is chewy.

(I'm sorry, I haven't been around long enough to know, is this when we turn the tread into a lunch discussion?)

A squad idea I had a bit ago, haven't gotten to try it yet. See if you can get them off the board.

Nice Falcon You Got There, Be a Shame If Something Were To Happen To It...

Colonel Vessery + Outmaneuver + Ion Cannon

Omicron Group Pilot + Outmaneuver + Intelligence Agent + ion Cannon

Black Squadron Pilot + Outmaneuver

Black Squadron Pilot + Outmaneuver

Once you've got the Falcon Ioned, you can keep it flying straight and pound it with hits, every one outmaneuvering (hopefully) and thus shutting down any potential C3P-0 builds.

OGP Doesn't have out maneuver

Oops, I think that was from having to retype it. That's not supposed to be there.

And even then crust don't matter much to chewy.

I hate it when the crust is chewy.

(I'm sorry, I haven't been around long enough to know, is this when we turn the tread into a lunch discussion?)

My Reliance to beat Han is to have 3 Things

Hull

Firepower

Pilot Skill

Whisper, VI, ACD, Tactician

Kath, VI, Rebel Captive,

Mauler, VI,

99 Points

Lots of stress to hand out, and I can easily make kath a more open target and know where to double stress a single ship. Regardless of damage done double stress negates PTl, EH, or dial moves for 2 turns.

Lot's of interesting thoughts here. I was surprised to see somebody say that TIE interceptors did well for them. I love TIE interceptors, but just barely abandoned them. Maybe that was premature. What about a TIE interceptor jousting squad?

Soontir Fel + Push the Limit
Tetran Cowall + Veteran Instincts
"Howlrunner"

Royal Guard Pilot + Push the Limit
98 point

Two PS9 pilots, so at least you get simultaneous fire. And they are maneuverable ships, so they should be able to keep the Falcon in their sights. Instead of Royal + PtL you could use Saber + Opportunist, but I have never been able to determine if that makes much of a difference. On the other hand, the extra die is more enticing with "Howlrunner" in the list.

EDIT: There may also be good things to spend those last 2 points on. And the whole reason I came up with TIE interceptor joust was becuse of "Fel's Wrath," but somehow he completely fell off this list. Bummer.

Lot's of interesting thoughts here. I was surprised to see somebody say that TIE interceptors did well for them. I love TIE interceptors, but just barely abandoned them. Maybe that was premature. What about a TIE interceptor jousting squad?

Soontir Fel + Push the Limit

Tetran Cowall + Veteran Instincts

"Howlrunner"

Royal Guard Pilot + Push the Limit

98 point

Two PS9 pilots, so at least you get simultaneous fire. And they are maneuverable ships, so they should be able to keep the Falcon in their sights. Instead of Royal + PtL you could use Saber + Opportunist, but I have never been able to determine if that makes much of a difference. On the other hand, the extra die is more enticing with "Howlrunner" in the list.

EDIT: There may also be good things to spend those last 2 points on. And the whole reason I came up with TIE interceptor joust was becuse of "Fel's Wrath," but somehow he completely fell off this list. Bummer.

As for your list, I'd drop Howl for Backstabber and then give Tetran PTL (or drop him and take another royal with PTL, leaving you some more points) because PTL is so important to help keep your interceptors alive, especially against falcons, and I don't think you lose much without howl because I don't like formation flying in that kind of list.

If you want some more thoughts on how to tackle them and what's worked for me at least..

Nope. For it to be a Superfalcon list, Han gets VI. You'll never be able to get Whisper that high, as Imps have no way for a ship to get PS11/12 and then pass it.

Not true..

Silly squad but can be done:

34 Soontir, VI, Hull, Stealth, Royal Guard Title

41 Whisper, Decoy, FCS, Intel Agent, ACD

12 Academy

12 Academy

-99-

Soontir PS11, Decoy Whisper to 11... Intel Agent to see where Han is going.

Nope. For it to be a Superfalcon list, Han gets VI. You'll never be able to get Whisper that high, as Imps have no way for a ship to get PS11/12 and then pass it.

Not true..

Silly squad but can be done:

34 Soontir, VI, Hull, Stealth, Royal Guard Title

41 Whisper, Decoy, FCS, Intel Agent, ACD

12 Academy

12 Academy

-99-

Soontir PS11, Decoy Whisper to 11... Intel Agent to see where Han is going.

I like your thinking but I think Vader would be a better option here, give vader EU, VI, he is the same points as Soontir with a better late game I feel since he will almost always get his two actions.

Hence, the super-falcon is now an animal with no natural predator in the environment. We brought in the mongoose to get rid of the snake and are now overrun with mongooses (mongeese?)

Mongoosen.

Lot's of interesting thoughts here. I was surprised to see somebody say that TIE interceptors did well for them. I love TIE interceptors, but just barely abandoned them. Maybe that was premature. What about a TIE interceptor jousting squad?

Soontir Fel + Push the Limit

Tetran Cowall + Veteran Instincts

"Howlrunner"

Royal Guard Pilot + Push the Limit

98 point

Two PS9 pilots, so at least you get simultaneous fire. And they are maneuverable ships, so they should be able to keep the Falcon in their sights. Instead of Royal + PtL you could use Saber + Opportunist, but I have never been able to determine if that makes much of a difference. On the other hand, the extra die is more enticing with "Howlrunner" in the list.

EDIT: There may also be good things to spend those last 2 points on. And the whole reason I came up with TIE interceptor joust was becuse of "Fel's Wrath," but somehow he completely fell off this list. Bummer.

To be clear, I said the interceptors in lists I've run do well, which generally means mixed lists and interceptor lists only, but the latter can certainly go down in flames when the green dice hate you. As someone mentioned, three red dice really eat into a falcon, so even one interceptor or two in a list can put a lot of damage on on falcon in a round.p

As for your list, I'd drop Howl for Backstabber and then give Tetran PTL (or drop him and take another royal with PTL, leaving you some more points) because PTL is so important to help keep your interceptors alive, especially against falcons, and I don't think you lose much without howl because I don't like formation flying in that kind of list.

If you want some more thoughts on how to tackle them and what's worked for me at least..

Actually, what you're suggesting is very similar to what I flew at regionals, and I got destroyed. I didn't fly in formation, and it meant I hardly ever had all guns on the Falcon at once. For Falcons, formation flying with Interceptors (particularly jousting) may actually be helpful, which is why I thought "Why not include "Howlrunner"?" But I still think this is all way low on the totem pole of Falcon counters.

"If you can't beat 'em, join 'em" I always say!

Vessery and four bombers has a lot of hull and a not insignificant amount of red dice.

I also have had great success lately with

Vessery + Outmaneuver

Backstabber + TC

2 x Academy Pilot + TC

Scimitar Bomber