My list:

• Whisper/Intelligence Agent/Veteran Instincts/Advanced Cloaking Device
• Echo (same upgrades as Whisper)
• Shuttle/Vader

I'm a solid player who plays a lot, and has learned how to use Phantoms. However, I do not see a way, short of lucky dice, to consistently beat any list that includes Han(w/VI)/Gunner/C3PO/Falcon Title.

Have any of you been able to do it consistently (of course, not always -- I just mean winning more often than losing)? I don't see a way (again, short of lucky dice) that this version of Han doesn't take out a Phantom every two turns. I love my two Phantom/Shuttle list, but it seems almost unwinnable (at least when facing a competent opponent) vs. HSF.

I don't want to fly a list that has an enemy that it can't beat, short of luck. One of my main goals is to minimize luck as much as possible as a factor in the outcome.

Advice/anecdotes welcome!

1 phantom + a mini-swarm does pretty well against Han, but if you're set on using two phantoms, I'd give this a try:

44 - Whisper - VI/ACD/Rebel Captive/Sensor Jammer

44 - Echo - Outmaneuver/ACD/Recon Spec/Sensor Jammer

12 - AP

If you have initiative, Whisper will be cloaked whenever Han shoots. Rebel captive keeps him stressed (to prevent Marksmanship, etc), and Sensor Jammer makes a huge difference in phantom survivability. I've gone one-on-one with this Whisper build vs a fully loaded Chewie without taking a hit.

Outmaneuver on Echo shuts down the C3P0 effect, while recon spec gives you focus for both attack & defense.

AP blocks Han, obviously.

If you can block/stress Han with the AP, 8-10 focussed attack dice per turn should devour Han in short order. As always, a lot will depend on his deployment and whatever else he's running.

Whisper won't be cloaked, as Han will have Veteran Instincts.

I'm not sure a lone academy pilot can do much to block him, either. In any event, the main problem isn't blocking Han. It's keeping him from shooting at my Phantoms first, from wherever he is, given his 360-degree arc. If I can shoot him, he can shoot me, and he's shooting at either Phantom w/out the cloak.

... and yes, I can shoot with, potentially, a lot of dice. But he'll be blocking a lot w/3PO and MF title, and chewing up my little four-damage, de-cloaked Phantom in the meantime.

Sigh...

Howlrunner + Swarm Tactics

Mauler Mithel + Swarm Tactics

2x Sigmas + Stygian + Recon Spec.

Mini-swarm formation (pinwheel or wide-space square) set up for joust.

1. Go straight for the falcon,

1.1 try to cloak the turn before contact with the falcon to get the evade.

2. Get the double focus, lose a shield or two from Han and then drop 12 - 17 dice on the falcon at PS 8 & 7.

3. Mop Up (stay in mini-swarm formation or split into two or three groups).

The trick is to keep your phantom at far range as possible.

If you have tie fighters you get them in close. Try to block, but the main goal is they will be a better target over the phantom.

Han getting a plus one to shoot would be best rather than shoot at a Phantom at range three. even if he is decloak

Echo is your weak link there imho. You need something that is able to put firepower withouth dying to Han easilly. Something more solid.

Edit - Oh, so that Han has VI too ? Yeah, pretty bad match up for phantoms in general, that's why you shouldn't never play 2 phantoms, it opens you to that kind of hard counter match ups.

Ah, gotcha. Quick tweak, then: drop recon spec to give outmaneuver to both. 3P0 won't be a problem. Sensor Jammer + Focus at range 3 should still be pretty effective against Han, especially once he's stressed.

3 attack modified by SJ vs 3 def + focus or evade? Those aren't terrible odds...

Thanks for the replies. If I take a Phantom list, however, it will be this one. I love it against everything but HSF.

CatPeeler: Outmaneuver is a great idea. I'll give it a whirl.

Stack Saboteurs!

Keep your phantoms cloaked and up close.

Flip 2-3 damage cards every turn!

It'll be great!

(Don't do this)

Take one phantom and durable stuff for the other half. A mini Howlrunner swarm, a Firespray maybe. Rexler Brath's quite nasty against Falcons: Outmaneuver Rexler Brath even moreso, and with the HLC he can stay at R3 while taking four dice shots against a zero agility Falcon.

You could also potentially modify your Doomshuttle into a Buzzsaw (Fire Control System, Gunner) to have a ship that will hit that Falcon consistently. If it misses, it Gunnershoots with a target lock. Stick a Tactician on and you can potentially doublestress the Falcon if it stays at Range 2 of the shuttle. As a result, it'll avoid Range 2, hampering its maneuverability against your phantoms.

Whisper (VI ACD)

Echo (VI ACD)

Omicron Group Pilot (Gunner Tactician Fire Control System)

comes out at 100 points. Drop a phantom and you've got 37 or 35 points to play with. That'll get you a Firespray (33 points for a Bounty Hunter), a TIE defender (30 to 37 points), a couple of TIE fighters, or Soontir Fel (Push the Limit Stealth Device Targeting Computer) for 35.

Give the Falcon something else to shoot at. Hopefully it'll be so injured from fighting it that your phantom can finish it off. If it goes for the phantom it's ignoring durable heavy hitters.

How about adding FCS to your Phantoms? those rerolls will probably help more than a Intelligence agent also try taking evades as your actions because if he does as well (and has VI) then he is relying purely on Han's rerolls which means no focus

After the second round of combat you should have broken through Han's shields so Vader can start stacking up crits and if he cancels Han's VI+Rerolls or makes Han PS0 then he is screwed

Take one phantom and durable stuff for the other half. A mini Howlrunner swarm, a Firespray maybe. Rexler Brath's quite nasty against Falcons: Outmaneuver Rexler Brath even moreso, and with the HLC he can stay at R3 while taking four dice shots against a zero agility Falcon.

You could also potentially modify your Doomshuttle into a Buzzsaw (Fire Control System, Gunner) to have a ship that will hit that Falcon consistently. If it misses, it Gunnershoots with a target lock. Stick a Tactician on and you can potentially doublestress the Falcon if it stays at Range 2 of the shuttle. As a result, it'll avoid Range 2, hampering its maneuverability against your phantoms.

Whisper (VI ACD)

Echo (VI ACD)

Omicron Group Pilot (Gunner Tactician Fire Control System)

comes out at 100 points. Drop a phantom and you've got 37 or 35 points to play with. That'll get you a Firespray (33 points for a Bounty Hunter), a TIE defender (30 to 37 points), a couple of TIE fighters, or Soontir Fel (Push the Limit Stealth Device Targeting Computer) for 35.

Give the Falcon something else to shoot at. Hopefully it'll be so injured from fighting it that your phantom can finish it off. If it goes for the phantom it's ignoring durable heavy hitters.

Actually, that comes out to 102 points.

I have had some luck with:

Whisper: VI, ACD

Echo: VI, ACD

OGP: Engine Upgrade, FCS

Though if you are fighting a VI Han then the rest of his ships are likely less than PS 6. You could drop VI and add a 3 point crew to one of the ships.