I think the store owner was well within his right to protect his own interests, and that choosing not to fulfill his customer's sense of self-entitlement was in no way indicative of poor customer service.

...

That having been said, I think the OP completely overreacted. I get it, the store owner didn't respond in the way that was most ideal for you.

I disagree. If the store doesn't have a return policy that allows for unopened product to be returned within 3 days with a receipt - especially if the customer intends to opt for other product - then the store may have a legal right (I don't know), but it's contrary to commonplace business practice.

I'm guessing the store manager didn't realize he was returning a product. I'd hazard that the manager thought that he was trying to sell the owner inventory. Once he realized what was trying to legitimately return product, he immediately complied, as would be commonplace business practice.

Personally, I started buying stuff online for slightly cheaper (even after shipping to Switzerland and taxes and all) around wave 2. My FLGS won me back with awesome service; I now buy through them almost exclusively again. It's really simple - brick-and-mortar stores can't compete with the price alone, so they have to compete with better service.

Glad to see that your FLGS owner sees this the same way, both for you and the store

I think the store owner was well within his right to protect his own interests, and that choosing not to fulfill his customer's sense of self-entitlement was in no way indicative of poor customer service.

...

That having been said, I think the OP completely overreacted. I get it, the store owner didn't respond in the way that was most ideal for you.

I disagree. If the store doesn't have a return policy that allows for unopened product to be returned within 3 days with a receipt - especially if the customer intends to opt for other product - then the store may have a legal right (I don't know), but it's contrary to commonplace business practice.

I'm guessing the store manager didn't realize he was returning a product. I'd hazard that the manager thought that he was trying to sell the owner inventory. Once he realized what was trying to legitimately return product, he immediately complied, as would be commonplace business practice.

I'm not aware of any mandatory return legislation, especially for non-faulty product. This is America, the home of laissez-faire capitalism. Shouldn't we expect some kind of shopkeeper prerogative for good faith transactions?

I made my first purchases online. However, now that I play at FLGSs (which I didn't do, prior to getting into X-Wing), I buy from them unless I am buying from some other person in the local gaming community for 50% off sale price.

I also have to say that I really like my FLGSs. I wonder if in towns where there are very few (or only one) gaming stores if customer service deteriorates, due to lack of competition. I don't think it would necessarily be so, because even the monopolist would know that there are other entertainment options - and there's the online retailer.

For all those people saying that a store owner would be crazy not to bend over backwards like a big-box store, let's see you go run a small business. Some choices aren't as easy as you think.

I don't see accepting an unopened, undamaged, 3 day old product as bending over backwards. If it was opened, played with and damaged and then asked to take it, I would see that as bending over backwards. Even just being opened I can see as a problem and a tough choice. I see this as accepting that a valued customer made a simple mistake in gift choices and helping correct the mistake at no actual cost to himself.

No, I don't know how hard it is being a small business, but if this was somehow a hard decision for them to make, I can see why so many are going out of business.

You're right, the store has no legal obligation to help fulfill this customer's wishes. The customer also has no legal obligation not to take his money elsewhere.

I'm not aware of any mandatory return legislation, especially for non-faulty product. This is America, the home of laissez-faire capitalism. Shouldn't we expect some kind of shopkeeper prerogative for good faith transactions?

I don't know of any mandatory return legislation either.

But, decent business practice does not have to be written in law when there is a properly functioning market. I think it's fair to say that we have a healthy market in the gaming industry. Also, we are socialized into business practices (from a consumer point of view) from even more competitive markets, where there are guarantee and risk-free shopping policies, etc.

Oh, I forgot, KnightHammer posted some state-level return policy laws. It seems to be the law that if a retailer is not going to allow undamaged (and non-defective) product to be returned, that they must have a prominent sign posted. Now if the OP's FLGS has a sign up, that would be an entirely different matter. But, the OP says that that store does not have a sign of that kind.

For all those people saying that a store owner would be crazy not to bend over backwards like a big-box store, let's see you go run a small business. Some choices aren't as easy as you think.

I don't see accepting an unopened, undamaged, 3 day old product as bending over backwards. If it was opened, played with and damaged and then asked to take it, I would see that as bending over backwards. Even just being opened I can see as a problem and a tough choice. I see this as accepting that a valued customer made a simple mistake in gift choices and helping correct the mistake at no actual cost to himself.

No, I don't know how hard it is being a small business, but if this was somehow a hard decision for them to make, I can see why so many are going out of business.

You're right, the store has no legal obligation to help fulfill this customer's wishes. The customer also has no legal obligation not to take his money elsewhere.

I thought that we were past this point, so I'll refer you to one of my previous posts where I discussed how small businesses have a harder time moving high dollar product than do those that deal in high volume. That is the cost, and it's not an insignificant one. People should try to have a little empathy before being so callous about where they take their business.

Can anyone give me an estimate on how popular the Imperial Knights are, and how frequently those $140 models get purchased? I'm genuinely curious.

For all those people saying that a store owner would be crazy not to bend over backwards like a big-box store, let's see you go run a small business. Some choices aren't as easy as you think.

I don't see accepting an unopened, undamaged, 3 day old product as bending over backwards. If it was opened, played with and damaged and then asked to take it, I would see that as bending over backwards. Even just being opened I can see as a problem and a tough choice. I see this as accepting that a valued customer made a simple mistake in gift choices and helping correct the mistake at no actual cost to himself.

No, I don't know how hard it is being a small business, but if this was somehow a hard decision for them to make, I can see why so many are going out of business.

You're right, the store has no legal obligation to help fulfill this customer's wishes. The customer also has no legal obligation not to take his money elsewhere.

I thought that we were past this point, so I'll refer you to one of my previous posts where I discussed how small businesses have a harder time moving high dollar product than do those that deal in high volume. That is the cost, and it's not an insignificant one. People should try to have a little empathy before being so callous about where they take their business.

Can anyone give me an estimate on how popular the Imperial Knights are, and how frequently those $140 models get purchased? I'm genuinely curious.

I saw the post. If that product is that hard to move, he shouldn't stock it (special order exist for a reason), certainly shouldn't stock 4 of them. That's a bad business decision, like not accepting a pristine return. Really, I sense a pattern.

I'm trying to have empathy. If the product was in any way devalued I might possibly agree with you. In this case the owner is gambling with future sales to make sure the product stays sold. That's a terrible gamble. I believe the old phrase is "Penny-wise and pound foolish". Frankly he lucked out and the guy tried a second time.

If you run your shop under the notion that the customer has to be a small business owner to understand and empathize with a position that would be bizarre to the outside world, you probably aren't going to last. Some big box electronic stores treat their customers like garbage and are paying the price. Circuit City is already gone, Best Buy isn't too far behind. Dell use to be the PC leader, then shipped all of it's tech support overseas to save money, now it's had to buyback it's own stock to try and fix things. It's not just mom and pop shops that have to worry, customer care is important no matter who you are.

Bad business decisions can go both ways, all we're debating about now is who deserved to be saddled with the burden more. The store owner made a mistake (purchasing four of whatever), and he has to live with it. Fine, that's fair. The customer purchased the right product, but then changed his mind and also had to live with his mistake, if only temporarily. I think that's also fair. Why should the product have to be devalued to not warrant a return? I take the opposite stance; a good faith transaction was conducted, and the customer received exactly what he paid for. If the product was in any way misrepresented I might possibly agree with you... but it wasn't. The store owner changing his mind about the refund is an example of great customer service, but the absence of great customer service is not the same as terrible customer service. I still contend that it was a perfectly reasonable decision.

If a small business trying to sustain itself is really such an alien concept that absolutely nobody can empathize, then perhaps we'd all better get used to playing on our kitchen tables. Personally, I can't conceive how merely declining a return qualifies as treating a customer like "garbage."

I think the moral of this story is that Warhammer is dying ...

I know several (including myself) that have left because of GW's rediculousness. Plus X-Wing is soooo much better.

Quick update:

Like I said before I know these guys at the store and the manager in particular really well.

I called him back just a few seconds ago and pretty much gave him an out; I said "hey ______ this is _____, remember when I asked you about the Knight yesterday, maybe you were really busy and got distracted but I wanted to clarify; I want to exchange it for some Xwing stuff. Brand new unopened, just purchased 3 days ago?" His answer was priceless "your bud bought it here, dude of course you know I'll take care of you". Maybe I'm nuts or there really was a miscommunication... that or someone at the store is an X-Wing forum fan lol.

Thanks for all the support guys!

I am really glad you posted this; and i highlighted the key part. So much of our interactions may seem clear to us, yet language is fickle and people are actually good at the core; no one actively likes to be mean or rude to another person. And it would have been really easy to just make the exchange and never update this thread with your results, but doing so shows again that there are often amicable outcomes for our bad situations. Stuff like this is what keeps me coming back to this community.

Bad business decisions can go both ways, all we're debating about now is who deserved to be saddled with the burden more. The store owner made a mistake (purchasing four of whatever), and he has to live with it. Fine, that's fair. The customer purchased the right product, but then changed his mind and also had to live with his mistake, if only temporarily. I think that's also fair. Why should the product have to be devalued to not warrant a return? I take the opposite stance; a good faith transaction was conducted, and the customer received exactly what he paid for. If the product was in any way misrepresented I might possibly agree with you... but it wasn't. The store owner changing his mind about the refund is an example of great customer service, but the absence of great customer service is not the same as terrible customer service. I still contend that it was a perfectly reasonable decision.

If a small business trying to sustain itself is really such an alien concept that absolutely nobody can empathize, then perhaps we'd all better get used to playing on our kitchen tables. Personally, I can't conceive how merely declining a return qualifies as treating a customer like "garbage."

I would think going into business in an environment where fickle decisions are commonplace you would consider this ahead of time and know that it is inevitable. That is the risk of the business owner.

What you say is absolutely right about it not being great or bad customer service, but I think a lot of us are at a different spot on the spectrum. We think accepting the exchange of a new unused, unopened product purchased three days prior for something else at the same store as "standard," and refusal "bad." We're just trying to be nice by saying "that's great of him to accept it, what a swell guy."

Additionally, if this brings up an inconsistent return/exchange policy depending on the product then there are issues at management that should be addressed with clear policies and standards.

I think the moral of this story is that Warhammer is dying ...

I know several (including myself) that have left because of GW's rediculousness. Plus X-Wing is soooo much better.

Heh, I wish I don't think it's going anywhere soon though. Personally, I left Warhammer 40k back in 2000-ish because I realized what business model I had fallen victim to. But GW markets to the young, mallable and naïve. There's always fresh 12-to-16-year-olds that enter a GW store and fall deeply in love with the wonderful paintjobs and the epic struggles that are being displayed.

For all those people saying that a store owner would be crazy not to bend over backwards like a big-box store, let's see you go run a small business. Some choices aren't as easy as you think.

I don't see accepting an unopened, undamaged, 3 day old product as bending over backwards. If it was opened, played with and damaged and then asked to take it, I would see that as bending over backwards. Even just being opened I can see as a problem and a tough choice. I see this as accepting that a valued customer made a simple mistake in gift choices and helping correct the mistake at no actual cost to himself.

No, I don't know how hard it is being a small business, but if this was somehow a hard decision for them to make, I can see why so many are going out of business.

You're right, the store has no legal obligation to help fulfill this customer's wishes. The customer also has no legal obligation not to take his money elsewhere.

I thought that we were past this point, so I'll refer you to one of my previous posts where I discussed how small businesses have a harder time moving high dollar product than do those that deal in high volume. That is the cost, and it's not an insignificant one. People should try to have a little empathy before being so callous about where they take their business.

Can anyone give me an estimate on how popular the Imperial Knights are, and how frequently those $140 models get purchased? I'm genuinely curious.

I saw the post. If that product is that hard to move, he shouldn't stock it (special order exist for a reason), certainly shouldn't stock 4 of them. That's a bad business decision, like not accepting a pristine return. Really, I sense a pattern.

I'm trying to have empathy. If the product was in any way devalued I might possibly agree with you. In this case the owner is gambling with future sales to make sure the product stays sold. That's a terrible gamble. I believe the old phrase is "Penny-wise and pound foolish". Frankly he lucked out and the guy tried a second time.

If you run your shop under the notion that the customer has to be a small business owner to understand and empathize with a position that would be bizarre to the outside world, you probably aren't going to last. Some big box electronic stores treat their customers like garbage and are paying the price. Circuit City is already gone, Best Buy isn't too far behind. Dell use to be the PC leader, then shipped all of it's tech support overseas to save money, now it's had to buyback it's own stock to try and fix things. It's not just mom and pop shops that have to worry, customer care is important no matter who you are.

Remember, GW might have forced the store to stock those Knights. GW does this.

Bad business decisions can go both ways, all we're debating about now is who deserved to be saddled with the burden more. The store owner made a mistake (purchasing four of whatever), and he has to live with it. Fine, that's fair. The customer purchased the right product, but then changed his mind and also had to live with his mistake, if only temporarily. I think that's also fair. Why should the product have to be devalued to not warrant a return? I take the opposite stance; a good faith transaction was conducted, and the customer received exactly what he paid for. If the product was in any way misrepresented I might possibly agree with you... but it wasn't. The store owner changing his mind about the refund is an example of great customer service, but the absence of great customer service is not the same as terrible customer service. I still contend that it was a perfectly reasonable decision.

If a small business trying to sustain itself is really such an alien concept that absolutely nobody can empathize, then perhaps we'd all better get used to playing on our kitchen tables. Personally, I can't conceive how merely declining a return qualifies as treating a customer like "garbage."

I would think going into business in an environment where fickle decisions are commonplace you would consider this ahead of time and know that it is inevitable. That is the risk of the business owner.

What you say is absolutely right about it not being great or bad customer service, but I think a lot of us are at a different spot on the spectrum. We think accepting the exchange of a new unused, unopened product purchased three days prior for something else at the same store as "standard," and refusal "bad." We're just trying to be nice by saying "that's great of him to accept it, what a swell guy."

Additionally, if this brings up an inconsistent return/exchange policy depending on the product then there are issues at management that should be addressed with clear policies and standards.

I disagree. I believe it is bad customer service. I don't patronize stores with no return policies. There are stores that I feel value me as a customer more than one sale and I will take my business to them.

Miniature Market didn't pack my cr90 well enough when shipping and was just lucky the actual model wasn't damaged, so I took my wave 4 purchase to CSI. It's business. Maybe I'm not worth it as a customer.

Lol, I think WAAAAAH is talking about the Star Wars Corellian Corvette, not the car...

I guess I thought "car" because the comparison was being made to things outside of X-Wing. The CR-90 is certainly a question mark when it would come to ordering for a FLGS. It's nice a big so it can bring attention to a display but it's price point is FAR higher than anything else in X-Wing. On top of that it really has limited utility in the game and I'm really hard pressed to come up with a reason for ever wanting more than one.

Now I'm not entirely sure how that Imperial Knight stacks up when it comes to Warhammer costs but it's more that I'd want to pay for a mini.

Bad business decisions can go both ways, all we're debating about now is who deserved to be saddled with the burden more. The store owner made a mistake (purchasing four of whatever), and he has to live with it. Fine, that's fair. The customer purchased the right product, but then changed his mind and also had to live with his mistake, if only temporarily. I think that's also fair. Why should the product have to be devalued to not warrant a return? I take the opposite stance; a good faith transaction was conducted, and the customer received exactly what he paid for. If the product was in any way misrepresented I might possibly agree with you... but it wasn't. The store owner changing his mind about the refund is an example of great customer service, but the absence of great customer service is not the same as terrible customer service. I still contend that it was a perfectly reasonable decision.

If a small business trying to sustain itself is really such an alien concept that absolutely nobody can empathize, then perhaps we'd all better get used to playing on our kitchen tables. Personally, I can't conceive how merely declining a return qualifies as treating a customer like "garbage."

Hm, am I right in surmising that this is striking somewhat of a nerve with you? I'm not saying that you're behaving in any way that's unreasonable, but I am sensing a bit of a paradox in your argument. I can totally see your point from the narrow point of view of the seller. It is hard for people to make a buck in this business, and if they got into it because of their love of games, they probably made a big mistake (one that I also contemplated making when I was 19). And then there are the online retailers who are undercutting these poor souls on the bottom line instincts of the customers.

Also, I can fathom the economist's assumption that all actors in the transaction should be rational and come to a good faith agreement, and stick to it. Customers should behave better, and - morally - they should take the lumps for their bad decisions. (I'm not saying that in this particular case the OP made a bad decision; he was not the one who made the purchase.) For that reason, I really hate returning product that I bought.

But, the fact of the matter is that customers aren't rational, and the balance of market forces that put the customer in charge means that they don't have to be rational or eat their own mistakes. The norms of business practices have solidified around that reality, and in this case the seller (again, I believe through honest misunderstanding) transgressed the norm. You can rail against those norms, but you might as well tilt and windmills.

Now, I do think that gamer-customers have a moral responsibility to help those poor souls who have gone into the gaming retail business, if it remains the case that those customers frequent the FLGSs in order to play their games. I think it's better for gaming society (and, actually, society at large) for that gaming-table interaction to be there at the FLGS (see Robert Putnam's Bowling Alone if you are interested in my reasoning on this issue). I think that the FLGS provides a public good, for which they aren't recognized or sufficiently rewarded.

I still don't understand the argument. Is simple, i have had to make returns to silly customers. I do it because

A - I know they are still spending that money in my shop.

B - I want them to spend more money in my shop in the future.

How small my shop is, will actually enforce me to execute this kind of "family" decissions in order to build loyalty between my customers, because that's the only thing i can do to compete with any kind of behemoth. Yes, i can get pissed off for a silly customer, but i am a business man first when i am at work, and the correct decission wasn't "i don't return it", but the oppossite.

I don't think anyone in this thread can't understand the point of view on the seller, only that it is still silly and a poor decission overall.

The bottom line, as far as I'm concerned, is which side do you favor the most? Yours, or the store's?

On the one hand, it's your or your friend's money that is being spent, and you should expect to get what you want or need to complete your army/fleet. Economic considerations are some of the most important in our lives, and we can't all afford to let something go, especially when that something revolves around a purchase of $140.

On the other hand, as has been mentioned, the store often is on the brink financially, and they can't really afford to stock things that won't sell. Stewart from The Big Bang Theory is sort of an extreme case, but if you really listen to his rants you'll understand a lot about how game and comic book stores function. They are usually barely afloat, and what we end up paying for in the long run is a place to hang out and play our games.

It's a difficult decision, though I usually side with the store because I don't want to lose them. Brick and mortar stores suffer badly because of the internet, unless they're a store like HobbyTownUSA or a GW store, which is mostly supported by a company and not its income. So I'd rather take a hit for them and keep my favorite hangouts than adopt a selfish "me or them" attitude.

What I don't understand is if it is an exchange then you get a product back but then sell equivalent value of another item. Their is not loss for the store to do this as they will still get the profit from the second sale.

The only thing in question would be if the item returned was not sellable (opened packaging or something similar) then the OP's store owner's stance would make sense.

You could just say to him "Oh ok, so I should instruct my friends and family to NOT purchase gifts for me from THIS store again, since there is no return policy, right?"

Is this still a problem? The OP stated the store returned the item for credit. The guy said so himself it was a miscommunication! Thread killer in my mind since the whole purpose for venting was squashed.

I get the more philosophic conversation on being a small business owner and the rights of the customer vs. the rights of the owner... But I'm just failing to see much sympathy on either parties' side. You're telling me You can't, as a customer, sympathize with small business owners?! Then why do you shop FLGS and not online?! And the side of the business owner should, if he wants to keep returning customers return the item. WHICH IS WHAT HE DID... Sooooooo issue resolved?

The issue is resolved, and yes most all stores will accept a return, especially for store credit to put towards other items in store. Same is same and the store is still getting the money. That said, I think it is something done in poor taste to trade in a gift if it is usable in the first place. If it is entirely the wrong thing, fair enough, but just because you don't like it as much as something else, not something I would do personally. It was a pretty epic present given. So that is what urks me of the story. Though I know plenty do a lot of gift returns ( Just look at the days after Christmas ) I still think unless its completely off base that's a bit eh to do. Yet again, personal opinion on that.

As for the store owner, I can see the store owners side and the customers side. I would have to say I'd side with the store owner more then the customer simply by fact of it being a gift and not something he bought and then decided to not use. Threatening leaving a place that has been there for you for who knows how long from one transgression is a bit lame as well. How much loyalty has the store earned at the end of the day if he can make one choice you would disagree with and then say " See ya ! ". Just doesn't strike me the right way, though I'm big on loyalty and personal honor. The store is someone's life and they work very hard to keep it afloat, most often for love of the games or the environment or even the customers and their various groups. It's often a thankless and difficult job to do with the net and the out of the world discounts online retailers can give over your FLGS.

That said at my own, the owner is a friend, and a great guy. He gives amazing discounts to valued customers, those that can rival online retailers by a lot. He does such not because he has to, but because he cultivates that loyalty and customer support. So I end up getting relatively little off line to show my own support for such treatment and get probably more then the I should when there. However how much is a community your a part of worth ? Or the place you play and the friends you made while there ? I realize not every game store is like a family, but they can be, almost as community center of sorts.

I did get off topic somewhat, I am just saying going off half cocked because of one perceived slight is a bit childish, especially if it is a place you consider your FLGS. They offer something good for those who support them and use their store to cultivate their past times and community growth. Keep that in mind during these types of misunderstandings and realize most often their is a way to see eye to eye, they are people just like you, and they may even be your friends as well.

Much like this tale, threatening to never return to the store because of a misunderstanding, only to calm down, ask again and find the situation was fine. I hope the OP felt a bit like a heel getting all worked up over it before being sure.

Just my thoughts and I am sure they won't be universally embraced but that's what they are.

As well, I am pleased the situation was handled and all was resolved well.

What I don't understand is if it is an exchange then you get a product back but then sell equivalent value of another item. Their is not loss for the store to do this as they will still get the profit from the second sale.

The only thing in question would be if the item returned was not sellable (opened packaging or something similar) then the OP's store owner's stance would make sense.

Well it could be a case of the the item being traded in never selling and the item being traded for selling regardless. In this case it is a loss for the store.

I would thank my friend for the gift and enjoy it. Never would dream of trying to exchange it.