Stupid Cybernetics Question

By DrUnK3n_PaNdA, in Star Wars: Edge of the Empire RPG

So, to clarify, and I'm sure I already know the answer... but my group is disagreeing a bit on Cybernetic Legs. Does a pair of cybernetic legs count as a single cybernetic enhancement (i.e. could someone with Brawn 1 get cybernetic legs?) And is the cost in the book for one, or for a pair? The wording seems to imply that they are a single enhancement and the cost is for the pair... but it's not stated specifically that it's the case. Some clarification in the book or errata would be nice for the 'that guys' that many groups have.

Based on the pricing of the Arms that are purchased separately (rather than in pairs like cybernetic legs) I would say the price listed is each. It would be better if it listed (each) or (pair) but logic puts the pair costing 20k.

As to the second part, Based on the rule a PC with a Brawn of 1 could not use cybernetics legs. Each cybernetic requires the 1 Brawn. While legs are installed as a pair, it does not state an exception to the rule of 1 Brawn per cybernetic. If they wanted it to have an exception, they would list it.

As a note, I checked if they clarified this in AoR, they did not.

TL:DR Core Rule Book says 10k per leg, 2 Brawn required to install 2 legs.

that makes no sense...why would it be impossible for a toydorianer to receive cybernetic legs? Or a jawa, or an ewok?

Since it requires both legs to get the bonus I would consider that to be one cybernetic enhancement. As in, each heading is one type of enhancement, and it's the types of enhancement, rather than number of instances of each enhancement that you take into account. This makes way more sense from a rules standpoint, since the second limb provides no bonus, and if anything is actually a disadvantage. The wording is rather ambiguous, but having the legs take up two 'slots' seems unintended at best or poorly thought-out at worst.

The only mechanical purpose I could see for designing it the other way would be to give a secondary option for more stat bonuses with a diminishing return on the bonus to 'cybernetics slot' ratio, which is, when you think about it a pretty terrible idea. It means that a character must have at least 3 brawn at character creation to achieve the best high end stats... when Brawn already factors into WAY too many stats as it is.

I suppose the thinking is that Brawn represents the physical bulk available to support cybernetic additions. Sure, there are edge cases where things get wonky, but overall it works pretty well. I'm not sure there's a better solution without things getting complicated.

Now I really want to make a Toydarian Marauder with loads of cybernetics.

As to why it would be impossible for an ewok/toydarian/etc, it wouldn't it just means if they want cybernetic legs they need to get to the bottom of a spec tree and get the extra brawn. Or stat it at the creation.

Rather than ask why shouldn't they be able to, ask why should they be able to? A tiny body is not always an advantage and picking a species is pluses and minuses. If you can't be bothered to pay the XP to get to the right stat, don't expect the bonuses for not having it.

As always though I am given the answer that fits the spirit of RAW. A single arm costs 10k requires 1 brawn. So for DOUBLE the amount of metal to be attached with legs it costs 20k (1 for each leg) and requires the 2 brawn.

But there is the other side of the coin that saw RAW doesn't have to be followed. Even in the CRB it says Fun > RAW.

TL:DR If you want the "how does the book say it works" look at my post. If you want to be able to justify changing that, go ahead, but note that it is a house rule and not RAW. There is zero place that says you have to be a stickler for RAW and often it says the narrative trumps that.

I think it's meant the legs are bought as a pair for the bonus and that it's that bonus that counts as the upgrade.

As to why it would be impossible for an ewok/toydarian/etc, it wouldn't it just means if they want cybernetic legs they need to get to the bottom of a spec tree and get the extra brawn. Or stat it at the creation.

Rather than ask why shouldn't they be able to, ask why should they be able to? A tiny body is not always an advantage and picking a species is pluses and minuses. If you can't be bothered to pay the XP to get to the right stat, don't expect the bonuses for not having it.

The problem is that there's almost never an advantage for playing a small character, unless you're fighting a lot of things with Silhouette 2. Brawn is already far and away one of the most important stats, and from a game balance standpoint it's kind of hard to justify that decision on the developers' part, which is why I doubt it. Personally I think it should be tied to presence or something, more of a nod to Cyberpunk where body modification is most taxing on your sense of self.

I think it's debatable even in RAW, however. It's one enhancement in spite being two legs. Technically cybernetic eyes are two separate pieces used in tandem as well. Should they, by extension also take up two cybernetic slots? I say the intention was 'one heading, one enhancement.'

Edited by DrUnK3n_PaNdA

I also think if it is depending on the context. If a character for example loses a limb due to a critical hit and they replace said limb with no enhancements I think that Brawn should not be an issue. The reason for this is that it is not the character's choice to get the mod it just happened to him/her. Now if said player wants to get upgrades for those limbs that is when costs are individual and Brawn is a factor. I also believe that this would be due to the fact that you body has to resist so to speak something that it is not entirely used to or was originally designed to do. So this would solve the problems with Toydarians, Ewoks, or Jawas getting cybernetics they just couldn't get any with bells and whistles on them.

So, to clarify, and I'm sure I already know the answer... but my group is disagreeing a bit on Cybernetic Legs. Does a pair of cybernetic legs count as a single cybernetic enhancement (i.e. could someone with Brawn 1 get cybernetic legs?) And is the cost in the book for one, or for a pair? The wording seems to imply that they are a single enhancement and the cost is for the pair... but it's not stated specifically that it's the case. Some clarification in the book or errata would be nice for the 'that guys' that many groups have.

IMO, there’s two parts to this question.

If you’re talking about any kind of cybernetic replacement but not with any particular bonus, then that would be a "repli-limb", and I think those only cost 1k credits each. It’s designed to look and function just like your regular limb that it’s replacing, but isn’t any stronger or more agile, etc….

If you’re specifically looking for the type of cybernetic replacement that does have an increased strength or agility, then those are 10k credits each. In the case of arms, you can replace only one and get the bonus, but my GM would rule that bonus would occur only with things done with that particular arm — anything done with the other arm(s) would not get the bonus. If you want that additional bonus with the other arm(s), then you need to also replace them, and you can only do so if they are of they are all of the same type — so you can’t get +1 Brawn on one side and +1 Agility on the other, or the other-other, or however many arms you have.

In the case of legs, you could get a repli-limb that would replace only one leg, but if you want the bonus then you’ll have to replace both legs (for 20k credits), and both legs have to be replaced with the same type of cybernetic enhancement.

At least, that’s the way I read the rules.